I'm Just Curious..., How Many Here Own a Fractal, and Who Doesn't?

[KHAAAAAAANNNNNNN!!!!!!!!]

Not me, Im too primitive …. still dragging amp/cabs around

 

[unix-guy]

Oh yeah, that's a major consideration as well. I bought my FM3 while living in the US; the same unit is ~35% more expensive here in Europe

Well, you've got VAT and you get a 3 year transferable warranty...

And your distributor has to make a few bones.

We get 1 warranty year and not transferable.

 

[megametal7]

View attachment 14723

swap strat for V and yea thats me lmfao

 

[Sascha Franck]

These chocolates they put on the box must contain some expensive drug

Yeah.
There's used turtle FM3s on eBay classifieds costing more than a new turbo overseas, go figure.
And no, that miserable situation can't be justified by taxes and customs, it's all because G66 are a bunch of greedy b@st@rds. But then, business as usual, pretty much all distributors dealing with more or less exclusive things from overseas are adding a premium going into their own pockets.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Well, you've got VAT and you get a 3 year transferable warranty...

Seriously, all that still isn't justified. The differences are just absurd.

 

[laxu]

Yeah.
There's used turtle FM3s on eBay classifieds costing more than a new turbo overseas, go figure.
And no, that miserable situation can't be justified by taxes and customs, it's all because G66 are a bunch of greedy b@st@rds. But then, business as usual, pretty much all distributors dealing with more or less exclusive things from overseas are adding a premium going into their own pockets.

You do get longer warranty vs US but I agree, the Fractal prices have become very steep in Europe compared to the competition. Using Thomann prices with Finnish 24% VAT, a FM9 Turbo from G66 is:

• 662 € more than a Tone Master Pro.
• 697 € more than a Quad Cortex.
• 805 € more than a Line6 Helix Floor.
• 951 € more than a Kemper Stage. Interestingly Kemper Stage has gone down in price quite a bit recently!

And that doesn't even include shipping which would add more disparity as Thomann shipping is free above a certain value.

To me the longer warranty doesn't have a whole lot of value because Fractals are such robust units that the only thing that has needed replacement on all the ones I've owned has been the fan which is the only moving component.

As much as I dig what Fractal does and how their gear sounds, it's definitely harder to recommend them in EU just due to that much higher cost. In the US, Fractal is a no-brainer option.

 

[Lysander]

Well, you've got VAT and you get a 3 year transferable warranty...

And your distributor has to make a few bones.

We get 1 warranty year and not transferable.

Shockingly, competing brands manage to do all of the above without the steep overprice.

 

[Sascha Franck]

In the US, Fractal is a no-brainer option.

Not sure whether it's necessarily a no-brainer, but it's at least within the competition range and not something completely esoteric. Which it actually is over here. I know quite a plenty of folks in the "silent stage business" (musicals, other theatre gigs, other corporate gigs, etc.). And I don't know of one person using an FAS product. The only two persons I personally know owning an Axe FX III are a lawyer (I'm not kidding you...) and a former student of mine, a pretty well doing very high profile trade union guy (who at least was nice enough to leave the device to me for a week when he wasn't in town). The professional folks are mostly into Kempers, partially into Helixes and to an astonishingly high percentage into Quad Cortexes. And then there's a bunch of pedalboard folks using one of the smaller modelers as a replacement for their pedal platform amps.
But FAS? Pretty much not happening in my neck of the woods.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Amazingly enough, G66 are sitting in my former home town (Flensburg, northest town in Germany, my parent's are still living there). I already thought about paying them a visit, but oh well, I might not deliver the best impression, so there...

 

[laxu]

Not sure whether it's necessarily a no-brainer, but it's at least within the competition range and not something completely esoteric. Which it actually is over here. I know quite a plenty of folks in the "silent stage business" (musicals, other theatre gigs, other corporate gigs, etc.). And I don't know of one person using an FAS product. The only two persons I personally know owning an Axe FX III are a lawyer (I'm not kidding you...) and a former student of mine, a pretty well doing very high profile trade union guy (who at least was nice enough to leave the device to me for a week when he wasn't in town). The professional folks are mostly into Kempers, partially into Helixes and to an astonishingly high percentage into Quad Cortexes. And then there's a bunch of pedalboard folks using one of the smaller modelers as a replacement for their pedal platform amps.
But FAS? Pretty much not happening in my neck of the woods.

It might be as simple as just not knowing about them. NeuralDSP advertises heavily on FB and Instagram, and you can buy one from major vendors. Kemper and Line6 are pretty established already.

If their gear fails on the road, knowing you can buy another one from a major vendor, or globally, can factor in on the purchase too. Fractal is the only one who is not selling through e.g Sweetwater, Thomann etc.

On top of that Fractal is more often out of stock so just getting one in the first place can be more challenging. In EU it's always something like a 3-6 month wait when Fractal announces a new product and it becomes available in the US.

 

[Sascha Franck]

It might be as simple as just not knowing about them.

Well, at least the folks I personally know are pretty much aware of FAS and their modeling quality.
And well, it's not all about the price, it's also that most of these folks are sort of like me, as in they sometimes need to be able to quickly adjust a bunch of patches to accomodate a certain situation (especially during rehearsals or sort of spontaneous gigs). All the others are suited better for that kinda task - at least without having to tinker around too much.

If their gear fails on the road, knowing you can buy another one from a major vendor, or globally, can factor in on the purchase too. Fractal is the only one who is not selling through e.g Sweetwater, Thomann etc.

Yeah, that's another thing. Add to this that you can order, say, a Kemper (plus controller or as a Kemper Stage) through pretty much any decent backline rental service these days. So you just grab your gigbags and a USB stick and are ready to roll pretty much anywhere. A rather good mate of mine did just that - and he isn't even owning a Kemper, but borrowed one because he knew that on the chinese gig he had coming up there'd be one. So he slapped some patches together on the borrowed one and just saved them onto his USB sticks. Went all great.

 

[State of Epicicity]

they sometimes need to be able to quickly adjust a bunch of patches to accomodate a certain situation (especially during rehearsals or sort of spontaneous gigs). All the others are suited better for that kinda task - at least without having to tinker around too much.

I have an Axe-FX III, and to me it's lightening quick to make adjustments and save a new patch using only the front panel. I think it just takes familiarity.

 

[Sascha Franck]

I have an Axe-FX III, and to me it's lightening quick to make adjustments and save a new patch using only the front panel. I think it just takes familiarity.

I guess it could be pretty much scientifically proven that any such operations are done quicker (as in simply requiring less steps) on other units, though.

 

[Piing]

I have an Axe-FX III, and to me it's lightening quick to make adjustments and save a new patch using only the front panel. I think it just takes familiarity.

Having been dealing with Eventide rack units, Fractal Audio devices are a piece of cake. Intuitive and fast.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Having been dealing with Eventide rack units, Fractal Audio devices are a piece of cake. Intuitive and fast.

Well, I have as well been dealing with tons of oldschool digital devices (GP-8 anyone? Scroll-select, tap-tap-tap, scroll-select, and so on...). Doesn't mean I wish to be back in those times. I mean, I'm not riding a horse for 2 days to get to the next gig anymore, either.

 

[laxu]

I guess it could be pretty much scientifically proven that any such operations are done quicker (as in simply requiring less steps) on other units, though.

This is my experience. Helix's capacitive footswitches let you go to a specific block really fast, while on the QC you can just tap the block on screen.

On Fractal it can be "did I doubleclick the knob right?" or "how many times do I need to punch Edit?" type things. While the Perform view where you can assign a small number of parameters from any block is a good feature, it's too limited IMO and requires you to make more deliberate choices than I'd like. Doubling or tripling the number of mappable parameters was requested pretty much when the feature released.

 

[Sascha Franck]

This is my experience. Helix's capacitive footswitches let you go to a specific block really fast, while on the QC you can just tap the block on screen.

Exactly. Well ok, the Helix actually could've been way more elegant in offering an additional "just for edits" switch mode, so you wouldn't have to permanently think about "switch switches vs. selecting switches", but it's defenitely not too shabby as is, either (especially as there's always the "amp home" button). I typically used to use the 4stomps/4snaps mode for gigging (why in the world has there never been a 5/5 mode when there's a 10stomp mode?), snapshots to select way different things and stomps to kinda slightly modify things. Switching to 10stomp mode then allowed me to have 6 extra stomps that I would only use to slap the most important things on that I'd typically edit. Worked pretty well. Obviously, with a touch screen, this is one of the relevant situations when it might be worth having one.

 

[laxu]

Exactly. Well ok, the Helix actually could've been way more elegant in offering an additional "just for edits" switch mode, so you wouldn't have to permanently think about "switch switches vs. selecting switches", but it's defenitely not too shabby as is, either (especially as there's always the "amp home" button). I typically used to use the 4stomps/4snaps mode for gigging (why in the world has there never been a 5/5 mode when there's a 10stomp mode?), snapshots to select way different things and stomps to kinda slightly modify things. Switching to 10stomp mode then allowed me to have 6 extra stomps that I would only use to slap the most important things on that I'd typically edit. Worked pretty well. Obviously, with a touch screen, this is one of the relevant situations when it might be worth having one.

Yeah I think the Helix makes the most out of its design limitations. Man, I wish they had launched it with a touchscreen. I think the current modeler market might look a bit different if that had happened.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Man, I wish they had launched it with a touchscreen.

Actually not sure about that. I think a touchscreen isn't something you want to have on a stage floor, at least I don't. I'd vastly prefered a wireless mobile platform editor.

 

[State of Epicicity]

I guess it could be pretty much scientifically proven that any such operations are done quicker (as in simply requiring less steps) on other units, though.

I change both basic and advanced parameters in a few seconds from the front panel. It's really quick, and you only have to read a tiny bit of the manual to understand how it's structured and how to navigate it.