Fender Tone Master Pro: Episode IV - A New Hope

[molul]

New devices must arrive sooner or later, but I don't expect any big new features. Just more DSP power and better UIs.

 

[the swede]

New devices must arrive sooner or later, but I don't expect any big new features. Just more DSP power and better UIs.

i find the UI design of TMP and QC to be quite innovative in a sense of modernization and looks. To use switches as knobs and minimize the amount of encoders to max two is pretty darn nifty. Whether we actually like it, think it's better or not from a practical standpoint is another question. Headrush applied this early on and even without the extra luxury of switch-knobs I found both GB and MX5 to be a joy to use UI wise. I imagine QC and TMP is "fun" to use.

Stomp is what I'm most used to. It's not really "fun" and enjoyable, manageable but easier to just use HX Edit. Can't image a Stomp update within the same size having a "better" UI. Flagship "Helix" though, could basically see a lot of changes. I wonder if the heads above the teams will enforce touch, just because. It would be interesting to see the current Helix UI in touch form with big sexy OLED screen. Sliders maybe even makes more sense in that case!

 

[laxu]

i find the UI design of TMP and QC to be quite innovative in a sense of modernization and looks. To use switches as knobs and minimize the amount of encoders to max two is pretty darn nifty. Whether we actually like it, think it's better or not from a practical standpoint is another question. Headrush applied this early on and even without the extra luxury of switch-knobs I found both GB and MX5 to be a joy to use UI wise. I imagine QC and TMP is "fun" to use.

Stomp is what I'm most used to. It's not really "fun" and enjoyable, manageable but easier to just use HX Edit. Can't image a Stomp update within the same size having a "better" UI. Flagship "Helix" though, could basically see a lot of changes. I wonder if the heads above the teams will enforce touch, just because. It would be interesting to see the current Helix UI in touch form with big sexy OLED screen. Sliders maybe even makes more sense in that case!

To me the HX Stomp's main failing is its tiny screen and only 3 encoders. Helix Floor vs QC doesn't amount to that big of a difference, as the capacitive footswitches make up for needing to move the cursor around to select blocks and 6 parameters at once is far easier to work with.

Even the Boss GT-1000 Core is better because it has the "show all block parameters as a table" function accessible by holding one of the knobs if I remember correctly. This gives you a good overview of the parameters and makes it feel like operating one view instead of flicking between different views by paging. 5 encoders instead of 3 makes a big difference too.

3 encoders is a pet peeve of mine. It's never enough for comfortable parameter editing. Even 4 would help a lot, 5-6 is way better already.

 

[GTR37]

To me the HX Stomp's main failing is its tiny screen and only 3 encoders. Helix Floor vs QC doesn't amount to that big of a difference, as the capacitive footswitches make up for needing to move the cursor around to select blocks and 6 parameters at once is far easier to work with.

Even the Boss GT-1000 Core is better because it has the "show all block parameters as a table" function accessible by holding one of the knobs if I remember correctly. This gives you a good overview of the parameters and makes it feel like operating one view instead of flicking between different views by paging. 5 encoders instead of 3 makes a big difference too.

3 encoders is a pet peeve of mine. It's never enough for comfortable parameter editing. Even 4 would help a lot, 5-6 is way better already.

It a battle because you have people always wanting smaller more compact and touchscreens and all the stuff but you only have so much space
The Headrush is probably the best or one of the best out there for UI and implementation of the screen IMO especially in the larger one Gigboard

I agree on the encoders 5 should be min 6or 8 would be optimal
And screen size if you are going touch I feel QC / HR at
7 or 8 is a good size
But then your back to likely compromising the things people like about the Stomp
The size

 

[JCW308]

It a battle because you have people always wanting smaller more compact and touchscreens and all the stuff but you only have so much space
The Headrush is probably the best or one of the best out there for UI and implementation of the screen IMO especially in the larger one Gigboard

I agree on the encoders 5 should be min 6or 8 would be optimal
And screen size if you are going touch I feel QC / HR at
7 or 8 is a good size
But then your back to likely compromising the things people like about the Stomp
The size

HR operating system is awesome. I wish they would update their core sound engine though. It's dreadful. The OS deserves better.

 

[laxu]

And screen size if you are going touch I feel QC / HR at
7 or 8 is a good size
But then your back to likely compromising the things people like about the Stomp
The size

I don't think you need that large necessarily. I'm happily using the 3.5" touchscreen on my Luminite Graviton M1. It's all about how it's designed to work. To be fair on the Luminite you aren't editing parameter values most of the time.

So just 1.1" larger screen than the HX Stomp can already be pretty touch friendly. The Ampero II Stomp seems to be 4.3", so I think somewhere between 4-6" would work very well for a compact unit. I'd still want more than 3 encoders the Ampero has tho!

 

[ChordInversion]

New devices must arrive sooner or later, but I don't expect any big new features. Just more DSP power and better UIs.

And any additional DSP power is only a need for a subset of users, generally folks who want a lot of simultaneous amps and effects.

 

[molul]

And any additional DSP power is only a need for a subset of users, generally folks who want a lot of simultaneous amps and effects.

Totally. Although latest additions like the poly pitch or the feedbacker take a lot of DSP to the point that you can't use much more effects having 8 slots.

 

[ChordInversion]

Totally. Although latest additions like the poly pitch or the feedbacker take a lot of DSP to the point that you can't use much more effects having 8 slots.

Yeah, that's definitely true. I am not a user of those effects, but there's definitely room for more power for more effects.

 

[timbuck3]

What are the factors/specs you are considering to wait for. Fractal and Helix current gen is high tier gear pretty much perfect as is, but will continue to evolve through updates.

So I’m curious and honest in my question because it’s interesting. :)

Nothing is saying there will be new flagship modelers in -25. You simply don’t know that. And people have been saying that since 2019, then paused saying that during 21,22 and then people started saying things like that 23, 24 again. The knock (several ones, shit that happened in the world) on the companies has done more damage than we probably know.


Personally I’m thinking that current gen to next gen modelers will se very minor improvements regarding the accuracy parts and I’m leaving profiling out as I’m not interested in that. Component modeling may be “perfected” but I doubt we’ll see a huge jump there, because it is what it is and both fractal and Line 6 pretty much has made component modeling as good as it can get (from my understanding). So there will certainly be more power, size changes, hardware I/O changes and stuff. Maybe L6 give in and make a touchscreen or maybe not.
Who knows.

My point is that playing guitar and hearing the sound is still the essence no matter how a modeler is made.

It’s like with smartphones and laptops. I always stay 2 gen behind there because of economy and they do the exact same important thing as next gen.

With modelers is safe to say that current gen is pretty much a safe place to be and next gen is pretty much an unnecessary wait if one wants to play guitar.

I do get your point, if what you have is good for you there’s no point buying anything.

Well I used to buy new gear constantly every iteration released and chased new stuff. I grew tired of spending so much on gear in modeling and in synths.
So at the point I am now late to the game buying the newest flagship so to say… I feel on the cusp at helix is what 9 yrs old… we isn’t what’s been promised for years now.. bluampx is too much $ for a product too late to the game if it even is released 2024 yet? …fractal seems to release new gens sooner then line6 and likely are going to drop mk4 soon so would rather wait on it and same with the line6 flagship likely coming 2025… boss? Not my thing… Vox? Love the old tech but not impressed with their direction since the ad120vtx series…too bad as they were ahead of the pack with the valve reactor stuff…
So yea I could get the fm9 now but since no need as I have stuff I like I will just see.
The fender I tested before the big update recent and wasn’t wowed…too much wasted real estate in the screen and don’t trust fender. Headrush? Had the mx4 but sold as I think the company buys old stuff and rebrands it and doesn’t really advance their tones and effects in house and it shows .. I trust cliff and fractal to forge ahead as a company. The more and like stuff may be budget friendly and ok but throw your money at a few of those and it adds up to a better flagship.
So I get flamed a lot for not buyin shit but I guess am just more conservative with my money lately.

 

[timbuck3]

New devices must arrive sooner or later, but I don't expect any big new features. Just more DSP power and better UIs.

And that’s enough of a reason to wait

 

[timbuck3]

And any additional DSP power is only a need for a subset of users, generally folks who want a lot of simultaneous amps and effects.

Which opens up a lot of cool possibilities so why not use it

 

[ChordInversion]

Which opens up a lot of cool possibilities so why not use it

If you're asking about why not make future products, I agree. If you're asking why every player doesn't use them, it would be because if I'm playing surf twang, I need a clean tone with reverb and that's it. My real point was to say that additional processing power is not going to be needed in order to make amp sounds themselves better.

 

[MindCrime]

Well I used to buy new gear constantly every iteration released and chased new stuff. I grew tired of spending so much on gear in modeling and in synths.
So at the point I am now late to the game buying the newest flagship so to say… I feel on the cusp at helix is what 9 yrs old… we isn’t what’s been promised for years now.. bluampx is too much $ for a product too late to the game if it even is released 2024 yet? …fractal seems to release new gens sooner then line6 and likely are going to drop mk4 soon so would rather wait on it and same with the line6 flagship likely coming 2025… boss? Not my thing… Vox? Love the old tech but not impressed with their direction since the ad120vtx series…too bad as they were ahead of the pack with the valve reactor stuff…
So yea I could get the fm9 now but since no need as I have stuff I like I will just see.
The fender I tested before the big update recent and wasn’t wowed…too much wasted real estate in the screen and don’t trust fender. Headrush? Had the mx4 but sold as I think the company buys old stuff and rebrands it and doesn’t really advance their tones and effects in house and it shows .. I trust cliff and fractal to forge ahead as a company. The more and like stuff may be budget friendly and ok but throw your money at a few of those and it adds up to a better flagship.
So I get flamed a lot for not buyin shit but I guess am just more conservative with my money lately.

But yet you have 30 guitars and you said " my needs are pretty minimal as dont gig or do covers ".
If your needs are minimal, I would guess a Hotone Ampero or a Headrush would be plenty.
Maybe the Boss ME90. As for Fender...they've got some really deep pockets and the TMP is less than a year old. They're just getting started...

 

[timbuck3]

If you're asking about why not make future products, I agree. If you're asking why every player doesn't use them, it would be because if I'm playing surf twang, I need a clean tone with reverb and that's it. My real point was to say that additional processing power is not going to be needed in order to make amp sounds themselves better.

Well if I had your dilema I would just use a clean tube amp

 

[timbuck3]

But yet you have 30 guitars and you said " my needs are pretty minimal as dont gig or do covers ".
If your needs are minimal, I would guess a Hotone Ampero or a Headrush would be plenty.
Maybe the Boss ME90. As for Fender...they've got some really deep pockets and the TMP is less than a year old. They're just getting started...

Guitars are another ballgame to me.. these guitars I have collected over the 40 yrs I have been playing… and at one point there were close to maybe 65 … I have scaled back in the past years and I hardly buy guitars anymore.. but I did buy a prs ce24 satin turquoise that’s was a good deal but that’s rare for me cause yea I have enough

 

[ChordInversion]

Well if I had your dilema I would just use a clean tube amp

It's not "my dilemma" in the sense that it's not the only thing that I personally do. I was simply providing an example using "if I'm" as a rhetorical device.

I mean, I do play some surf twang, and I love playing it through headphones at all hours and recording it direct. But it's not all I do. The rest of what I do likewise makes use of effects, but very few at any given time. I simply don't feel limited by processing power for additional effects, though I totally understand that's not true for others.

 

[Thrifty]

I tried the TMP at the store when I was buying my QC. It is an interesting product, but it was a bit bigger than I would have liked and I found navigation wasn’t as intuitive as I would have liked. The models were good imho, nothing I would be afraid to gig with.

 

[timbuck3]

What are the factors/specs you are considering to wait for. Fractal and Helix current gen is high tier gear pretty much perfect as is, but will continue to evolve through updates.

So I’m curious and honest in my question because it’s interesting. :)

Nothing is saying there will be new flagship modelers in -25. You simply don’t know that. And people have been saying that since 2019, then paused saying that during 21,22 and then people started saying things like that 23, 24 again. The knock (several ones, shit that happened in the world) on the companies has done more damage than we probably know.


Personally I’m thinking that current gen to next gen modelers will se very minor improvements regarding the accuracy parts and I’m leaving profiling out as I’m not interested in that. Component modeling may be “perfected” but I doubt we’ll see a huge jump there, because it is what it is and both fractal and Line 6 pretty much has made component modeling as good as it can get (from my understanding). So there will certainly be more power, size changes, hardware I/O changes and stuff. Maybe L6 give in and make a touchscreen or maybe not.
Who knows.

My point is that playing guitar and hearing the sound is still the essence no matter how a modeler is made.

It’s like with smartphones and laptops. I always stay 2 gen behind there because of economy and they do the exact same important thing as next gen.

With modelers is safe to say that current gen is pretty much a safe place to be and next gen is pretty much an unnecessary wait if one wants to play guitar.

I do get your point, if what you have is good for you there’s no point buying anything.

Like I said when it hits me right I will buy it. Some buy hyandai and love them and to others it’s just not right… not everyone thinks a Porsche 911 is great… or a Tesla… some love Subaru or a Prius. I mean you get what you gel with and what appeals to you with research you do and possible test drives. I will say the latest corvette is a winner from my test drives with mid engine finally and the slick looks but it’s too much car for me and a bit showy and 1 trick piney for me here in Colorado.

 

[the swede]

Like I said when it hits me right I will buy it. Some buy hyandai and love them and to others it’s just not right… not everyone thinks a Porsche 911 is great… or a Tesla… some love Subaru or a Prius. I mean you get what you gel with and what appeals to you with research you do and possible test drives. I will say the latest corvette is a winner from my test drives with mid engine finally and the slick looks but it’s too much car for me and a bit showy and 1 trick piney for me here in Colorado.

Don’t talk cars with me you… you… you American engine fanatic! I’m Swedish damnit. We don’t buy cars for amusement or fun. We only buy a car if it has a full NCAP score in safe and environment test.

Unless we talk enthusiast cars… then we’ll happily import all (literally all there is) American cars from 1930-1970, and make our government agree to a deal that all cars older than 30 years should be free of car taxes because it’s an enthusiast hobby to own a American car and it doesn’t really impact the environment driving that around all summer with lead additive gas.

Sorry rant over. Back to modelers…