Fractal Talk

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(kidding, love you @la szum

 

[KHAAAAAAANNNNNNN!!!!!!!!]

Other than a handful of gatekeepers over there who have no authority, but feel they need to protect Fractal Audio against even the smallest criticism, I feel it's a pretty friendly, helpful community that are happy to support a product with a designer obsessed with constant improvement.

As with anything, a growing community is going to bring in some dumb asses just because of scale. I remember when TOP was a chill place with lots of legit artists who were all driven away by the signal to noise ratio as the membership grew.

Fuck, a year ago I didn't have anyone on ignore here. But now there are people here who I'd rather take a knee to the scrotum than spend one second of time reading anything they post.

I can't relate to how much concern there is for things posted at other forums. I try to participate in the things that interest me, and throw away the rest. YMMV.

 

[norminal]

It's starting to read like the kids in school whose whole schtick was never to show excitement for anything, and to try to put down anyone lame enough to show it.

On the other hand, I’m willing to bet that if Cliff released a major update to the modeling engine, but secretly didn’t change a single damn thing, there would still be a mob of people over there swinging from his nutsack, proclaiming that it’s an absolute game changer and sounds so much better than the last update.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

it always confused me a bit how people could make such conclusive reviews on new firmware so quickly, given the vast number of amps and ways they can be used. Are they really testing every amp model in any kind of meaningful way?

That’s not to say I’m not thrilled with the number and regularity of the updates, I absolutely love it. Cliff knows what’s up, he doesn’t need bootlickers like me telling him “THIS SOUNDS GREAT MAN”

 

[Achilles]

it always confused me a bit how people could make such conclusive reviews on new firmware so quickly, given the vast number of amps and ways they can be used. Are they really testing every amp model in any kind of meaningful way?

It's the same with folks who buy a new amp and within 2-3 days are calling it the greatest tones they've ever had. Confirmation bias.

I've often wondered about when an update says: 'improved xxx algorithm", how does anyone know what that means and if it translates to tone?
I'd bet in a lot of cases some of these improvements may be about CPU efficiency and have nothing to do with sound at all.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

I've often wondered about when an update says: 'improved xxx algorithm" How does anyone know what that means and if it translates to tone? I'd bet in a lot of cases some of these improvements may be about CPU efficiency and have nothing to do with sound at all

I bet a lot of improvements are only really noticeable under very particular (or even extreme) conditions too. I’m all for the pursuit of getting things perfect, but as things are already so close, it’s largely swapping bugs, adjusting models for more common/requested versions, or incrementally chipping away at modelling accuracy

 

[unix-guy]

or simply switch to a different brand of DSPs or directly to ARM processors. It's happening all over the industry and I don't see the big deal, they are way more powerful, more power efficient and cheaper.

What is simple can take a lot of work. My point was there's options out there not called Sharc+ and the development stack is only getting better.

I'm sure Cliff and company are on top of the available DSP options, what they are capable of and how those resources best fit with the way they need to use them both currently and for future generations.

I seem to recall a post he made about why certain types of processors (possibly ARM, I don't recall) are sub-optimal for use.

 

[djd100]

I'm sure Cliff and company are on top of the available DSP options, what they are capable of and how those resources best fit with the way they need to use them both currently and for future generations.

I seem to recall a post he made about why certain types of processors (possibly ARM, I don't recall) are sub-optimal for use.

Pipeline and Latency I believe?

 

[0XI0]

I am perfectly happy with what i can get now, so we will see how much better it will be with new amp algorithms
that is if i can ever figure out the hard/soft reset

im not ever updating past 25b, b2 locked out excursion/recovery time and he's talking about axing screen Q+Freq too. wtf. I don't think fractal likes people who know to be able to actually cross reference adjustment points and isolate behavioral anomalies. it would be ok if sag and bias x were interlinked with excursion/recovery time like on helix, but they aren't, if u slow down sag to bold (tube) speed, the tubes still clip at the modeled (silicon) speed and the low end is a mess until you slow down excursion time to match up. now u can't do that anymore

 

[norminal]

@FractalAudio tell me you haven’t at least thought about releasing a duplicate update to see how everyone would react?

 

[FractalAudio]

I'm sure Cliff and company are on top of the available DSP options, what they are capable of and how those resources best fit with the way they need to use them both currently and for future generations.

I seem to recall a post he made about why certain types of processors (possibly ARM, I don't recall) are sub-optimal for use.

Yes, ARMs are not "way more powerful". They are generally cheaper and more power efficient. A dedicated DSP will still outperform an ARM by quite a bit for DSP tasks. If they didn't then people wouldn't still be making DSPs.

ARMs are great for low-cost general-purpose computing now that memory has become plentiful and inexpensive.

Now, since ARM cores are small you can throw multiple cores at the problem. The drawback of this approach is that you have to spread the tasks over multiple cores and every time you transfer data between cores you incur latency.

For audio DSP processing with minimum latency you want the fastest single-core processor you can find. TI and Analog Devices make hybrid products with ARM cores and DSP cores on a single chip. We use the Analog Devices products in the FM3 and FM9. The ARM cores handle the UI, MIDI, USB, etc. while the heavy signal processing is handled by the DSP cores.

The Axe-Fx III uses a multi-core TI DSP. At the time this processor was chosen it was the most powerful DSP architecture available. However it is cost-prohibitive for mainstream, cost-sensitive applications like the FM3 and FM9. So we chose Analog Devices SHARC+ SoCs for these products.

 

[Stratzrus]

I remember when TOP was a chill place with lots of legit artists who were all driven away by the signal to noise ratio as the membership grew.

I don’t.
It’s been a laughing stock of the internet for at least a decade.

I do.

I've been a member there since 2006, 18 years now, and it was great back in "the good old days". Knowledgeable people, name artists, and almost no bickering.

Over time it changed and as Khan said, many good people were driven away. I hung in there as long as I could but mostly hang out here now.

I still check in but avoid the bickering and pettiness like the plague.

 

[Orvillain]

I've not actually installed this latest update yet. I flew out to Tokyo pretty much a day after it was released, so didn't get a chance. I'm looking forward to trying it out when I get back. I'm always very happy to see updates.

I saw an FM9 in a shop yesterday (Ishibashi in Shibuya), and it has triggered some GAS for one again!!

 

[Aleksi]

So who here hasn't made the pilgrimage to Tokyo to see a Fractal in Ishibashi?

 

[deadpool_25]

@Orvillain FM9 is the sweet spot imo

 

[Orvillain]

So who here hasn't made the pilgrimage to Tokyo to see a Fractal in Ishibashi?

hahaha! Well... I asked them if they had any left handed PRS or Gibsons.... "gome ne!" was more or less the response.

@Orvillain FM9 is the sweet spot imo

It certainly does appeal as a ... sorry I have to say it, but Helix replacement! I've been using a Helix pretty religiously for effects-only usage since 2016. Recently I put together my GigRig G3 board with Meris pedals, all controlled with midi... but I still love the multi approach.

 

[Stratzrus]

@Orvillain FM9 is the sweet spot imo

It definitely was for me.

At one point I had the III, the FM9 and the FM3. After having the FM9 for a while I eventually sold the FM3 and have been using the FM9 exclusively ever since.

My III and FC-12 are gathering dust. I should probably sell the III but I can't bring myself to do it. My plan is to put the III in my office and use the FM9 in my rehearsal studio but so far am only using the FM9. It's more than enough for my needs and the everything in one box format is all I'd hoped it would be.

 

[laxu]

I saw an FM9 in a shop yesterday (Ishibashi in Shibuya), and it has triggered some GAS for one again!!

I saw Fractal available in surprisingly many stores in Tokyo and Osaka, though FM9s were few.

The cool thing was seeing all the major modelers in one place, like you could literally try them all and pick your favorite.

 

[Rock Chalk]

I’m so glad that Cliff doesn’t do the helix thing and only put out 2-3 updates a year. Getting updates at a quicker pace really keeps things interesting ……I mean you get to see people wigging out about the updates on the Fractal Forum, and you get to see other people here, wigging out about the people wigging out there…….

 

[GTR37]

I’m so glad that Cliff doesn’t do the helix thing and only put out 2-3 updates a year. Getting updates at a quicker pace really keeps things interesting ……I mean you get to see people wigging out about the updates on the Fractal Forum, and you get to see other people here, wigging out about the people wigging out there…….View attachment 21263

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