pipelineaudio
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The M5000 was first sold somewhere around 1995. I'd say they have some understanding of audio DSP
Why no "High End" Behringer Modeler ...... seriously ?
- Thread starter BenIfin
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It seems to me that the things "Behringer" makes well are the things they buy a company to do for them. If you want to get right down to it, what "Behringer" did with the X32 and X-Air mixers was make the MIDAS design team come down out of the clouds and put price and manufacturability and scalability FIRST. It is still a very good mixer with features WELL above its pay grade, but they helped MIDAS make a design that is cheap to manufacture lots and lots of.
I don't believe that anyone of the "Behringer" engineers made those mixers sound great though. That was MIDAS guys all the way.
Music Group is such a big company in the music industry now, I think if they wanted to get into the digital amp market, they would buy a company like Kemper or QC, etc, etc. Just like they did a bunch of others recently. Then they might make a new version of that product (say a Kemper II) that was half the price and sounded as good or maybe even better and had more features.
Again, I don't see "Behringer" proper making a digital amp. I see Music Group buying someone like Line 6, Fractal or Kemper .... all of which are a fraction of Music Groups size.
I don't believe that anyone of the "Behringer" engineers made those mixers sound great though. That was MIDAS guys all the way.
Music Group is such a big company in the music industry now, I think if they wanted to get into the digital amp market, they would buy a company like Kemper or QC, etc, etc. Just like they did a bunch of others recently. Then they might make a new version of that product (say a Kemper II) that was half the price and sounded as good or maybe even better and had more features.
Again, I don't see "Behringer" proper making a digital amp. I see Music Group buying someone like Line 6, Fractal or Kemper .... all of which are a fraction of Music Groups size.
likitlikeyoulikeit
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Hmmmmmm
I don't see music tribe buying line 6....at all ...that doesn't even...not trying to be an ass ...it doesn't make sense to me.
Unless I don't have a understanding of business....I mean, that's not my degree, but I have taken a few classes....watched a few YT videos...you know
I don't see music tribe buying line 6....at all ...that doesn't even...not trying to be an ass ...it doesn't make sense to me.
Unless I don't have a understanding of business....I mean, that's not my degree, but I have taken a few classes....watched a few YT videos...you know
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Lysander
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Behringer's U-Phoria UMC204HD is still a ridiculously good audio interface for the price, and a lot of that is related to the MIDAS preamps it uses.
the-trooper
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They're still maintaining drivers for it?
Lysander
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It's fully USB class-compliant, no need for drivers at all. You can still use stuff like ASIO4ALL if necessary.
Sascha Franck
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Well, they never had drivers for their interfaces. Which is why latency figures have always been bad. And asking your users to go for a kind of "hack" (such as ASIO4All) is quite an offense in my book.
Lysander
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Behringer has drivers available for their entire UMC line - i never bothered installing them.
Huh, i regularly record direct with the UMC204HD without drivers, and i definitely get better latency than, say, a Scarlett 2i2. I'll double check once i get home, but IIRC i was getting ~3ms without issues.
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the-trooper
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Means nothing for those on windows.
Thanks but no thanks.
They absolutely did, and they still do. You can download them, and that UMC20"X"HD series was praised as "best buy".
The cheaper version of it was abandoned and people were hacking their way with older drivers. Which is why I asked if HD series is still maintained.
Lysander
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Windows has been shipping with stock USB Audio 2.0 drivers ever since Win10. Literally plug-and-play.
Sascha Franck
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On macOS I assume, right?
That's impossible. At least for roundtrip latencies. There's not one single class compliant driverless USB interface delivering any such values. Not under Windows with ASIO4All, not under macOS.
Sascha Franck
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Plug and play is quite something different than low latency performance.
Sascha Franck
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Oh, you're right, my bad. Must be mixing it up with something else. I remember getting one for a testride shortly after they were released, and from all I know, back then there's been an "official" link to ASIO4All and they would always use stock Core Audio drivers on macOS (until this day).
Lysander
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Nop, Linux if i'm recording DI tracks or anything not guitar, Windows/Helix Native for everything else.
Sascha Franck
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Ok. Still, 3ms usually isn't possible within that kinda hardware class.
pipelineaudio
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Behringer uses the same TheSycon.de drivers as focusrite, SSL and all the rest aside from RME
Sascha Franck
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Probably by now, but as said, I remember visiting their Musictribe support page and seeing a link to ASIO4All.
Besides, not all companies are using TheSycon drivers. Zooms UAC-2 had genuine drivers (which they, quite unfortunately, completely messed up with some FW update that apparently can't be reverted), the Motu M-series have dedicated drivers, too (with most excellent RTL values, best in their class), and from all I know, the latest Focusrite interfaces finally come with dedicated (and vastly better performing) drivers, too.
pipelineaudio
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Its worse than that. ALL of their interfaces, even the ones that don't have true ASIO drivers on their page actually had universal drivers made by TheSycon.de with the same performance....no idea why they hid this crap, aside from the units that you needed to search were I think 20 dollars cheaper than the ones who had the drivers shown. For years I was telling people not to buy those as they had no dedicated drivers, but I was shown my error. But in short, Behringer had TheSycon.de drivers since their first interface
MOTU's USB drivers are horrible, caused the end of the 896's dominance in certain markets...a sad thing to see from the one and only company who had previously in the FX and PCI days been the only one to hang with RME. I saw a little bit in a dawbench thread about the testing of the M series drivers, but didn't dig too deep. Seeing Jim Roseberry's horror at the state of MOTU USB drivers at the time, and my own experience giving up on their flagship units had me stop looking. My MOTU 2408 MKII's from 1999 still outperform pretty much every non RME unit today on Round Trip Latency
Zoom was a special case, not sure if they make their own drivers but they weren't really punching ahead of anyone else on TheSycon.de. https://kailuamusicschool.com/tech/round-trip-latency-roundup/
Sascha Franck
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No. They upped their game considerably. 3.5ms RTL at 44.1, 32 samples buffersize. Just excellent.
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