Anybody else getting sick of modellers?

[Boudoir Guitar]

Let's face it folks, we all have different kinds, assortments, new gear. vintage gear, combinations of gear, than are more numerous as the stars up in the sky.
All we could provide are opinions and individual facts.

Funny thing is, when the new trendy effects unit comes out people will buy it new at a sky high price ..... then a year or two later, it's going for extra cheap on Reverb or Ebay.
10 years ago an Eleven Rack was going for $1200.00, now you can find them $150.00 all day long on Reverb or Ebay.

Eleven rack price drop?

Is Avid coming out with a 12 rack? I keep seeing the eleven rack going for cheap...$300 at sam ash and $500-600 on sweetwater. Or is it hitting the discontinued list?

www.thegearpage.net

 

[deadpool_25]

There is something romantic about amps that isn’t there in a computer (because that’s what it is) hooked to speakers.

People underestimate the power of this. People get emotionally tied to tube amps and guitars--the more "vintage" the stronger the emotional ties.

These things are all tools used to make music. Some of the tools come with emotional connections that exist outside of, and are irrelevant to, how well the tool itself suits performing the task.

A problem for modelers in this context is that they're "supposed to" sound exactly like the real amps. But many (almost certainly most) players don't have any experience playing through a mic'd up amp isolated in another room. Their experience is that of playing through or listening to an amp while sitting in the vicinity of the cab.

I've said before the best intro to a modeler is probably to connect it to the power amp return of the amp you're used to using or something similar and trying it in the context you're most used to.

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

People underestimate the power of this. People get emotionally tied to tube amps and guitars--the more "vintage" the stronger the emotional ties.

These things are all tools used to make music. Some of the tools come with emotional connections that exist outside of, and are irrelevant to, how well the tool itself suits performing the task.

A problem for modelers in this context is that they're "supposed to" sound exactly like the real amps. But many (almost certainly most) players don't have any experience playing through a mic'd up amp isolated in another room. Their experience is that of playing through or listening to an amp while sitting in the vicinity of the cab.

I've said before the best intro to a modeler is probably to connect it to the power amp return of the amp you're used to using or something similar and trying it in the context you're most used to.

Besides this, I think it goes deeper than that.

It’s the way the device looks. It’s like having a vinyl and a turntable versus Spotify.

The look of a real amp in your room makes it possible for me to become nostalgic. I don’t think I will have that with the HX stomp and JBL 305s.

I think the power amp might fix that indeed. Just to have a real cab, the power amp in there and the modeler connected.

Maybe I am just a sentimental motherf

 

[deadpool_25]

Also, I just put a Tubescreamer in front of that Princeton. Gain at zero, tone at noon, output at 8-10. Trying to keep it as simple as possible of course.

Don't be afraid to use that gain knob. Gain on zero is very typical in applications where you are using the TS to boost/tigten a high gain amp but it's far less standard when running that TS into a clean amp.

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

People underestimate the power of this. People get emotionally tied to tube amps and guitars--the more "vintage" the stronger the emotional ties.

These things are all tools used to make music. Some of the tools come with emotional connections that exist outside of, and are irrelevant to, how well the tool itself suits performing the task.

A problem for modelers in this context is that they're "supposed to" sound exactly like the real amps. But many (almost certainly most) players don't have any experience playing through a mic'd up amp isolated in another room. Their experience is that of playing through or listening to an amp while sitting in the vicinity of the cab.

I've said before the best intro to a modeler is probably to connect it to the power amp return of the amp you're used to using or something similar and trying it in the context you're most used to.

And you are right. I have zero experience how that most amps sound however, any live show I have ever seen on YouTube, that is kind of mic’Ed up or not?

 

[deadpool_25]

Besides this, I think it goes deeper than that.

It’s the way the device looks. It’s like having a vinyl and a turntable versus Spotify.

The look of a real amp in your room makes it possible for me to become nostalgic. I don’t think I will have that with the HX stomp and JBL 305s.

I think the power amp might fix that indeed. Just to have a real cab, the power amp in there and the modeler connected.

Maybe I am just a sentimental motherf

Exactly what I'm talking about. Emotional connections. The amp makes you feel something the modeler may not. Nothing wrong with that.

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

Don't be afraid to use that gain knob. Gain on zero is very typical in applications where you are using the TS to boost/tigten a high gain amp but it's far less standard when running that TS into a clean amp.

Yeah I dipped my toes … gain at 3 .. I am such a daredevil

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

Exactly what I'm talking about. Emotional connections. The amp makes you feel something the modeler may not. Nothing wrong with that.

Yeah and it’s not even about loud … or edge of break up and all that stuff.

 

[FuzzyAce]

The main challenge to modelers, for me, are the cleans are never quite as special as the real thing next to you or mic'd up. Even a real tube amp with a reactive load and IR doesn't quite get it in the clean department imo. There is a certain attack and nature that is just different.

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

The main challenge to modelers, for me, are the cleans are never quite as special as the real thing next to you or mic'd up. Even a real tube amp with a reactive load and IR doesn't quite get it in the clean department imo. There is a certain attack and nature that is just different.

That’s what she said

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

That’s what she said

“Reactive load”

 

[FuzzyAce]

 

[Shredder777]

I'm not sick of modelers, but I had an epiphany with the Friedman IR-X.

It was a good sounding direct solution, but it didn't *sound* any better than my Zoom G11 through the same monitors. It did have a very 100% credible, response to guitar volume and did everything clean to moderate gain perfectly.

But for $500, that box only has one sound. One sound that you can go from clean to moderate gain without a hitch. Its a BE100 style preamp without sat or hbe modes. No built in pres/res knobs and the eq doesn't do much tone shaping. Boost the treble and it sounds harsh, so most of the eq controls had to move in tandem. I had to do alot with boosts and eq to get it to do what I wanted.

And after all that, I flipped over to the Krampus and it did the same thing but easier. Then I flipped to some other models and they did things the BE100 couldn't.

But the real limitation of the IRX and all modelers, the epiphany, is that the limitation is playing through studio monitors (or whatever "FRFR" system you have). Even if I bought a Fractal, it wouldn't sound any "better" than the IR-X. It would have many more options, but still be limited.

So what did I do? I could have ordered any modeler, a QC, a TMP, a Fractal... but I ordered a new 5150III.

Why? Because I already have a modeler and what I really want is the best, most gratifying, saturated high gain lead guitar sounds you can get. Thats where I live 90% of the time. If I need other sounds I have the stuff built into my modeler, and to be honest I don't care if the Deluxe Reverb model is 100% perfect. My goal was to get away from playing through studio monitors.

My view of modeling at this point is that its a commodity. Everyone should have one for its utility, but its nothing to get excited about.

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

I'm not sick of modelers, but I had an epiphany with the Friedman IR-X.

It was a good sounding direct solution, but it didn't *sound* any better than my Zoom G11 through the same monitors. It did have a very 100% credible, response to guitar volume and did everything clean to moderate gain perfectly.

But for $500, that box only has one sound. One sound that you can go from clean to moderate gain without a hitch. Its a BE100 style preamp without sat or hbe modes. No built in pres/res knobs and the eq doesn't do much tone shaping. Boost the treble and it sounds harsh, so most of the eq controls had to move in tandem. I had to do alot with boosts and eq to get it to do what I wanted.

And after all that, I flipped over to the Krampus and it did the same thing but easier. Then I flipped to some other models and they did things the BE100 couldn't.

But the real limitation of the IRX and all modelers, the epiphany, is that the limitation is playing through studio monitors (or whatever ""FRFR"" system you have). Even if I bought a Fractal, it wouldn't sound any "better" than the IR-X. It would have many more options, but still be limited.

So what did I do? I could have ordered any modeler, a QC, a TMP, a Fractal... but I ordered a new 5150III.

Why? Because I already have a modeler and what I really want is the best, most gratifying, saturated high gain lead guitar sounds you can get. Thats where I live 90% of the time. If I need other sounds I have the stuff built into my modeler, and to be honest I don't care if the Deluxe Reverb model is 100% perfect. My goal was to get away from playing through studio monitors.

My view of modeling at this point is that its a commodity. Everyone should have one for its utility, but its nothing to get excited about.

I just sometimes need to get over the idea that I am listening through studio monitors instead of a amp.

The dude I played a week ago would never work in my house, but that guitar plugged in that beautiful beast was a super nice feeling.

Then again, I hated the boss katana.

 

[deadpool_25]

The main challenge to modelers, for me, are the cleans are never quite as special as the real thing next to you or mic'd up. Even a real tube amp with a reactive load and IR doesn't quite get it in the clean department imo. There is a certain attack and nature that is just different.

I don't disagree. However I was playing through a couple of Jon Kaneshiro's Mayer presets with the QC through the FR-12 yesterday and man they sounded and felt good.

 

[deadpool_25]

I'm not sick of modelers, but I had an epiphany with the Friedman IR-X.

It was a good sounding direct solution, but it didn't *sound* any better than my Zoom G11 through the same monitors. It did have a very 100% credible, response to guitar volume and did everything clean to moderate gain perfectly.

But for $500, that box only has one sound. One sound that you can go from clean to moderate gain without a hitch. Its a BE100 style preamp without sat or hbe modes. No built in pres/res knobs and the eq doesn't do much tone shaping. Boost the treble and it sounds harsh, so most of the eq controls had to move in tandem. I had to do alot with boosts and eq to get it to do what I wanted.

And after all that, I flipped over to the Krampus and it did the same thing but easier. Then I flipped to some other models and they did things the BE100 couldn't.

But the real limitation of the IRX and all modelers, the epiphany, is that the limitation is playing through studio monitors (or whatever ""FRFR"" system you have). Even if I bought a Fractal, it wouldn't sound any "better" than the IR-X. It would have many more options, but still be limited.

So what did I do? I could have ordered any modeler, a QC, a TMP, a Fractal... but I ordered a new 5150III.

Why? Because I already have a modeler and what I really want is the best, most gratifying, saturated high gain lead guitar sounds you can get. Thats where I live 90% of the time. If I need other sounds I have the stuff built into my modeler, and to be honest I don't care if the Deluxe Reverb model is 100% perfect. My goal was to get away from playing through studio monitors.

My view of modeling at this point is that its a commodity. Everyone should have one for its utility, but its nothing to get excited about.

Which version 5153 did you order?? And what cab/speakers you gonna use??

 

[Shredder777]

Which version 5153 did you order?? And what cab/speakers you gonna use??

I got the 50W 6L6 version. I have an old PVXXX cab. Why?

 

[mercifulfuzziness]

I got the 50W 6L6 version. I have an old PVXXX cab. Why?

Deadpool is amp-curious

 

[Shredder777]

Deadpool is amp-curious

I am afraid he is going to tell me my cab won't work well. Its a decent enough cab.

 

[timbuck3]

People underestimate the power of this. People get emotionally tied to tube amps and guitars--the more "vintage" the stronger the emotional ties.

These things are all tools used to make music. Some of the tools come with emotional connections that exist outside of, and are irrelevant to, how well the tool itself suits performing the task.

A problem for modelers in this context is that they're "supposed to" sound exactly like the real amps. But many (almost certainly most) players don't have any experience playing through a mic'd up amp isolated in another room. Their experience is that of playing through or listening to an amp while sitting in the vicinity of the cab.

I've said before the best intro to a modeler is probably to connect it to the power amp return of the amp you're used to using or something similar and trying it in the context you're most used to.

I wish the trend would come back to make better stereo modelling amps with all the stuff on board including a power amp. I see the fender champion too and wish it was a 212 stereo amp. I know a lot of guys don’t play stereo but I’m just a Home player at this point and I still use my line 6 spider valve combo and my really old Cyber twin. Stereo amp