Amp Modeler Tier Ranking

[Elric]

Hot take: Having done Kemper, Helix, QC, and now Fractal, I would put QC in Tier 1 without hesitation. The only thing thing that's lacking that's of any consequence is a wider variety of time-based and modulation effects. (E.g. Fractal and HX are much stronger in this regard.) There are fewer amps, but captures compensate here, and what is available sounds great. The editor finally arrived, although I never thought it was necessary to begin with. (Though notably, it did address some of the obligatory cloud/WiFi concerns TGF'ers had expressed.) It won't run plugins (as vaguely promised), but neither will anything else. And then there's the on-board UI, which is more intuitive and about 10x faster to use than anything else I've owned.

Even with an FM3 sitting next to it, it's likely the QC would be my pick if I could only keep one. (I'm probably going to keep both, because the FM3 is also amazing.)

P.S./ Hotter take: The more time I spend with QC/Fractal, the more I feel like I'm boiling cheerios in milk, or whatever that line was, when I try to get my Helixeses to sound as good. But calling HX "tier 2" would be too harsh, because it has strengths of its own, especially in terms of features per dollar in a live rig.

+1 QC is absolutely legit in its current state, I understand the animosity for the company and people not being aware that it has progressed since the botched release but it’s totally ‘there’ at this point in terms of the tones and what you can accomplish with it and it is dead easy to use. Helix is Tier 2 in my personal table, for sure, but that is not a ‘bad’ place at all. I think we are outliers in the TGF hive mind, though.

 

[dean701]

+1 QC is absolutely legit in its current state, I understand the animosity for the company and people not being aware that it has progressed since the botched release but it’s totally ‘there’ at this point in terms of the tones and what you can accomplish with it and it is dead easy to use. Helix is Tier 2 in my personal table, for sure, but that is not a ‘bad’ place at all. I think we are outliers in the TGF hive mind, though.

I agree with the Tier 2 comment with some footnotes I think Helix has some fantastic amp models and some not so much. the new 2203 amp needs to be tried by everyone. It is that good. Their effects are good (maybe Tier 1.5, not top dog). The UI still remains as my favorite due to the scribble strips and the capacitive buttons. Of course, people can talk about touch screen stuff, but for me, my modeler sits on the floor (as it should) :)

 

[Orvillain]

PUT KEMPER IN THE BIN WHERE IT BELONUNGS!

 

[dronerstone]

General question, have we reached the 50% point where tube amps are used exclusively at home?

good one... I personally have:

• mine are too heavy to lug around town (Fender 1994 Twin, Ampeg VT-22)
• servicing is expensive and there's wait times involved (both amps have already seen the bench a few times)
• solid state amps may have slightly less "flesh" to their sound, but it's not worth the hassle, imho
• if there's a cab, I can survive with bringing only the Katana Head as a power amp
• keeping a LAB L2 in reach (as a backup)

Or something like that.

 

[wharf rat]

I'm not sure about paradise. Each unit has flaws but every product keeps evolving with new features and then I have the compulsion to re-check them out. I can't remember the last time I bought anything new though, so I'm buying from people with the same horrendous condition. There are already Fender TMPs up for sale everywhere. Well, not everywhere as in a lot of them but they are in local ads, forums, Reverb and such

Weird considering most places you buy these from have a return policy.

 

[dean701]

Weird considering most places you buy these from have a return policy.

30 days is never enough to time to explore what any of these devices have to offer. A few years ago, I bought a QC, FM3, Kemper at the same time that I already had a Helix. I attempted a 25 day marathon of tests. Didn't even come close to what I wanted to explore. Returned them all. Then I started re-buying them used at 60% list, taking my time with them. Had wifi and ground issues with the QC. Fixed the grounding but I still cut that one shorter than I wanted. Since 2012 I've been testing/re-trying them all. I know most of them inside and out at this point but each year they add something new to try.

 

[timbuck3]

30 days is never enough to time to explore what any of these devices have to offer. A few years ago, I bought a QC, FM3, Kemper at the same time that I already had a Helix. I attempted a 25 day marathon of tests. Didn't even come close to what I wanted to explore. Returned them all. Then I started re-buying them used at 60% list, taking my time with them. Had wifi and ground issues with the QC. Fixed the grounding but I still cut that one shorter than I wanted. Since 2012 I've been testing/re-trying them all. I know most of them inside and out at this point but each year they add something new to try.

SO WHICH IS YOUR FAV?

 

[dean701]

SO WHICH IS YOUR FAV?

for what factor? I have it broken down to the stupidest detail. Having said that, it's been about 10 months since I had a QC so things may have changed. or not.
I am a complicated person with my own requirements. Just go buy them all Tim, and return them like I did and decide based on factors that are important to you. For example, one of the major factors for me is re-amping. Is the signal clean? How difficult is it to set up and flip back and forth? I hate recabling shit. Can I simultaneously record USB DI and non USB interfaces? Can it record DI through SPDIF while recording analog with the amped path? I made and lost a spreadsheet with 4000 rows on it. I'm that batshit crazy. Buy then try, then return them all, then buy used. Sell it before the new model comes out or interest and pricing will drop on the after market. In anticipation of new models coming out, I have already dumped my Helix and Kemper Stage. Not that they were bad, but if a Helix successor comes out, the Helix prices will topple. I'm certainly not saying my way is the right way or the only way but using your local music stores and their satisfaction policies are to your benefit. These are not 50 dollar items.

 

[timbuck3]

for what factor? I have it broken down to the stupidest detail. Having said that, it's been about 10 months since I had a QC so things may have changed. or not.
I am a complicated person with my own requirements. Just go buy them all Tim, and return them like I did and decide based on factors that are in important to you. For example, one of the major factors for me is re-amping. Is the signal clean? How difficult is it to set up and flip back and forth? I hate recabling shit. Can I simultaneously record USB DI and non USB interfaces? Can it record DI through SPDIF while recording analog with the amped path? I made and lost a spreadsheet with 4000 rows on it. I'm that batshit crazy. Buy then try, then return them all, then buy used. Sell it before the new model comes out or interest and pricing will drop on the after market.

WOW...my needs are pretty slim at this point in my life. Mainly great headphone tone..or useabke 4cable use..as well as into power amp section of some amps.I gues they all have these needs.lol

 

[dean701]

I wish the details didn't matter to me but they do. I wish I were a millionaire and some of this would go away. At least I could own all of the devices and not feel guilty about it. Here is the latest thing bugging me.
The middle line is one of my favorite IRs included with the Friedman IR-x pedal but the file size is too big and it's 44.1.. I shrunk it by stripping silence in studio one and re-sampled it to be 24/48 but when I do, I get a hump at 200Hz (pink line). Why? No idea. never happened before. The top is me doing the same in Audacity. no hump. it's pissing me off.

 

[pipelineaudio]

Editing IRs especially for length is always tricky for me, I will be super happy to see if/when those who do it properly can give us some hints. Its always trial, then to SPAN then error, back to SPAN, rinse and repeat until its ok

 

[FractalAudio]

I wish the details didn't matter to me but they do. I wish I were a millionaire and some of this would go away. At least I could own all of the devices and not feel guilty about it. Here is the latest thing bugging me.
The middle line is one of my favorite IRs included with the Friedman IR-x pedal but the file size is too big and it's 44.1.. I shrunk it by stripping silence in studio one and re-sampled it to be 24/48 but when I do, I get a hump at 200Hz (pink line). Why? No idea. never happened before. The top is me doing the same in Audacity. no hump. it's pissing me off.

View attachment 14229

How long do you want the IR to be? Send it to me and I'll process if the correct way.

 

[dean701]

How long do you want the IR to be? Send it to me and I'll process if the correct way.

wow, I do appreciate the offer from the master himself. I was able to successfully do it with both Reaper and Audacity but I'll PM you the file. Thanks so much.

I spent an hour installing studio one on another machine. Tried multiple soundcards. All resulted in the hump at 200Hz. I've never had a problem pruning an IR ever. It's so simple. With other programs, it's working fine. I have a ticket into Presonus. Something is up as it is only Studio One related.

EDIT: figured it out. The timestretch feature was enabled on that track, so it was stretching to tempo on import.

 

[Sascha Franck]

WHERE IT BELONUNGS!

It is "Belohnung", dude!

 

[Jkist7]

Honestly the Hotone Stomp wipes the floor with every other modeler on the list, save the first and second lists. Even then, the QC is more capable, but the Hotone has an excellent PC editor, while QC is...still waiting on theirs I think? Also I'd absolutely take the Stomp II over the TMP. Hopefully the TMP gets a LOT of love from Fender.

I would definitely still take my FM3 over the Hotone for what its worth, but I've very happily gigged both.

 

[Orvillain]

That Monalisa meme everyone is sharing is normie simp dogshite.

 

[Sedaxel]

Honestly the Hotone Stomp wipes the floor with every other modeler on the list, save the first and second lists. Even then, the QC is more capable, but the Hotone has an excellent PC editor, while QC is...still waiting on theirs I think? Also I'd absolutely take the Stomp II over the TMP. Hopefully the TMP gets a LOT of love from Fender.

I would definitely still take my FM3 over the Hotone for what its worth, but I've very happily gigged both.

QC has PC editor since several weeks ago.

Also, The Hotone Stomp is not very good in terms of latency. It could cause some problems when integrating it with other digital pedals, as latencies add up.

 

[JiveTurkey]

That Monalisa meme everyone is sharing is normie simp dogshite.

 

[gdhi11]

Odd thing is that when I had an mxr phase 90 pedal I plugged it into the helix floor loop it sounded identical to the block so I assumed it was something in the helix that was modifying the sound. Outside of the Helix it had way more magic.

I've done extensive testing on this with the Helix. Latency, and D/A conversion absolutely has an impact on the sound going through the unit. Every loop also changes things slightly, increases latency etc.. No fx stompboxes have perfect impedance either. That's a whole other thing. The Helix does have impedance compensation, but it's pretty much impossible to match every pedal's preferred input value with preset numbers. That said, they do better with input impedance adjustment into fuzzes than Fractal does by a mile. I have used the fuzzface in helix in place of my real stompboxes quite a few times. It's basically identical.

That said, it's a chasing-the-tail thing to worry about.

 

[gdhi11]

I bet it's beyond 50%. I have amps and modelers, and if I was playing live I'd probably bring my FM9. Either by itself, or with a PS200 or something and a 2x12. I love tube amps, but there's no question where the future is going.

Not in my house (tiny condo) My amps are stacked in the corner. I'm using a modeler for everything at the moment despite the extreme amount of money I spend on MI insurance. Really need to purge some more stuff this year.