What are we watching now?

[Aelred]

Did you see it upon its release in a theater? It was an insanely intense experience with lots of crowd noise - muddled shrieks and screams or Hudson induced howls of laughter - but mostly people freaking the F out. The buzz leaving the theater was nuts.

Giger's vision had been played out in the first movie. That vibe couldn't be repeated.
Cameron made it a a scream out loud roller coaster ride that left you feeling completely wiped out.
Thought it was perfect.

Same thoughts apply to T1 and T2.

Maybe Australian movie crowds are different - not so much whooping and hollering. I recall a vague air of disappointment, but that may have been me and my firends.

Howls of laughter? Ok. A very different experience indeed. The first movie everyone in the theatre was freaked out, but silent.

T1 and T2 were pretty much the same movie, but excellent roller-coaster rides. How they end up in a blind-panic run-for-their-lives chase into a factory that can crush (1) or melt (2) the Terminator is pushing credulity, but fun was had.

 

[Achilles]

whooping and hollering

I did mention muddled. Not sure how you got to hollering.

Howls of laughter

My bad - wrong word.
Again, it was subdued but all over the theater as it momentarily broke the tension in the room for most.

 

[Aelred]

I did mention muddled. Not sure how you got to hollering.

Um, muddled shrieks and screams - did you mean "muffled" as in quiet or "muddled" as in muddled up and confused?

Muddled shrieks and screams, and howls of laughter.

That's how. Just saying.

 

[Achilles]

Um, muddled shrieks and screams - did you mean "muffled" as in quiet or "muddled" as in muddled up and confused?

Muddled shrieks and screams, and howls of laughter.

That's how. Just saying.

Again, my bad.
My brain is going south.
Somehow muffled and subdued became muddled.

 

[norminal]

Again, my bad.
My brain is going south.
Somehow muffled and subdued became muddled.

 

[laxu]

I didn't think the original Alien needed a franchise. I thought that was just a great and cool film.

I highly recommend this comedian's stuff. Ryan George is hilarious, and he is dead on with his dissection of plots:

Haha, these are perfectly explaining what's so very wrong with those films.

Alien was brilliant and unique upon release and did not need a sequel let alone a franchise or – shudder – a prequel.

Aliens was an OK bug-splatter fest, but nothing much to do with the original based on HR Giger’s vision. It shines now – to me – because of all the atrocities that followed.

Alien is a great horror film, and Aliens is an almost perfect action film. I think James Cameron was smart by not making a straight same genre sequel but something that is different enough to stand on its own. A lot of horror sequels are basically "ok, now the creature is killing these other people in this other place".

I've seen both films in theaters a few times and they still hold up so well. Very few effects seem dated.

 

[State of Epicicity]

Haha, these are perfectly explaining what's so very wrong with those films.

That guy is just amazing.

 

[la szum]

 

[Aelred]

Haha, these are perfectly explaining what's so very wrong with those films.


Alien is a great horror film, and Aliens is an almost perfect action film. I think James Cameron was smart by not making a straight same genre sequel but something that is different enough to stand on its own. A lot of horror sequels are basically "ok, now the creature is killing these other people in this other place".

I've seen both films in theaters a few times and they still hold up so well. Very few effects seem dated.

I agree Aliens is a quite good action flick - it just didn't need HR Giger's freaky "Xenomorph" to be re-imagined as ants with a Queen.

But I'm more of an HR Giger fan than James Cameron fan. He does some good action sequences, but as I said with T1 and T2, it's stretching things when both times after a like and death panic chase they just happen to end up in a factory cabable of stopping the unstoppable Terminator.

Action, sets and CGI, fine. Story - don't think about the details. See Avatar 1 and 2 as well.

 

[Achilles]

didn't need HR Giger's freaky "Xenomorph" to be re-imagined as ants with a Queen.

Counterpoint.
In Alien quite a bit of screen time was given to the discovery of the dozens (hundreds?) of eggs/pods/cocoons and Kane's close inspection of one before the jump scare.

I'm glad Cameron came up with an extremely plausible explanation. The original creature was always considered insect like - why not a queen laying eggs?

Plus it was so freaking badass the first time seeing the queen freak the F out as Ripley torched all her little ones.

 

[State of Epicicity]

James Cameron is a very mixed bag to me. I like the first two Terminator movies the way I like candy. One thing I don't like is how he throws in military or military-like teams in his films (like in Aliens, The Abyss, and Avatar) where the characters are drawn so flat and dumb it's insulting. That kind of thing takes me way out of the story, because I can't stop reeling at the terrible dialog. Contrast that with Apocalypse Now, where even the dumbest soldier is a kind of philosopher and an interesting character with depth that you feel compelled to follow. In a James Cameron film, I just end up not caring. Another great depiction of soldiers that's not dumbed down: Platoon. Even Jacob's Ladder. You can depict anyone in a respectful and cool way, and to me James Cameron's writing betrays supreme laziness combined with an almost royal view of "the plebians."

 

[Aelred]

The life-cycle of the Alien was right there on the ship as they explored it. HR Giger, of course, wanted a more explict egg-form opening, but they had to make it an X or + for the censors.

Simplistic explanations remove some of the freaky alieness of the alien, at least for me.

EDIT: One of the many reasons I loathe prequels - and sequels that mess with the original. It hardly matters now we are up to - what? Alien meets Frankenstein?

 

[JiveTurkey]

T1 OR GTFO.

 

[Achilles]

but they had to make it an X or + for the censors.

Didn't know that. I always wondered how they got away with the ships opening, which was clearly modeled after a lady's groin.

 

[Aelred]

Didn't know that. I always wondered how they got away with the ships opening, which was clearly modeled after a lady's groin.

See any HR Giger art work apart from album covers.

The Dead Kennedys got sued and disbanded for including a poster of his work with their album Frankenchrist.

Species was another very Giger creature. A pity the movie was average at best.

 

[TSJMajesty]

That guy is just amazing.

I first caught him in a Star Wars pitch, and he mentioned plot holes that made me wanna go back and re-watch the movies!!

He's pretty damn smart. And funny. Wowowow Tight!

 

[laxu]

I agree Aliens is a quite good action flick - it just didn't need HR Giger's freaky "Xenomorph" to be re-imagined as ants with a Queen.

Achilles already made the "where did the eggs come from?" counterpoint and IMO it was a good move to amp up the stakes in a sequel and make it work with lots of aliens crawling around.

Often the more you explain about the creature the less scary it becomes, but I think Cameron managed to toe the line where even in most action scenes you don't see the aliens that much - especially considering they are people in suits. It maintains that "they could be lurking anywhere in the darkness" aspect that most of the sequels miss.

Plus the alien queen design is just fantastic as are all the animatronics.

But I'm more of an HR Giger fan than James Cameron fan. He does some good action sequences, but as I said with T1 and T2, it's stretching things when both times after a like and death panic chase they just happen to end up in a factory cabable of stopping the unstoppable Terminator.

Action, sets and CGI, fine. Story - don't think about the details. See Avatar 1 and 2 as well.

I'm fine with some suspension of disbelief. I think the endings of both Terminator are at least plausible ways to dispose of the robot, and the wild ride to get there is really what the movies were all about.

The Avatar movies desperately need better writers. They are so by the numbers affairs.

 

[State of Epicicity]

Last night we bought Take Shelter, by Jeff Nichols, starring Michael Shannon, from 2011. We had seen it once before, but I remember it being just incredible. My memory was right haha. This is a rare film in that Michael Shannon is the main character. He is just incredible in this, and more compelling than I can properly express. I love this film completely because of him. As always, Jeff Nichols has air, mood, and feel to his work. It's the kind of directing you can feel. I just loved it.

After seeing The Bikeriders in the theater recently, we decided to revisit all of Jeff Nichols films again, but it's turning out that they're not on any of the services to which we're subscribed, so we'll be checking them out again on the side here and there. Shotgun Stories was first, and I loved rewatching it. Then it was Take Shelter last night. Next will be Mud, which I also remember being incredible. I can't wait.

 

[Achilles]

Last night we bought Take Shelter, by Jeff Nichols, starring Michael Shannon, from 2011. We had seen it once before, but I remember it being just incredible. My memory was right haha. This is a rare film in that Michael Shannon is the main character. He is just incredible in this, and more compelling than I can properly express. I love this film completely because of him. As always, Jeff Nichols has air, mood, and feel to his work. It's the kind of directing you can feel. I just loved it.

What's your take on the last scene at the beach house?

Spoiler: My 2 cents

When they visit the doctor right before the end he tells them to go ahead and take their beach vacation, but that he'd need to begin treatment - temporary institutionalization? - when they got back. Prior to this Shannon had been grappling with acceptance of his condition, mainly (I think) because it was going to drive that last thing he had away - his wife and kid, he'd lost everything else.

The last scene is a dream where not only is he at peace with the 'coming storm', but they were also right there with him.

 

[Aelred]

Achilles already made the "where did the eggs come from?" counterpoint and IMO it was a good move to amp up the stakes in a sequel and make it work with lots of aliens crawling around.

And I already made the "lifecycle of the Xenomorph was right there on the ship" counterpoint to that.

Driving down the highway, just crashing into a factory that can melt the liquid metal man who makes no sense if you think about it for a second... apart from being way-cool CGI compared the stop-motion of T1.

Yeah, your mileage does vary! Enjoy as you like, I find Cameron's work lacking in depth.