Randall Smith Gone From Mesa Boogie/Gibson?

[GuitarBilly74]

I see, so you’re just wrong. Thanks for clarifying.

I see, so you were trying to be a dick after all.
Thanks for clarifying.

 

[[Nathan]]

I don’t think fluff was complaining. He used words like it’s unfortunate and “I’m bummed out” but on a scale of 1-10 of complaining it was about a 1.5.

It sounds to me like when they got rid of Randall it was the straw that broke the camels back and he was willing to cop losing the relationship over anyway. If that’s how things are gonna be then why would he put on a smile and pretend everything is A-ok at HQ when it’s a pretty shit go from management. The info was already out there on forums so it was just a matter of time anyway.

He seems fine with it, he’s now working with Marshall and the other gamut of brands he has connections with, he’s fine. The only reason it’s a loss is cause he likes the brand. If it was all about the $$$ for him then he wouldn’t have said anything in the first place.

Gibsons the one left with egg on their face because of all of this. Crazy to think they have actual professionals working there in marketing and other departments at corporate and the way it plays out is still pre internet PR like they thought people aren’t interested and would talk about this stuff.

I’m happy to have played a small role in bringing the topic to the masses. It’s pretty clear that overall people think this has been a shit way to go about things from Gibson. I’ve also had a bunch of people come out of the woodwork and messaging me saying how much of a shit go it’s been from Gibson.

Noones saying he should have got off Scott free but if they made better choices along the way then the cookies wouldn’t have crumbled the way they did. Can’t feel sorry for a company making bad decisions and not having the optics to see it from the public’s pov

The undertone of my video was that they can still make some kind of gesture to make things better and show they aren’t globotech…. But what are the chances of that happening?

 

[greatmutah]

Ola; absolutely! Fluff?

I’ve been watching Ola since he was posting at HCAF under the name Texass Ranger. Also he did this banger of a Road King recording.

 

[EOengineer]

The only reasonable way to settle this is a Fluff vs Cesar cage match.

Cesar clearly has him on reach but Fluff looks like he might know how to party.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Again, it's a work contract. If the company let's it slide, the next time there's a leak by an endorser, there's a precedent and it would make it easy for them to say "I didn't expect any consequences given nothing happened to Fluff when he did the same thing".

They could have done something internal only, but it's hard to do that once something it's already out. Can't put that rabbit back in the hat.

The "message control" is really for the employees and endorsers: don't do that. They probably think the public thing will blow over with time (and I'm sure it will).

I agree it's bad PR, but it was caused by a company spokesperson leaking inside info without authorization, then complaining more about being justly terminated.

I think he got off easy, especially this being Gibson. Many companies would sue over this type of stuff.

The question is more: “Could Gibson have handled all of this differently to avoid a negative PR situation?”

and to me, there are so many things they could have done at various points to stop it even being a talking point. You’re welcome to think that Gibson handled it well and are coming out of it in a stronger position. I think they’ve weakened their own hand, and have now given themselves more work to change people’s perception of the company (which has been going this way for decades).

 

[Whizzinby]

1. Randall sold the company. He lost all ability to complain about the handling of the company, including his own involvement, the second he cashed the check
2. Fluff had no business airing company info in public.
3. I wish the new DR was about 20% cheaper

/end

 

[SonVolt]

1. Randall sold the company. He lost all ability to complain about the handling of the company, including his own involvement, the second he cashed the check
2. Fluff had no business airing company info in public.
3. I wish the new DR was about 20% cheaper

/end

You must work in management.

 

[GuitarBilly74]

The question is more: “Could Gibson have handled all of this differently to avoid a negative PR situation?”

and to me, there are so many things they could have done at various points to stop it even being a talking point. You’re welcome to think that Gibson handled it well and are coming out of it in a stronger position. I think they’ve weakened their own hand, and have now given themselves more work to change people’s perception of the company (which has been going this way for decades).

I don't know... I've been around forums/social media pretty much since they were invented and I can't think of a single year when there was not a Gibson pile-on for some reason. Yet the company has a large share of the market between all their brands, so it's not all that damaging. This kind of stuff mostly inconsequential since people who are "outraged" about this are people that already had a beef with Gibson for whatever reason.

I seriously doubt someone that was actually planning to buy a LP or a Mark amp etc changed their mind because of the Fluff situation. Actually, the other thread currently trending here is about how much this forum loves their Mesas...

 

[MirrorProfiles]

I seriously doubt someone that was actually planning to buy a LP or a Mark amp etc changed their mind because of the Fluff situation

Maybe not as a direct consequence, but he has 500,000 followers on YouTube. If he is doing several videos using the amp, not only is it going to lead to sales but it also might swing someone who was going to buy another brand to buying a Mesa. Now, I'm certainly not going to buy a piece of gear based on what an influencer on YouTube thinks. But someone of a younger generation who is more interested in YouTubers than they are even in bands will absolutely care what he thinks. Even just having product placement and familiarity in videos is valuable marketing, 500,000 is a massive number of people and even more valuable if you know they are likely guitarists who like high gain guitar tones.

All these reissues (not just Mesa, Peavey 5150, Soldano, everyone else) are aimed at a nostalgia for people roughly in their 40's who are approaching a stage in their life where they can finally live out their teenage dreams. I don't think these are intended to sell to the scale the original line was, amps are a different kind of commodity now and essentially a luxury boutique item. The amps will sell just fine, at their price point the kind of market for them is small but know what they want, and it would take a lot to put them off.

I still think it's stupid for Gibson to be creating ANY kind of negative PR that isn't 100% necessary. In this case, it's all their own doing. It's not a huge deal, but it's stupid none the less, because even if Fluff blabbed, the situation was entirely Gibsons doing. Rumours and quotes were all over the internet already, it wasn't Fluff leaking it. It could have been handled publicly well before Fluff said anything and a lot of conjecture simply wouldn't have happened. Fluff just added to the noise, and people pay more attention to those who are "seen" as closer to the source.

 

[Shredder777]

I’m happy to have played a small role in bringing the topic to the masses. It’s pretty clear that overall people think this has been a shit way to go about things from Gibson.

People only become leakers when they think there is personal benefit in it for them. That is the sad reality.

If Fluff has a relationship with Gibson (we will tell you this thing, as long as you don't tell anyone else) and he breaks that trust, he is a fucking loser if he breaks that trust. He did it for personal gain and justified it because he didn't personally agree with how they run the business.

Its the same thing as Snowden. Low education IT guy gets a TS clearance. They give him information and high paying job, but the caveat is that he can't tell anyone what he knows. When Snowden went rogue, do you think he did it from a sense of altrusim? Hell no, he was going to get canned (likely because they found out he had lied or fabricated part of his resume), and leaking documents was the only way he could satisfy his narcissism.

Fluff calculated that he could lead some kind of resistance against Gibson practices and become a hero. That was worth more to him that the information Gibson gave him. Everyone will think he is so "principled" now, when the opposite is the truth.

Everyone likes to hate gibson, but buying out and then retiring an employee is the reality that all of us face in our careers, have it happen to us, even if we aren't a household name.

 

[SonVolt]

Maybe not as a direct consequence, but he has 500,000 followers on YouTube. If he is doing several videos using the amp, not only is it going to lead to sales but it also might swing someone who was going to buy another brand to buying a Mesa. Now, I'm certainly not going to buy a piece of gear based on what an influencer on YouTube thinks. But someone of a younger generation who is more interested in YouTubers than they are even in bands will absolutely care what he thinks. Even just having product placement and familiarity in videos is valuable marketing, 500,000 is a massive number of people and even more valuable if you know they are likely guitarists who like high gain guitar tones.

All these reissues (not just Mesa, Peavey 5150, Soldano, everyone else) are aimed at a nostalgia for people roughly in their 40's who are approaching a stage in their life where they can finally live out their teenage dreams. I don't think these are intended to sell to the scale the original line was, amps are a different kind of commodity now and essentially a luxury boutique item. The amps will sell just fine, at their price point the kind of market for them is small but know what they want, and it would take a lot to put them off.

I still think it's stupid for Gibson to be creating ANY kind of negative PR that isn't 100% necessary. In this case, it's all their own doing. It's not a huge deal, but it's stupid none the less, because even if Fluff blabbed, the situation was entirely Gibsons doing. Rumours and quotes were all over the internet already, it wasn't Fluff leaking it. It could have been handled publicly well before Fluff said anything and a lot of conjecture simply wouldn't have happened. Fluff just added to the noise, and people pay more attention to those who are "seen" as closer to the source.

I agree with this, sadly.

 

[nicolasrivera]

I underestimated the Gibson hate here on this one. 1500+ comments on my video and the vast majority of them is general dislike towards Gibson for firing Randall and booting Fluff. To be fair its dislike towards Gibson for poor qc, high prices and an array of other reasons as well, but this seems to be the icing on the cake.

And yet, both companys will continue to sell guitars and amps regardless of what the forums everywhere say, we are a minority among the vast markets they reach.

Almost everyone i ask if they know the name of the guy that created MESA Boogie, no one knows. But some do know Fluff and his YT Channel.

 

[Whizzinby]

You must work in management.

No, unfortunately I have to work for a living.

 

[EOengineer]

People only become leakers when they think there is personal benefit in it for them. That is the sad reality a deeply held opinion I’m stating as fact.

FTFY.

 

[Shredder777]

FTFY.

But you can't deny that Fluff benefits more from "taking a stand" and the growth in traffic than he does from whatever information he gets from them. For all we know they were going to limit or terminate the relationship.

He was in business with them and violated their trust. In my industry I would be unemployable if I pulled a stunt like that. Most people would be unemployable if they did something like that.

 

[EOengineer]

But you can't deny that Fluff benefits more from "taking a stand" and the growth in traffic than he does from whatever information he gets from them. For all we know they were going to limit or terminate the relationship.

He was in business with them and violated their trust. In my industry I would be unemployable if I pulled a stunt like that. Most people would be unemployable if they did something like that.

I don’t disagree at all that Fluff made a bad call from a business relationship perspective, as we’ve aired out in great detail here. Whether or not he had delusions of grandeur about heading some revolution or just wanted to stick up for someone to whom he may have admired, we may never know.

The true test is whether OTHER businesses view him as a liability, which appears to not be the case considering what has transpired for him after the leak.

 

[GuitarBilly74]

Maybe not as a direct consequence, but he has 500,000 followers on YouTube. If he is doing several videos using the amp, not only is it going to lead to sales but it also might swing someone who was going to buy another brand to buying a Mesa.

I highly doubt that. I don't know anyone that watches a single YT channel.
People that follow Fluff also follow Ola and many other major metal channels... they will hear the Mesa, and ultimately that's what's going to make them decide whether they want it. Not whether Fluff was fired or not.

 

[Shredder777]

I don’t disagree at all that Fluff made a bad call from a business relationship perspective, as we’ve aired out in great detail here. Whether or not he had delusions of grandeur about heading some revolution or just wanted to stick up for someone to whom he may have admired, we may never know.

The true test is whether OTHER businesses view him as a liability, which appears to not be the case considering what has transpired for him after the leak.

Confirming what I said. The leak benefitted him.

He betrayed the kind of trust that allowed him to build his channel. He is a clown.

 

[EOengineer]

Confirming what I said. The leak benefitted him.

He betrayed the kind of trust that allowed him to build his channel. He is a clown.

No. The claim you made was that ALL leakers do so out of personal gain.

So you think he knew that he would lose his relationship with Mesa and gain one with Marshall?

It’s putting it kindly to call that a stretch.

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

There weirdest part about all of this to me is that Randall Smith tried to stay on at all.

That's right up there with helping out the buyers of your house with their remodel plans. Or giving advice to your ex's new romantic interest. Just terrible ideas that will never end with everyone walking away with nothing but regrets.

The Gibson Bros definitely should have known better -- that whatever good will they might get by bringing him on as "Master Designer and Pioneer of Mesa/Boogie and beyond" would be outweighed by what would eventually be a not amicable split.

My assumption is that a dude that is 75 years old and stays on board rather than retiring after the sale of his company and willingly takes on that jack-ass-of-a-job-title...must have been the one pushing for this, rather than the other way around.