Fractal Talk

Ok, been doing some research and seeing things that I need to suss out before I make a decision.

Does the FM3 have a noise issue when used in 4CM, and also.....how difficult is it to run stereo out this way, without using output 1...which is XLR? I will not be using this direct....amp only.

I saw a post by @TubeStack on the fractal forum that dealt with this issue directly, but was 3 years ago, not sure if it had been fixed since then.
 
likitlikeyoulikeit said:
Ok, been doing some research and seeing things that I need to suss out before I make a decision.

Does the FM3 have a noise issue when used in 4CM, and also.....how difficult is it to run stereo out this way, without using output 1...which is XLR? I will not be using this direct....amp only.

I saw a post by @TubeStack on the fractal forum that dealt with this issue directly, but was 3 years ago, not sure if it had been fixed since then.
Click to expand...
Are you wanting to run 4CM with one amp and then another output to the fx return of a second amp?

Or are you wanting to use amp models and just run into the returns of two amps?

In my experience, and I've done that stuff a lot with FM3 and FM9, is that the second way is just as satisfying, much simpler in terms of cabling and internal routing, and is less prone to noise.

I remember having some ground hum back in the day, but iirc I was running 7CM. Humbuster cables helped a lot but I ultimately totally solved that with an Ebtech Hum Eliminator. I didn't have any issues when running the FM(X) into the returns of two amps using just regular instrument cables.
 
deadpool_25 said:
Are you wanting to run 4CM with one amp and then another output to the fx return of a second amp?

Or are you wanting to use amp models and just run into the returns of two amps?

In my experience, and I've done that stuff a lot with FM3 and FM9, is that the second way is just as satisfying, much simpler in terms of cabling and internal routing, and is less prone to noise.

I remember having some ground hum back in the day, but iirc I was running 7CM. Humbuster cables helped a lot but I ultimately totally solved that with an Ebtech Hum Eliminator. I didn't have any issues when running the FM(X) into the returns of two amps using just regular instrument cables.
Click to expand...
Currently I run a stupidly complicated setup, but, especially since I predominately play at home, it affords maximum signal path flexibility for crafting a wide variety of sounds.

Guitar→Isp Decimator GString 2→Analog fuzz/comp/drives→Mx5→

Left → mx5 output →amp in→amp fx send→ISP decimator g string II→boss sy-2→Mx5 FX loop→mx5 post effects →boss tera echo→digitech stereo delay/phrase sampler/looper→amp FX return

Right→mx5 right output→boss tera echo→digitech stereo delay/phrase sampler/looper→power section of amp 2

This allows me dual mono/wd/stereo, with or without my amps pre, and use of digital preamp models. I really like this, but know it is overly complicated and not ideal in a normal band environment.

I guess this a variant of 7 cm
 
likitlikeyoulikeit said:
Currently I run a stupidly complicated setup, but, especially since I predominately play at home, it affords maximum signal path flexibility for crafting a wide variety of sounds.

Guitar→Isp Decimator GString 2→Analog fuzz/comp/drives→Mx5→

Left → mx5 output →amp in→amp fx send→ISP decimator g string II→boss sy-2→Mx5 FX loop→mx5 post effects →boss tera echo→digitech stereo delay/phrase sampler/looper→amp FX return

Right→mx5 right output→boss tera echo→digitech stereo delay/phrase sampler/looper→power section of amp 2

This allows me dual mono/wd/stereo, with or without my amps pre, and use of digital preamp models. I really like this, but know it is overly complicated and not ideal in a normal band environment.

I guess this a variant of 7 cm
Click to expand...
Corrected right signal path...also, I may add....if I mess with anything I potentially ruin it....and it is a pain to refigure....breaks my brain every 3 years.
 
I'd say that's a variant on 5CM as it doesn't look like you're accessing the preamp of amp 2.

Regardless, any of the Fractal devices should be relatively easily swapped in. For FM3

Guitar > stuff > FM3 in 1

FM3 out 3L > amp 1 in

Amp 1 fx send > Stuff > FM3 input 3L

FM3 output 1L > Looper
FM3 output 1R > Looper

Something like that. Why are you using the ISP? Are the gates in the MX5 not great? You may find the multiple gates in the Fractal sufficient, but I know people love their ISPs regardless sometimes.

As I'm sure you're aware, the more complex you make it, the more likely you are to get ground loops. I've kept that Hum Eliminator on hand for years and it's done the trick when I've needed it. I've moved away from complicated these days so let me know if you're interested in it. You may not need it though. I always set up without it and added it in if I needed to break a ground loop.
 
likitlikeyoulikeit said:
Currently I run a stupidly complicated setup, but, especially since I predominately play at home, it affords maximum signal path flexibility for crafting a wide variety of sounds.

Guitar→Isp Decimator GString 2→Analog fuzz/comp/drives→Mx5→

Left → mx5 output →amp in→amp fx send→ISP decimator g string II→boss sy-2→Mx5 FX loop→mx5 post effects →boss tera echo→digitech stereo delay/phrase sampler/looper→amp FX return

Right→mx5 right output→boss tera echo→digitech stereo delay/phrase sampler/looper→power section of amp 2

This allows me dual mono/wd/stereo, with or without my amps pre, and use of digital preamp models. I really like this, but know it is overly complicated and not ideal in a normal band environment.

I guess this a variant of 7 cm
Click to expand...
Damn.....that is complicated.....I just run my LP into the Axe-Fx, into some Adam studio monitors.....
biggrin.gif
 
likitlikeyoulikeit said:
Ok, been doing some research and seeing things that I need to suss out before I make a decision.

Does the FM3 have a noise issue when used in 4CM, and also.....how difficult is it to run stereo out this way, without using output 1...which is XLR? I will not be using this direct....amp only.

I saw a post by @TubeStack on the fractal forum that dealt with this issue directly, but was 3 years ago, not sure if it had been fixed since then.
Click to expand...
As I understand it, the FM3 doesn't quite have the same AD/DA circuitry as the FM9 and Axe3 do. So the noise floor is a bit higher. But I'm unsure as to whether it would be a problem or not.

I will say that the Axe FX 3 seems to be one of the more troublesome bits of kit when running 4-cable-method, in terms of noise and ground hum. Even when I use humbuster cables, I also seem to need to use at least one transformer isolator in the circuit in order to get rid of all of the hum.

The noise floor performance is very good though; with the Axe3.

I did a video a while back:


Not sure if it really conveys the tonal performance, but it might give you an idea of what to expect from an FM9 or Axe3 at least. I've never owned the FM3 so can't really speak to that.
 
deadpool_25 said:
I'd say that's a variant on 5CM as it doesn't look like you're accessing the preamp of amp 2.

Regardless, any of the Fractal devices should be relatively easily swapped in. For FM3

Guitar > stuff > FM3 in 1

FM3 out 3L > amp 1 in

Amp 1 fx send > Stuff > FM3 input 3L

FM3 output 1L > Looper
FM3 output 1R > Looper

Something like that. Why are you using the ISP? Are the gates in the MX5 not great? You may find the multiple gates in the Fractal sufficient, but I know people love their ISPs regardless sometimes.

As I'm sure you're aware, the more complex you make it, the more likely you are to get ground loops. I've kept that Hum Eliminator on hand for years and it's done the trick when I've needed it. I've moved away from complicated these days so let me know if you're interested in it. You may not need it though. I always set up without it and added it in if I needed to break a ground loop.
Click to expand...
First, thanks.

Second, I love my decimator....hard to part with ... especially considering I run analog gain before the mx5. The decimator tracks the signal direct from the guitar first ...it has 2 gates....so it is actually better than using any gates in the mx5...the only reason I use it on that, is because the right path needs one

Third, I fully understand the complex routing creates a bevy of issues. Luckily, I never have ground loop issues, thank goodness.

The main reason I love my ri g, and something I pride myself on....is how loud it is ....but how absolutely quiet it is ...very impressive.

Seriously, thanks all ...I am very grateful.
 
Last edited:
Orvillain said:
As I understand it, the FM3 doesn't quite have the same AD/DA circuitry as the FM9 and Axe3 do. So the noise floor is a bit higher. But I'm unsure as to whether it would be a problem or not.

I will say that the Axe FX 3 seems to be one of the more troublesome bits of kit when running 4-cable-method, in terms of noise and ground hum. Even when I use humbuster cables, I also seem to need to use at least one transformer isolator in the circuit in order to get rid of all of the hum.

The noise floor performance is very good though; with the Axe3.

I did a video a while back:


Not sure if it really conveys the tonal performance, but it might give you an idea of what to expect from an FM9 or Axe3 at least. I've never owned the FM3 so can't really speak to that.
Click to expand...

I spy a Laney, that vh100r is a beast!!!! Love those things!


Not going to lie, dig the sounds ...I can make all these sounds just like that now..... which is cool ...but also makes me gunshy....devil I know and all. But I just hate my current effects unit, for a long list of reasons....but I know I can make anything sound great, even though around here it is believed there are no good sounds in a HR unit...not being a dick, just surprised how similar our sounds are. It's eerie.

Not catching too much noise....but I have fans on.
 
Last edited:
GTR37 said:
its funny I reset the amps and this one I don't notice a huge difference , its still on the darker side to my ears, and it sounds good as always but I am not getting that OMG , maybe its just the amps I am using
Click to expand...

Same. But I am old, dull, and dumb. :bonk

I also had ZERO issues with how it sound and felt before. I was already madly in love,
so a new dress didn't move my meter much. Also, the first things I said. :rofl
 
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