Fractal Talk

[Stratzrus]

Not sure it was ever really about the tone (alone). Some 10+ years ago another jazz guy (too) was always complaining. IIRC, it was about headroom, and maybe EVM12 IRs, so he kept using a physical cab.

Me, I really enjoyed the Mr. Benson preset, and even the Smokey Jazz for some minutes.

I also use a tube amp and physical cab (George Benson HRD or Sig:X with a FatBottom 2x12). I love the tones I get with the Atomic CLR but they're not the same as the Benson combo or Sig:X which I prefer for doing gigs.

Interestingly, my original Fryette Sig:X wasn't ideal for traditional Jazz tones. It had a distinct cut off of the lowest frequency range. That actually made it very good at cutting when playing with others but didn't really sound like Wes.

But after a while Fryette developed something that's been referred to as the "Fat Mod". I sent my Sig:X back to Fryette and had them do the mod which I understand was incorporated into later production runs of that amp. When I got it back the bottom end was there in spades and I remember thinking how much the clean channel now sounded much more like my '65 Super Reverb but with a ton more clean headroom. With the mod it made a great choice for playing Jazz in larger venues.

But the cleans in the original version had a magic of their own and I missed it. Not to the point where I regretted getting the mod but it would have been really nice to have both options for when I wanted to play Jazz with a tone that was more George Benson than Wes Montgomery or for Funk and R&B.

 

[Mongillo19]

I was jamming on ye olde Cygnus X-2 firmware, on a scene where the tone was quite clean, just a hint of breakup. Didn’t realize I was playing that scene so long that my volume was actually rolled down and it was actually a pretty crunchy amp setting.

Ye olde dynamics and touch response is awesome.

I've always wanted to try a real Plexi or JCM 800 (maybe the SC20 with the price drop) because I just love how it cleans up in the fractal. I'm assuming the same goes for the amp but you can go from beautiful cleans to rock just with your guitar volume

 

[James Freeman]

We’re just going to change the word “reset” to “Put something in my mouth” with the curse filter.

The Great Put something in my mouth is coming.
You'll not own the amp or the room and you'll be happy.

 

[holoholo]

The Great Put something in my mouth is coming.

 

[Mongillo19]

Yeah, but it's the non-modded one you'd be getting. The SC20H isn't a super high gain head. Not like the 800 Modded or #34. I love it though.

Definitely. As with any amp I own, a boost/SD would be out front

 

[Mongillo19]

Axe-Fx III Firmware 25.00 Public Beta #2 (Cygnus X-3 Release Candidate)

https://www.fractalaudio.com/downloads/firmware-presets/axe-fx-3/25p0/axefxiii_dsp_rel_25p00_beta3.zip Axe-Fx III Firmware Release Notes 25.00 New “Cygnus X-3” amp modeling: Improved preamp algorithms. Improved power amp algorithms. Improved output transformer loss modeling. Improved preamp...

forum.fractalaudio.com

Axe-Fx III Firmware Release Notes

25.00

New “Cygnus X-3” amp modeling:

Improved preamp algorithms.
Improved power amp algorithms.
Improved output transformer loss modeling.
Improved preamp supply voltage modeling.
Nearly all amp models have been “remastered” as a result of new measurement techniques and analytical methods.
As a consequence of the new modeling many default parameter values have been changed. Existing presets are automatically updated to the new parameter values upon recall. The updated parameters are:

Preamp Low Cut Freq
Preamp Hi Cut Freq
Triode1/2 Plate Frequency
All Cathode Follower parameters
Preamp Bias
Preamp Bias Excursion
PI Bias Excursion
Power Tube Bias Excursion
Transformer LF/HF
Transformer Drive
Power Tube Grid Bias
Cathode Resistance
Cathode Time Constant
Negative Feedback
Supply Sag
Added “Sunrise Splendor” Drive model. Existing model renamed “Sunrise Splendor Hi-Cut” to denote that the Hi-Cut switch is engaged.

Improved Input block Noise Gate.

Improved Classic Expander and Modern Expander types in Gate block.

Fixed wrong Miller capacitance value in Deluxe Verb Vibrato, Double Verb Vibrato, Super Verb Vibrato and all Vibrato Verb models.

Fixed wrong FX loop recovery gain in Suhr Badger models.

Fixed global settings not recalled if MIDI data is present on the MIDI In jack during bootup.

Various other fixes and improvements.

Praise be

 

[GTR37]

Axe-Fx III Firmware 25.00 Public Beta #2 (Cygnus X-3 Release Candidate)

https://www.fractalaudio.com/downloads/firmware-presets/axe-fx-3/25p0/axefxiii_dsp_rel_25p00_beta3.zip Axe-Fx III Firmware Release Notes 25.00 New “Cygnus X-3” amp modeling: Improved preamp algorithms. Improved power amp algorithms. Improved output transformer loss modeling. Improved preamp...

forum.fractalaudio.com

Axe-Fx III Firmware Release Notes

25.00

New “Cygnus X-3” amp modeling:

Improved preamp algorithms.
Improved power amp algorithms.
Improved output transformer loss modeling.
Improved preamp supply voltage modeling.
Nearly all amp models have been “remastered” as a result of new measurement techniques and analytical methods.
As a consequence of the new modeling many default parameter values have been changed. Existing presets are automatically updated to the new parameter values upon recall. The updated parameters are:

Preamp Low Cut Freq
Preamp Hi Cut Freq
Triode1/2 Plate Frequency
All Cathode Follower parameters
Preamp Bias
Preamp Bias Excursion
PI Bias Excursion
Power Tube Bias Excursion
Transformer LF/HF
Transformer Drive
Power Tube Grid Bias
Cathode Resistance
Cathode Time Constant
Negative Feedback
Supply Sag
Added “Sunrise Splendor” Drive model. Existing model renamed “Sunrise Splendor Hi-Cut” to denote that the Hi-Cut switch is engaged.

Improved Input block Noise Gate.

Improved Classic Expander and Modern Expander types in Gate block.

Fixed wrong Miller capacitance value in Deluxe Verb Vibrato, Double Verb Vibrato, Super Verb Vibrato and all Vibrato Verb models.

Fixed wrong FX loop recovery gain in Suhr Badger models.

Fixed global settings not recalled if MIDI data is present on the MIDI In jack during bootup.

Various other fixes and improvements.

Praise be

I figured that was coming
It’s a good move I think forcing the reset , you can always roll back if it is not working for you

 

[Mongillo19]

I figured that was coming
It’s a good move I think forcing the reset , you can always roll back if it is not working for you

I've also been seeing some interesting hints from beta testers on a FM3 post about the QC how the end of this beta firmware may hold something big? Could be reading too much into it but I'm curious

 

[Whizzinby]

 

[iaresee]

I figured that was coming
It’s a good move I think forcing the reset , you can always roll back if it is not working for you

Or just note your settings and reset them on those parameters after updating. Save the preset and you're done.

 

[FracKing]

I've also been seeing some interesting hints from beta testers on a FM3 post about the QC how the end of this beta firmware may hold something big? Could be reading too much into it but I'm curious

I wouldn't read anything into it or he may do it again It was more than one...?
I think one simply meant they will hear what others can already hear on the III and FM9 to some degree.

 

[Mongillo19]

I wouldn't read anything into it or he may do it again It was more than one...?
I think one simply meant they will hear what others can already hear on the III and FM9 to some degree.

Yeah I'm starting to think you're right considering this new beta is a release candidate which I think means it's essentially done.

 

[metropolis_4]

I watched that clip and without seeing any text immediately thought "That's Jack Zucker!"


I've got to disagree. Edit: Oops! I just saw that the clip was made on a FM9. Clearly your post was tongue in cheek.

I dialed in an absolutely killer Jazz tone on my FM3. Better than anything I ever got out of a tube amp including my '65 Super Reverb.

When I decided to sell it I copied it on my FM9. Maybe due to the firmware version difference or whatever it didn't sound exactly the same but still sounds excellent.

As a result I'm seriously concerned about doing a firmware update on the FM9. I'd really like to have gapless switching but under no circumstances want to lose this magical Jazz preset I stumbled into.

Anyway, the Axe FX can do real Jazz tones. It absolutely nails the Wes Montgomery holy grail tone I was looking for.

Yeah, jazz tones are something I had a little harder time dialing in on my AxeFX, but they’re definitely in there!

My favorites are usually to not use an amp block and use the preamp of the cab block instead

 

[Stratzrus]

I've always wanted to try a real Plexi or JCM 800 (maybe the SC20 with the price drop) because I just love how it cleans up in the fractal. I'm assuming the same goes for the amp but you can go from beautiful cleans to rock just with your guitar volume

I had a NMV Model 1959 JCM 800 full stack that sounded absolutely glorious when cranked. The problem was that to get into the sweet spot it was at earsplitting volumes.

I'd start out with the volume at 11:00 and after a couple of cold ones slowly turned it up over the course of an hour until the tone was killer, around 2:00 on the volume knob.

Problem was that after I stopped playing my ears rang for hours.

So to save my hearing, with much regret to this day, I took it to 30th Street Guitars in NYC and sold it. But that was the best Rock tone I ever had.

I wouldn't describe the cleans as beautiful, never liked the Marshall cleans, so rolling back the volume never happened. I just kept turning it up.

 

[laxu]

I've always wanted to try a real Plexi or JCM 800 (maybe the SC20 with the price drop) because I just love how it cleans up in the fractal. I'm assuming the same goes for the amp but you can go from beautiful cleans to rock just with your guitar volume

That is one of the things I love about their sound.

Marshall Plexis are pretty underrated for cleans too, I actually use the Vintage channel on my BluGuitar Amp 1 for cleans quite a bit by just rolling down the guitar volume enough until it gets to that "hairy clean" territory where playing softly it's clean but playing a bit harder it breaks up just a tiny bit. That, with single coil pickups is just a great sound.

Real Plexis and JCM800s are just pretty impractical amps without involving attenuators so if you want something like that, just save yourself grief and get a modern master volume take on them.

 

[PorcinePicker]

Well, I finally dipped my toes in the water. Did a full backup, loaded beta 3, and....I'm really not sure.

Of what I've tried, the cleans sound distinctly better to me. The gained tones are woolier (?) in the mids, but also a bit more tame (?) and everything feels more quiet (not a level thing) and controlled. I'm struggling for words to describe something subtle.

None of that aligns with what I've heard anyone else say, so I must be doing it wrong. First impression is that it's a step sideways, and I was so happy with 24.05 that I kinda want to get back to it....?

 

[eggpl@nt]

None of that aligns with what I've heard anyone else say, so I must be doing it wrong. First impression is that it's a step sideways, and I was so happy with 24.05 that I kinda want to get back to it....?

Don't worry too much about what others say. I've read a mind-numbing number of "wow this sounds so much better/different" comments on firmware release threads, only for Cliff to say "there were no changes to the modeling."

Personally, I've not noticed a big change between 24.05 and the 25 betas. But I'm also not looking for them, so take that as you will.

 

[PorcinePicker]

Personally, I've not noticed a big change between 24.05 and the 25 betas.

This. Whatever is going on is really understated.

Actually, it may be that much of what I'm perceiving is a shift from 35% humidity to 60% over the past day or two.

It's hard not to jump to conclusions when actively trying to listen for something.

 

[BenIfin]

Well, I finally dipped my toes in the water. Did a full backup, loaded beta 3, and....I'm really not sure.

Of what I've tried, the cleans sound distinctly better to me. The gained tones are woolier (?) in the mids, but also a bit more tame (?) and everything feels more quiet (not a level thing) and controlled. I'm struggling for words to describe something subtle.

None of that aligns with what I've heard anyone else say, so I must be doing it wrong. First impression is that it's a step sideways, and I was so happy with 24.05 that I kinda want to get back to it....?

I'm paraphrasing what Cliff has said a few times ..... and I'm not a Fractal user anymore ..... but CX3 is a significantly different sounding FW that changes the sounds for many Amps ... as such some / many / most Pre-Sets will need to be re-tweaked to sound "right".

So running a pre-CX3 pre-set with the post-CX3 FW but using the pre-CX3 settings will sound "different".

If I were a Fractal user .... if Cliff is saying upfront that this new CX3 is a big change ..... I would load CX3 ... reset my Amp Block and re-tweak the tone(s).

Just my 2c worth.

Ben

 

[PorcinePicker]

Just put the Axe3 on beta 3 side by side with my FM9 on 6.0. Switching back and forth between identical patches on the two units, I take it all back. The new is better.