Fender Tone Master Pro: Episode IV - A New Hope

[Frodebro]

The small number of amp models in the TMP at launch was not an issue for me, but what did kill the sale was no global volume via expression pedal, and Marshall models that didn’t hold up to the competition. Just two little things, but they were important enough to me that the money went for an FM9T instead.

Well, those two things and getting thread banned from the TMP thread at TOP after one of their shills came after me. That’s the part that put them on my “will NEVEr own” list, right next to the Quad Cortex. Cliff may be occasionally gruff with idiots online, but at least you know that he’s not importing shills to bolster the image of his products.

 

[ChordInversion]

You say you have a serious demand for a certain Fender amp. Or for multiple ones. If there was no modeling, would you purchase the hardware version?

It's not practical for me to own that many amps. I could spend the money, but I don't have the space. See my other post about my use case.

 

[ian_dissonance]

I think a Fender-only amp modeler would have to come in well under the TMP retail price and it probably wouldn’t sell enough to warrant continued support. It really does seem like some people want to have every amp in their modeler just because, not for any practical purpose. At some point just make some music.

 

[ChordInversion]

I think a Fender-only amp modeler would have to come in well under the TMP retail price and it probably wouldn’t sell enough to warrant continued support.

Oh, Fender-only would not be viable, I agree. But Fender leading on Fender seems pretty plausible to me. I also think that, for instance, a high gain-focused modeler (or its opposite) could possibly succeed.

It really does seem like some people want to have every amp in their modeler just because, not for any practical purpose.

I'm sure they exist, yes. Although a lot of those people have moved on to collecting captures.

At some point just make some music.

Which people like me did before getting a modeler, while owning a modeler, and after moving a modeler on. There's no either/or between making music and deciding that a given piece of gear doesn't suit you.

 

[[Nathan]]

God I just wish they would have done the SIC correctly so I could use just my IR and it would just work, every time, without me having to jack around with their stupid 4x12 cross my fingers and hope list of BS. Frigging thing would be a total knock out if that was fixed!

I know the SIC isnt perfect but Fractal has the SIC on the amp block which is essentially between the amp and IR. Isn't that achievable with the current setup like this

IMO it would be handy if they had a graphic like in AxeEdit. I mean if you're looking to impart a specific SIC the graphic shouldnt come into play... but lets be real, its just handy to visually glance. If your sound is boomy and you can see the SIC youre about to add is going to emphasise that its a time saving to just skip it and rethink.

vs

Crude re design

 

[texhex]

I know the SIC isnt perfect but Fractal has the SIC on the amp block which is essentially between the amp and IR. Isn't that achievable with the current setup like this

View attachment 43904

IMO it would be handy if they had a graphic like in AxeEdit. I mean if you're looking to impart a specific SIC the graphic shouldnt come into play... but lets be real, its just handy to visually glance. If your sound is boomy and you can see the SIC youre about to add is going to emphasise that its a time saving to just skip it and rethink.

View attachment 43905 vs View attachment 43906

Crude re design
View attachment 43907

The problem is that when I have the SIC set to NONE my IR sounds totally different (really muffled and flat) depending on the particular amp I'm using. If I change the SIC to say 4x12 Britt GB (even though my IR is of a Mesa Oversized 4x12 with V30s) all of a sudden the IR comes to life and sounds closer to like it should.

For example the Plexi in the TMP sounds like crap with my IR when the SIC is set to NONE:

But when all I do is change the SIC to Britt GB (keep in mind my IR is of a Mesa Oversized cab with v30s) the Amp + IR sound closer to what the IR sounds like when I use it with the Model in the AXE or Tonex or Kemper, etc.

If I use my same IR with the TMP BE100 model and set the SIC to NONE, my IR sounds like it is supposed to sound and matched the aforementioned Modelers, etc.

The only way I would have figured this out was by A/B testing the TMP vs the other devices and wondering what the heck was up with the Plexi when the SIC was set to NONE vs 4x12 Britt GB.

Other Amps in the TMP do the exact same thing and I've found that I have to audition all the included SICs until I land on one that works with my IR. For example the Tangerine 4x12 V30 seems to work in cases where the 4x12 GB doesn't sound right.

I can only attribute this odd IR behavior to the way Fender implemented the SIC. None of my other devices (AXE, Tonex, Kemper, Helix Native) have any trouble with my IR, it sounds the same across all the other devices, except for the TMP.

Maybe I'm doing something wrong. Here's the IR I'm using, try it out and see if you have the same experience.

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

 

[[Nathan]]

Maybe I'm doing something wrong. Here's the IR I'm using, try it out and see if you have the same experience.

Thats pretty weird and a hard one to easily say whats going on. On the surface the blocks suggest its doing what it's doing, but you're kind of saying some models seem to have the SIC built into them and dont need the SIC block, but others seem to massively need the SIC block, tough one.

I'll have a deeper look at the same sort of thing here, might take me a couple days to get into the weeds with it but I'll have a look. I pretty much use the same one or two IRs that I've imported and just mess around with the SIC until its good to go. Havent really given it some deep tests like what you've got here.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

In Fractal units the SIC affects the poweramp response, with TMP, I believe it’s just an IR applied afterwards but I don’t think the actual poweramp modelling changes at all (the poweramp has no way of “knowing” what’s being used in the cab block).

 

[BenIfin]

Just because you don’t get the nuances between them doesn’t mean others don’t.

Someone who spent their life playing jazz standards might think all high gain sounds the same and there’s no reason for more than one high gain modern amp to exist. Someone who spent their life playing metal would probably disagree

Well it was meant to be *a little bit* tongue in cheek :)

 

[metropolis_4]

Well it was meant to be *a little bit* tongue in cheek :)

It’s hard to tell these days. I see comments in forums now from people who don’t seem to have experience playing the real Fender amps assuming they’re all the same clean tone.

I even see comments from people who think Fender amps are only for clean tones.

We’re in an era where less and less players have experience playing real amps and many have only played digital models of the real amps.

 

[Mongillo19]

It’s hard to tell these days. I see comments in forums now from people who don’t seem to have experience playing the real Fender amps assuming they’re all the same clean tone.

I even see comments from people who think Fender amps are only for clean tones.

We’re in an era where less and less players have experience playing real amps and many have only played digital models of the real amps.

Hit em with the Ride the Lightning on a fender amp, Met

 

[JiveTurkey]

So much low gain tone

 

[metropolis_4]

So much low gain tone

Yours?

 

[JiveTurkey]

Yours?

I wish!

 

[mikah912]

So much low gain tone

That's crazy. I've never heard a Prosonic sound like that. The Focus pedal is a mid-boost, but had no idea it could get it to that.

I mean, the only non-5153 Fender I've ever really seen get to "the br000tz" is the Machete. I'd be fine with them adding that to the TMP, but truthfully there are a ton of more notable gainers I'd rather see added first.

Heck, what's in there now is sufficient for pretty much everything rock and metal that I personally do, but there's never really "enough", is there?

 

[JiveTurkey]

That's crazy. I've never heard a Prosonic sound like that. The Focus pedal is a mid-boost, but had no idea it could get it to that.

I mean, the only non-5153 Fender I've ever really seen get to "the br000tz" is the Machete. I'd be fine with them adding that to the TMP, but truthfully there are a ton of more notable gainers I'd rather see added first.

Heck, what's in there now is sufficient for pretty much everything rock and metal that I personally do, but there's never really "enough", is there?

All I've EVER heard it to sound like is this. And Matthias Jabs

 

[dronerstone]

That's crazy. I've never heard a Prosonic sound like that. The Focus pedal is a mid-boost, but had no idea it could get it to that.

I mean, the only non-5153 Fender I've ever really seen get to "the br000tz" is the Machete. I'd be fine with them adding that to the TMP, but truthfully there are a ton of more notable gainers I'd rather see added first.

Heck, what's in there now is sufficient for pretty much everything rock and metal that I personally do, but there's never really "enough", is there?

The Prosonic can indeed get pretty brutal.

 

[mikah912]

I only heard it being used in a "rock" context (JCM800-ish levels of gain), but it sounded good.

It'd be great if Fender got that or the Machete in the TMP, but again....the pitchforks would come out from people like Chord Inversion wondering how the holy hell could they do that when they haven't modeled the '69 blonde Bandmaster Tweed Reverb yet or whatever...

 

[Mikael Dez]

Always give props to the poo switches. Not something I'll revisit. I can see someone without a sense of FOMO being fine with it? That's not me

What is a poo switch?

 

[ChordInversion]

I only heard it being used in a "rock" context (JCM800-ish levels of gain), but it sounded good.

It'd be great if Fender got that or the Machete in the TMP, but again....the pitchforks would come out from people like Chord Inversion wondering how the holy hell could they do that when they haven't modeled the '69 blonde Bandmaster Tweed Reverb yet or whatever...

I'd actually kind of like it. I listed it in posts 1788 and 1790. But don't let factual reality stop you for speaking on someone else's behalf. :)