NDSP Quad Cortex

[northern_fox]

I never understood the “this modeler is darker/brighter” statements because I see them as ‘YOU make them darker/brighter with IR’s/settings”. Is this in a comparative “I used the same IR w/ the same settings and came to this conclusion” sense, or….not?

IMO the factory IR's are pretty dark, relatively speaking (or at least the ones I usually try) so that may be responsible for the perception.

 

[TheTrueZoltan!]

If you think FAS stuff is dark; just grab a Dyna-Cab and your ears will open right up \m/

Yeah, the DynaCabs seem to be significantly brighter than the IRs from other companies. But if amp models sound so dark that they need unusual bright IRs to compensate the darkness… that doesn’t make much sense to me, because I still want to use my usual 3rd party IRs.

 

[Aleksi]

Yeah, the DynaCabs seem to be significantly brighter than the IRs from other companies. But if amp models sound so dark that they need unusual bright IRs to compensate the darkness… that doesn’t make much sense to me, because I still want to use my usual 3rd party IRs.

I did an A/B shoot out of the QC and FM3 before selling the QC. Using the exact same IR, the sounds were super close on many of the matching amp models at near identical settings. Some of the QC amp models were harder to match, but I got closer by switching to a resistive load SIC. I didn't test every single amp, though. Fractal models aren't any darker or brighter than any other fairly accurate models. The QC cabs, just like @northern_fox pointed out, are pretty dark.

 

[northern_fox]

I did an A/B shoot out of the QC and FM3 before selling the QC. Using the exact same IR, the sounds were super close on many of the matching amp models at near identical settings. Some of the QC amp models were harder to match, but I got closer by switching to a resistive load SIC. I didn't test every single amp, though. Fractal models aren't any darker or brighter than any other fairly accurate models. The QC cabs, just like @northern_fox pointed out, are pretty dark.

I meant the factory FAS cabs but also I agree about the QC lol

 

[Aleksi]

I meant the factory FAS cabs but also I agree about the QC lol

I've found fas dynacabs a bit brighter and qc cabs darker. I like a darker sound if only to keep my tinnitus in check

 

[Jarick]

Thnx for the feedback.

Are there also “make it analog” controls?..like..I think it’s called “flutter”

There’s high and low cuts and modulation. But it doesn’t sound super analog to me.

The basic analog delay I like quite a bit because there’s a width control that adds a little bit of stereo spread. But it’s not a character delay.

other units definitely have more to offer for interesting effect tones.

I haven’t tried a halo yet (I’d love to) but my take is fractal can probably nail it 99%, helix can probably get there 90%, and QC may only be 50%.

Of course if you just stack the delay and reverb you can get a cool but different sound.

 

[Jarick]

@AFKAEjay okay I put the hx stomp in the loop of the QC today.

I found that the mix level of QC doesn’t work normally. Usually 50% mix means equal parts dry and wet but actually QC is closer to 75% for some reason. So delays always sounded super quiet to me, that’s why.

When I bump the mix way up then it sounds a lot better, and kind of closer to hx. The helix still sounds more analog and lush but it’s much closer.

 

[Mongillo19]

@AFKAEjay okay I put the hx stomp in the loop of the QC today.

I found that the mix level of QC doesn’t work normally. Usually 50% mix means equal parts dry and wet but actually QC is closer to 75% for some reason. So delays always sounded super quiet to me, that’s why.

When I bump the mix way up then it sounds a lot better, and kind of closer to hx. The helix still sounds more analog and lush but it’s much closer.

Oh man I'm getting flashbacks to trying to get the QC loop to work well with certain pedals lol

 

[mbenigni]

Would de routing options allow to construct a stereo analog delay with crossfeedback…using 2 of those analog delays?

Kemper does a good “Halo” also btw

Note there are also Tape Delay blocks (mono and stereo variations) that are probably closer to what you're looking for. These include wow, flutter, drive, and ping-pong parameters. This is a single-head delay, though - in ms or tempo-based. You could easily run two of them on parallel paths, with adjustable stereo positioning, but I don't think you'd be able to control crosstalk.

 

[Jarick]

So I spent the morning comparing several effects across the two and the QC is very much in the ballpark. I wouldn’t see a need to get a second unit in unless it’s a speciality model like the Halo.

Really the one thing that’s missing for me is the scale option in stereo delays. QC models sometimes have width which adds a little stereo separation or ping pong which is 50%. Would be better to just have a scale function and that would allow you to do ping pong or slight width of dotted eighth or whatever.

 

[JiveTurkey]

No dual detune, correct?

 

[mikah912]

So I spent the morning comparing several effects across the two and the QC is very much in the ballpark. I wouldn’t see a need to get a second unit in unless it’s a speciality model like the Halo.

Really the one thing that’s missing for me is the scale option in stereo delays. QC models sometimes have width which adds a little stereo separation or ping pong which is 50%. Would be better to just have a scale function and that would allow you to do ping pong or slight width of dotted eighth or whatever.

The two areas where the QC (as of FW 1.5, I think?) was very much not "in the ballpark" for me were two I use all of the time: Spring reverb and super-spacey reverbs that preserve a lot of clarity/dry signal as well.

I had hope when Neural announced several "space-themed" reverbs as being part of the launch lineup, but you know.....

Performance issues.

In all seriousness, I used to record stuff mostly dry and apply Eventide reverb plugins in my DAW after the fact, but the FM9 reverbs (even before FW6 redux) were so good that I started printing to my tracks.

 

[TubeStack]

@AFKAEjay okay I put the hx stomp in the loop of the QC today.

I found that the mix level of QC doesn’t work normally. Usually 50% mix means equal parts dry and wet but actually QC is closer to 75% for some reason. So delays always sounded super quiet to me, that’s why.

When I bump the mix way up then it sounds a lot better, and kind of closer to hx. The helix still sounds more analog and lush but it’s much closer.

Yes, I found I need to turn the mix way higher on QC delays, too. Like, 45-50 on HX needs to be 60-65 on QC, or something like that.

Also, on a related note (probably already mentioned this?): the QC FX loop block has a 4.5 db boost that needs to be reduced to maintain unity level. This boost doesn't happen if you use separate send/return blocks. Apparently NDSP is aware, but nothing has been done (surprise).

 

[mbenigni]

In my mind:
2 delays on 2 parallel paths. 100% wet
Splitter after both… on to mains path, one feeding the other delay.

I think that’s the halo trick…would that be possible?

I'm not 100% sure, but based on my half-assed efforts just now, I would guess no. The ability to route outputs back to inputs is relatively limited. If you're familiar with HX routing, QC is about the same.

 

[timbuck3]

seems qc is still pretty far behind in updates that were promised at launch. The tmp in new so fender seems to have a good shot at continued support in the next year at least. Fractal is always forging ahead Line 6 updating the helix after like 9 yrs is amazing.

 

[la szum]

That fits with my experience using them.

It felt and sounded to me like they designed it to enhance the thump and chug of high gain amps, but they apply that “sheen” to all the amp models. And it does not work with some of them. Like the Vox models.

The AC30 in the QC sounds like a caricature of an AC30 made by someone who has the vaguest idea of what an AC30 is, but has never actually heard one

I won't look for it.... but it is on the Fractal Forum and it reminded me of Modern Music Production
in general---where the lows and highs are hyped and the middle sounds and feels empty as a result.

The graph reflects that artificial enhancement. You know, a little post-production tweaking on the algos.

 

[la szum]

I’ve alway been curious about these statements but never drilled down on it before. Since you’re a logical individual, here’s my chance

I never understood the “this modeler is darker/brighter” statements because I see them as ‘YOU make them darker/brighter with IR’s/settings”. Is this in a comparative “I used the same IR w/ the same settings and came to this conclusion” sense, or….not?

It makes me think of Cliff’s quote in regards to Bogner’s being dark, something along the lines of “People say Bogner’s are dark, but turn up the treble knob and you’ll find they aren’t dark at all”. Mainly because the 2nd or 3rd day I had my Shiva, I was playing and thought, “Man, this IS a pretty dark amp….maybe too dark”, then realized I nudged the Presence knob back when plugging in, turned it back up and laughed at myself.

If I have to crank the Presence and the Treble to get the amp to not be too dark then
it is too dark.

I get what you are saying, though. I am still a firm believer in bona fide differences,
even if you can technically put an EQ in the Loop to match very different sounding amps.

Just like there are different amps with different feels (stiffer versus squishier, dry and tight
versus warm and loose) I still feel amp's have different voices. Some are shrill Sopranos. Some
are beastly Baritones.

 

[la szum]

But what’s the control in this situation? What cab/speakers is the real amp played through? The same IR/power amp and cab? No one ever says this stuff, just blanket “It’s dark”…..in what context?

"Just put more Vanilla in your Chocolate and stop saying your Chocolate is too dark. Duh!!" Drew.

 

[Jarick]

No dual detune, correct?

Correct. Well, there's a pitch block but like most everything it doesn't compare with Fractal to me.

The two areas where the QC (as of FW 1.5, I think?) was very much not "in the ballpark" for me were two I use all of the time: Spring reverb and super-spacey reverbs that preserve a lot of clarity/dry signal as well.

I had hope when Neural announced several "space-themed" reverbs as being part of the launch lineup, but you know.....

Performance issues.

In all seriousness, I used to record stuff mostly dry and apply Eventide reverb plugins in my DAW after the fact, but the FM9 reverbs (even before FW6 redux) were so good that I started printing to my tracks.

Makes sense. I can't stand spring reverb and rarely use big spacey reverbs so haven't dug into those.

 

[Whizzinby]

I like the POG-like tones from the pitch block on the QC. It’s actually one of the effects I really dug on it. Would be better if it was polyphonic though, doesn’t handle chords great, but tbh few of them do.