Modeller enthusiasts who can't dial in patches

[Stratzrus]

I've never purchased a preset from a vendor but don't have anything against those who do.

If it works for them, who am I to judge?

 

[TSJMajesty]

I don't see much love mentioned for the 384 factory presets you get in a Fractal. And the Gift of Tone series from several noteworthy players.

I don't know the finer points of dialing in a preset from scratch, but I know how to dial in an amp, and adjust the mix, feedback, & time of a delay unit, so I just start with the (fantastic) factory presets and tweak those to my liking.

So on a personal level, I just can't see paying for presets, since I've sort of already done so, when I bought the Axe III, in terms of all the free ones included.

And I've read more than a few newb-posts asking, essentially, "I just un-boxed my unit..., who makes the best 3rd-party presets?", without even giving the factory ones a try.

And yeah, I understand that some of those people may have had bad experiences with factory presets in the past, but they no doubt understand that the tech is ever-improving, so why wouldn't they think that also applies to pre-packaged presets?

 

[dronerstone]

To anyone owning a modeler, yet saying "I can't", I recommend you start building your own with the basics, simplicity is important if you want to know how to create from scratch.

Choose an amp/cab first, maybe start with something that you know or have played in real life, and tweak that until it sounds the way you'd expect.

If you're satisfied with the amp, try and find a drive/boost. Again, it's perfectly fine if you don't go all-in yet, and stick to stuff that you already know in real life. TS, SD-1, Big Muff, Fuzz Face, most people should know what they'll get here.

Then, add reverb, delay, mod, etc. Once more, stay in well-known territory if that feels more comfy.

By now, you've probably played a bit, and low self-consciousness with the modeler shouldn't be an issue anymore.

At this point, you could very well increase the surprises and check out other models. Any pedals/amps you've always wanted to play? Maybe they're in there...

Imagine... What would you do if you were in a music store, completely on your own?

Dive in deep, get creative, go crazy!!! BUT: Don't rush it.

PS: And don't forget to take a look at routing options, fx loops, auto on/off, snapshots/scenes. Most modelers are pretty capable these days.

 

[Orvillain]

That is my 4-cable-method template. With each block having its own settings in channel A, B, C, and D.

 

[texhex]

View attachment 19076

That is my 4-cable-method template. With each block having its own settings in channel A, B, C, and D.

How much did you pay for it?

 

[Orvillain]

How much did you pay for it?

tree fiddy

 

[Rock Chalk]

some truly awful sounding patches

Just curious how you know this?

 

[Rock Chalk]

tree fiddy

You got took!

 

[FuzzyAce]

I think it depends on what you do with music and how valuable your time is to you. I can totally get how someone would invest $20-$100 for presets, especially if you're playing more in-the-box and/or using a full range cab live. I haven't purchased any but if did I'd pick some that were more specific and useable for my needs. A lot of the stock presets that come with Helix for example are all over the board (purposely I'm sure) and most I have no use for, but quite a few are good starting points or at least helpful examples of effect routing. With that said, my favorite amp tones are the ones I've built from the ground up.

 

[FuzzyAce]

A client and good friend of my shop bought one of the more expensive packs, and was rightly pissed at how bad they were. He brought his Helix in, and basically had me redo what he wanted for his setlist, since the paid presets were not good.
I mean, people can like what they like; it’s all subjective. But just because it’s a “big name in presets” doesn’t mean it’s a slamdunk for being happy with the tones. That’s all.

Did he pay you to make new presets?

 

[FuzzyAce]

Normally they do, but not this particular person. This was actually the start of a string of paid work though, which was cool. Word of mouth and all.

It makes more sense this way if the client is there to test.

 

[Rock Chalk]

And to tell you exactly what they want. I’ve found that people typically don’t need dozens of patches for a gig. They need a handful of great ones.

But doesn't it make you sad that they're paying someone to twist the knobs when Leon has showed them how?

 

[FuzzyAce]

You don't see the difference? I get what you're getting at, and yeah it'd be better for them to just learn it themselves, but there's a big difference between a $99 bundle of shit, and actually being there in the flesh, getting exactly what they want.

And it's more than about the money imo -- like you said it's being there in the flesh making decisions that are more purposefully driven.

 

[jay mitchell]

The other significant difference is I show them how it all works too. Teach a man to fish, and all.

My experience with teaching has been that some people really don't want to know how to find the answer to a question; instead, they want you to just tell them the answer and will even get offended at your efforts to convey real, useful knowledge to them. FWIW, I am deeply skeptical of any assertions about how a piece of gear sounds when it's being made by someone who uses storebought presets.

 

[Rock Chalk]

You don't see the difference? I get what you're getting at, and yeah it'd be better for them to just learn it themselves, but there's a big difference between a $99 bundle of shit, and actually being there in the flesh, getting exactly what they want.

EDIT

The other significant difference is I show them how it all works too. Teach a man to fish, and all.

I absolutely see the difference between buying patches and being shown how to build them. What I don't see though, is the difference between Leon showing them, or someone else. I mean, come on..........

Come on, guy. Leon Todd showed you how to do it. HE SHOWED YOU.

 

[ragingplatypi]

If you’re amplifying it with anything other than what the patch was created on it’s already a lottery as to whether it is any use. Make your own and definitely don’t buy any.

That’s pretty much every musical instrument that doesn’t include its own speakers and power amp though

 

[Eagle]

That’s pretty much every musical instrument that doesn’t include its own speakers and power amp though

No but it also means other people’s presets are bs.

 

[la szum]

That’s pretty much why paid presets don’t make any sense to me.

Yup. It's not factoring in the greatest difference makers that change with
every person---and that is the method of monitoring and power. One
could also viably suggest that the room matters, too, and how all that
can generate more or less low end, brightness, mud, or mayhem.

Then start factoring in pickups and their differences in output and how
hard (or not hard!) they hit the front end of any of our devices and I can't
fathom how someone building presets with their rig would ever work for
me and my situation.

We don't live in the confines of a universal constant. Variables are variable
and can make ALL the difference in the world.

 

[TSJMajesty]

Yup. It's not factoring in the greatest difference makers that change with
every person---and that is the method of monitoring and power. One
could also viably suggest that the room matters, too, and how all that
can generate more or less low end, brightness, mud, or mayhem.

Then start factoring in pickups and their differences in output and how
hard (or not hard!) they hit the front end of any of our devices and I can't
fathom how someone building presets with their rig would ever work for
me and my situation.

We don't live in the confines of a universal constant. Variables are variable
and can make ALL the difference in the world.

Absolutely! Even free ones.

I'm convinced the JP Rig preset clips. I discovered it in one of the clean scenes, and I'm using the same exact guitar it was created with, into headphones. And it's NOT the phones doing the clipping.

 

[JiveTurkey]

Absolutely! Even free ones.

I'm convinced the JP Rig preset clips. I discovered it in one of the clean scenes, and I'm using the same exact guitar it was created with, into headphones. And it's NOT the phones doing the clipping.

Isn't it the compressor block in that preset? I thought this mystery was solved but maybe I am misremebering