Helix Talk

[the swede]

Very neat! What are you using the dual switch for?

Good question

Also serves a reminder for the overly-entitled that this is NOT Helix.

It’s like Grogu… it’s a Line 6 Grogu.
People want to call it baby Helix… but it’s a Pod

 

[Alex Kenivel]

I want to do this for the helix! Do you know if I'd need momentary for this?

AFAIK there's no way to use these switches to gain more FS controls with a Helix

 

[pipelineaudio]

AFAIK there's no way to use these switches to gain more FS controls with a Helix

I think I saw where people where plugging switches into the exp jacks and may have needed a resistor added to do it

 

[Rewolf]

Switches like that are internally seen as expression 2 and 3. With only heel and toe down positions.

They can be used to change lots of settings. But not switch snapshots or patches.

 

[James Freeman]

As we know, Mark IV Lead channel was modeled with the Presence PUSHED, but the classic IIC+/III poweramp response is when the Presence is PULLED.
Luckily we already have a Mark IV poweramp model that has the Presence Pulled, it's the Rhythm 1 model, all we need is to be able to route the Lead Preamp into the Rhythm 1 Poweramp, that's how your get proper Metallica and Petrucci IIC+ tones.

Graphs of Presence behavior difference between Rhythm 1 (Pulled) and Lead (Pushed) channels.
You'll quickly notice why 99% of Mark IV players prefer the Presence Pulled for the original IIC+/III response.

This post is an addendum to these posts:

3.6 When ?

I certainly won’t ever complain on Line 6 about it. Putting profiling in something like the stomp may very well be an excellent idea in todays market… but I wouldn’t ever use it or ever want to. Maybe just me… But yeah, because of this I don't really get the current love affair with the ToneX...

thegearforum.com

3.6 When ?

I don't do that either because I've switched that option off. Still leaves other capacitive options intact, for whatever weird reasons. When I first got the stomp I accidently hit the capacitance switches all the time but must have gotten used to it cause I never do that now.

thegearforum.com

PS.
I love my Helix, but sometimes it pains me to know that a model could have been much better if Line 6 made a different decision regarding settings when modeling the amp.

To say this one more time, separate Poweramp models will open a world of new tones.

 

[James Freeman]

Here's some Poweramp responses of a few British models.

To measure these I first auto-EQ the Preamp model to be ruler flat, then run a sweep through the full amp models with the same setting.
Also, the input sweep is at -50dBFS, Drive at 1, and Master is at 1 so all the amps are in the linear undistorted region, you are seeing the clean response of the poweramp models due to cab load and Presence control (0-10).

I've always thought that the Cartographer full amp model sounded terrible, apparently it's the poweramp response because the Preamp model alone is lovely.
The Cartographer is the only preamp in the Helix that sounds close to a stock JCM800 preamp (still no bright cap on Drive 1 though), but the poweramp model is screwed, very unfortunate.
Needless to say that I would pair the Cartographer Preamp with other Poweramps but its own.

PS.
Graphs are useful because I can see what the problem is and confirm what I'm hearing.
You'd be surprised, I use my ears too.

PPS.
Helix has an untapped goldmine that's literally RIGHT THERE.
Line 6 ->

 

[James Freeman]

In other news, I've had enough experience with capturing to say it pales in comparison to proper component modeling + measured response.
The more versatile the amp is, the more useless capturing is as a 'model'.

Take the Placater model for example that has 4 switches (HBE, Fat, C45, Saturation), you'll have to do 8 combinations without repetition before turning a single knob, then the Master volume (or Drive with NMV amps) having the biggest influence on overall sound and saturation.

So yes, if you want a 'working' model of an amp you can create and find new tones with, forget about capturing altogether.

 

[Sascha Franck]

AFAIK there's no way to use these switches to gain more FS controls with a Helix

You can use them pretty much as a normal onboard switch.

They can be used to change lots of settings. But not switch snapshots or patches.

You can do that as well, using Command Center.

 

[James Freeman]

Having a look in the Bogner Ecstasy schematic.

Pre-EQ switch is two value bright caps on the Gain pot.
Gain Boost switch is a RC to ground after Gain pot before 2nd gain stage.
Structure is RC on 2nd gain stage cathode, another 6dB gain boost (this has to be fixed before modeling, I suggest High).
The Plexi, Ch2 and Ch3 switch is routing between 2, 3 and 4 gain stages with a Marshall tonestack at the end.
Poweramp has Pentode/Triode, Full/Half and Class A/AB switches, just go with normal Pentode, Full, Class AB like all other amps, Excursion M.
This amp can do Plexi, JCM800 and High Gain in a single channel like nobody's business.

Judging by existing models, a model of Channel Plexi+2+3 with all the switches working in a single model is very doable, it's basically RC networks and bypass switching between 4 gain stages, we have more complex and heavier models in the Helix right now.

"German Ecstasy" anyone?
Right after a JCM800, Jubilee and Dumble.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Having a look in the Bogner Ecstasy schematic.

Pre-EQ switch is two value bright caps on the Gain pot.
Gain Boost switch is a RC to ground after Gain pot before 2nd gain stage.
Structure is RC on 2nd gain stage cathode, another 6dB gain boost (this has to be fixed before modeling, I suggest High).
The Plexi, Ch2 and Ch3 switch is routing between 2, 3 and 4 gain stages with a Marshall tonestack at the end.
Poweramp has Pentode/Triode, Full/Half and Class A/AB switches, just go with normal Pentode, Full, Class AB like all other amps, Excursion M.
This amp can do Plexi, JCM800 and High Gain in a single channel like nobody's business.

Judging by existing models, a model of Channel Plexi+2+3 with all the switches working in a single model is very doable, it's basically RC networks and bypass switching between 4 gain stages, we have more complex and heavier models in the Helix right now.

"German Ecstasy" anyone?
Right after a JCM800, Jubilee and Dumble.

Line 6 already have one in their collection from the Metal Pack PodXT days I believe?

Unless they borrowed it off Reinhold. I think they're great amps, although I feel like other companies have already down very thorough emulations of it, with full GUI's and all the modes and mods. Wouldn't say no, but would be nice to see something that other companies haven't modelled yet

 

[James Freeman]

I feel like other companies have already down very thorough emulations of it..
Wouldn't say no, but would be nice to see something that other companies haven't modelled yet

Valid point, but I don't own hardware modelers from other companies, so my modeling experience is devoid from Ecstasy, hence the request.

What would you like to see MP?
Y'all know my short list already.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

As good as Jubilee’s are, let’s ask for a Wizard MCII or MTL instead. IMO it’s an improved version of the same circuit, and having models of insanely expensive stuff is more appealing than another “working man’s” Marshall. Amplitube and Softube have pretty on point emulations already but I don’t think anyone has got a Wizard right yet.

VHT/Fryette are sort of underrepresented in emulations. Pitbull 100 UL would be rad.

I’d love some kind of “build your own Jose” type model which is so much fun on Fractal units. Ability to swap the master volume position (pre or post tonestack), add gain stages/bright caps, diode clipping, depth circuits, cathode follower or plate driven tone stack etc

More Rectifier channels+modes would be good, Orange channel is so much fun and arguably benefits from the different modes more than Red.

I’d also love something Langner based - tracking down a 5 gain stage modded Marshall of his would rule but I’d settle for an MP1 (+separate VHT2150 emulation).

Valid point, but I don't own hardware modelers from other companies, so my modeling experience is devoid from Ecstasy, hence the request.

Oh i’m talking about software rather than HW modellers. Fractal has a decent emulation but amps with that many switches and modes are a bit of a nightmare on there as they tend to include each mode as a separate model and all your settings reset when going between them. Helix’s BE100 has one over Fractal in that regard (IMO).

 

[Digital Igloo]

Line 6 ->

Nope. We literally have more full-time engineers on Team Helix than we've ever had.

 

[kartikg3]

Nope. We literally have more full-time engineers on Team Helix than we've ever had.

You guys are amazing for the stuff you do for the Helix platform. For a lot us, looking forwards to the next firmware sparks a lot of joy. Thanks again! Can't wait for 3.6

 

[James Freeman]

Nope. We literally have more full-time engineers on Team Helix than we've ever had.

That's my Line 6 "motivational" meme, you know I love you all.

edit: I feel like I have to come clean, I know the huge amount of work that goes into every model, I wasn't implying anything mean spirited by that.
See it as a kid kicking and screaming on the supermarket floor begging for candy.

Wizard MCII

Had a look in the schematic, yes that's basically a Jubilee at heart with additional gain stage before V1 but without the very unique tonestack, I also don't see the Rhythm Clip.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

I also don't see the Rhythm Clip

pretty sure the lead channel has diode clipping (between 3rd and 4th stages) but not the rhythm channel.

I like the quirkiness of the Jubilee tonestack, but it sort of lends itself to dialling in some bad tones if you aren’t careful. Haven’t used a Wizard before but MCII and MTL look plate driven too. I usually find myself cranking plate driven EQ’s higher than cathode follower ones, I usually set them way different to a 2203 style amp

 

[James Freeman]

I like the quirkiness of the Jubilee tonestack, but it sort of lends itself to dialling in some bad tones if you aren’t careful. Haven’t used a Wizard before but MCII and MTL look plate driven too. I usually find myself cranking plate driven EQ’s higher than cathode follower ones, I usually set them way different to a 2203 style amp

That's another good reason to have a Jubilee in the Helix, it's like nothing else.

 

[TheTrueZoltan!]

Nope. We literally have more full-time engineers on Team Helix than we've ever had.

“50+ engineers are working tirelessly…“

 

[James Freeman]

“50+ engineers are working tirelessly…“

I've heard that all 50 take the flight from Finland to LA daily, work on the plane, when they arrive it's morning so they start working again and in the evening they take the flight back, work on the plane, when they arrive it's morning again, so they continue working 24/7.

 

[pipelineaudio]

Anyone seeing snapshot bypass states changing when saving toi helix native then back to hardware?