Fractal Talk

[toneseeker911]

You beat me to the punch!

In all seriousness, I have read the Axe-Fx III manual and blocks guide cover to cover around five times each. They contain a wealth of good information.

They do. But the unit’s UI requires constant practice to remember how to do things quickly. I remember reading about the edit button but forgot it somewhere along the way.
For a gig, that means rehearse your songs and then practice editing on the front panel

 

[KHAAAAAAANNNNNNN!!!!!!!!]

Thanks for the heads up!

I think Henning raises some good points.

I like his idea that the onboard modeler should offer favorites (and even groups of favorites like "my metal stuff" or "my blues stuff") so you can have your favorite amps, reverbs and whatnot front and center, and cram the rest somewhere out of the way. Like there's plenty of models on any modeler that I never used in every category. Some might not sound good, some I just don't care for and so on.

The guy operating it doesn't know the double-click knob shortcuts... I think he tries his best, and mostly knows what to do, but seeing that UI operated just highlights how cumbersome it is to work with. You very rarely see it in action like this because everyone uses Axe-Edit because it's easier to use (and record with screen capture).

Even worse it highlights all the bad stuff like:

• Why can't an empty preset come with IN1 -> OUT1 routed by default? That's like 90% of usecases. Yeah, you can save those empty presets like that and it's done, but it could come like that just out of convenience, and to remove some confusion for new users.
• Why can't it pick a default cab based on the amp model selected? Or at least some sensible default instead of the first legacy IR 1x4 Pig, even with the great Dyna-Cabs right there?
• Why can't you get a list of block types when adding blocks in Layout? Scrolling through them one by one is super dumb.

And many more. It's all these little "Eh, it works well enough" low hanging fruit that Fractal could fix instead of adding amp model 329, but they just put zero priority on it. That's why they need a user experience and user interface guy, someone who is passionate enough to get that stuff fixed.

I'm honestly not impressed with some of their choices on the VP4 user interface. Like you didn't plan for users wanting to reorder the blocks? Or maybe people wanting to quickly go from block to block to edit them instead of the enter-edit-exit-scroll-enter-edit-exit-scroll song that everyone hates with the Layout menu on the other units? Now any new usability features have to be shoehorned in with "just remember to hold this button, then do this other thing" that you have to learn instead of having it printed right on the unit.

That makes me worry about what their next gen box will be like, when they had a lot of existing feedback that they could have used developing the VP4 based on their existing platforms.

We're talking about starting points here. There's never going to be something that pleases everyone, but you can try to cover most users just to make it easier for them to get going. Most Fractal time effects for example come with a sensible starting setting where you only have to adjust mix a bit to get a good sound.

Think that you are someone who just bought the FM3 and wants to get started making their own presets. I'd say most users are going to have some form of IN1 - Amp - Cab - OUT1 preset, with a variety of fx around it. To me the whole adding shunts and adding utility blocks is rather unnecessary.

The Hotone Ampero 2 offers templates for routing which you can quickly swap and it will rearrange whatever blocks are in the preset into that routing. That's most routing scenarios covered with a couple of taps, instead of painstakingly adding shunts, or having to reconnect things if you move a block. Granted, the Hotone, like Helix, is way more fixed in its routing options.

The Hotone also has a toggle in its options for making the cab block track the amp block. If I pick a Marshall, it picks a suitable 4x12 Check cab for it. Pick a Mesa? 4x12 Recto and so on. This works more than well enough if people just want to quickly find a "works pretty well for this amp" cab to go with it. Prefer something else? Just turn off the option. While I wish this feature was part of the Cab block for easy toggling (instead of a global option which is a bit buried), it's an alright way to do it.

Like Henning said, most newcomers won't know what cab goes well with what, so having some curated suggestions coming from the maker of the modeler is not a bad thing to have.

Obviously being able to pick your own defaults when just loading in the effect is something that would be nice. I'd e.g load the Plexi 100 Jump at my favorite settings when I add an Amp block, a 4x12 1960TV cab with a good mic placement when I add a Cab block, a London Plate when adding Reverb etc. Atm you have to load those separately from saved favorites. Fine, it's just a few clicks on the editor...but impossible on the onboard UI.

 

[JoeBfstplk]

I only edit on the unit at a gig or rehearsal, but thats when time is especially valuable so if I can find ways to do it faster that would be great.

I get around the clunkiness of editing on the unit by taking advantage of the awesome foot switching. I’ve got a couple levels of volume boost available on switches instead of needing to turn a patch or scene up. Lots of delay and reverb options on switches, lots of gain options, mods, etc all footswitchable. The goal is to never need to touch the unit other than quickly saving something I changed in a preset scene with footswitches.

For the most part, this works. I do occasionally find myself needing to adjust something using the menus and buttons though. I’m not very fast at it though and it’s usually a little stressful…

D

Did you say, 'options'‽

 

[paisleywookiee]

I haven’t even downloaded the editor since I got my FM3.

A little time with the on device controls and it starts feeling pretty simple for the majority of tasks. A few things are still a pain

You must be REALLY good at MS Visio.

While I can understand if most of your presets are IN1->OUT2 or something you would wnat the first point, but why would you want the default cab to be the 1x4 Pig? Unless you use template presets then you have to change that every time you slap a cab block in, so I'd rather have some of the work done for me.

We're talking about starting points here. There's never going to be something that pleases everyone, but you can try to cover most users just to make it easier for them to get going. Most Fractal time effects for example come with a sensible starting setting where you only have to adjust mix a bit to get a good sound.

Think that you are someone who just bought the FM3 and wants to get started making their own presets. I'd say most users are going to have some form of IN1 - Amp - Cab - OUT1 preset, with a variety of fx around it. To me the whole adding shunts and adding utility blocks is rather unnecessary.

The Hotone Ampero 2 offers templates for routing which you can quickly swap and it will rearrange whatever blocks are in the preset into that routing. That's most routing scenarios covered with a couple of taps, instead of painstakingly adding shunts, or having to reconnect things if you move a block. Granted, the Hotone, like Helix, is way more fixed in its routing options.

The Hotone also has a toggle in its options for making the cab block track the amp block. If I pick a Marshall, it picks a suitable 4x12 Check cab for it. Pick a Mesa? 4x12 Recto and so on. This works more than well enough if people just want to quickly find a "works pretty well for this amp" cab to go with it. Prefer something else? Just turn off the option. While I wish this feature was part of the Cab block for easy toggling (instead of a global option which is a bit buried), it's an alright way to do it.

Like Henning said, most newcomers won't know what cab goes well with what, so having some curated suggestions coming from the maker of the modeler is not a bad thing to have.

Obviously being able to pick your own defaults when just loading in the effect is something that would be nice. I'd e.g load the Plexi 100 Jump at my favorite settings when I add an Amp block, a 4x12 1960TV cab with a good mic placement when I add a Cab block, a London Plate when adding Reverb etc. Atm you have to load those separately from saved favorites. Fine, it's just a few clicks on the editor...but impossible on the onboard UI.

I'm agreeing with Laxu a lot today, and that hurts. But only a little.

Did you say, 'options'‽

 

[dk_ace]

Did you say, 'options'‽

You have no idea how close I am to pulling the trigger on a similar setup lol.

D

 

[paisleywookiee]

You have no idea how close I am to pulling the trigger on a similar setup lol.

D

Yeah, I don't remotely need an FC-6, but I kinda want one.

 

[dk_ace]

Yeah, I don't remotely need an FC-6, but I kinda want one.

I can get to all the sounds I want with just the FM9, but it does require three pages of footswitch layouts to page between. The FC-6 would be more convenient by a lot.

D

 

[holoholo]

That would make me have a good one.

Have a good one

-HH

 

[iaresee]

Yeah, I don't remotely need an FC-6, but I kinda want one.

An FC6 with an FM9 is luxurious.

 

[JiveTurkey]

An FC6 with an FM9 is luxurious.

FM9 + FC12 = Blackjack

 

[dk_ace]

FM9 + FC12 = Blackjack

I definitely never considered doing that…

 

[JoeBfstplk]

An FC6 with an FM9 is luxurious.

 

[iaresee]

I definitely never considered doing that…

If you have the means, I highly recommend picking one up.

 

[metropolis_4]

With views and layouts I don’t think I would ever need that many footswitches.

It’s amazing how much you can do with only a few when you plan it out

 

[laxu]

With views and layouts I don’t think I would ever need that many footswitches.

It’s amazing how much you can do with only a few when you plan it out

My beef with fewer footswitches is that it's another set of layers to manage. That can be a chore on its own.

The FM9 or FC-12 feels like a good spot where you have plenty of footswitching to cover whatever you would need. Like you can "waste" a few footswitches for a convenient tuner or tap tempo or whatever instead of having to bury those in a hold function or another view.

 

[Rock Chalk]

If you have the means, I highly recommend picking one up.

View attachment 34908

I see what you did there...........

 

[DrewJD82]

If I were just playing guitar in bands I probably wouldn’t mind jogging from one foot controller to the other, but I’m always setting up my stuff with playing live/standing in front of a mic in mind and as it is, the FM9 is as far as I want to be stretching my legs out to hit stuff.

I have a couple jam-specific presets that’d work in the Effects layout, but overall, even when not in a band, I set up my presets/scenes by song/section and I’m only switching between the Preset/Scenes layout. Once I’m playing a song, I don’t want to leave a layout at all.

 

[paisleywookiee]

FM9 + FC12 = Blackjack

To be followed by threads "who's got a good OMG21 layout!?"


Who am I kidding. I bet that already exists on teh FAS forum.

 

[paisleywookiee]

My goal is to have an FM9 with some pedals on one board, another board with an FC12 with expression pedals, a board with a BOSS SY-1000 and GM-800, and then a board with a looper on it. And a moat with drawbridge to get to where I stand.

 

[TubeStack]

If I were just playing guitar in bands I probably wouldn’t mind jogging from one foot controller to the other, but I’m always setting up my stuff with playing live/standing in front of a mic in mind and as it is, the FM9 is as far as I want to be stretching my legs out to hit stuff.

Exactly, this is why I've stayed with the 18" wide PT Jr for so long, which I've recently switched to Nova 18, same width but more depth for stuff above the VP4 (or HXFX, Stomp, etc). Just much better to have everything closer to the mic stand.