Fender Tone Master FR-10 and FR-12 "FRFR" cabs

Had a chance to play with my new toy this afternoon. The TL;DR is i'm sold.

The pros list will be long:
  • This is a light "FRFR"! It's a good 3-4kg (~7lb) ligther than my former Powercab 112, and more compact as well - similar in length and width, but the FR-12 is about 5cm (2in) shallower. As noted, i'm pretty sure it's exactly the same size as a Hot Rod Deluxe combo. Build quality is excellent, and the thing feels sturdy as a brick.
  • Jesus H Christ on a cracker, it's LOUD. I was playing with it at home and had to keep the volume control at around two (out of ten), just so the neighbors wouldn't come over to assassinate me. 100% giggable, guaranteed.
  • Controls are super effective - particularly the high cut, which as far as i can tell, impacts the tweeter alone. Rolling it back to 9 o'clock or so seems to work great to tame harsh presets.
  • I really really really like the looks. Never been a huge fan of Fender combos tbh, but we didn't have a lot of "FRFR" choices looking, and feeling, like an amp in the way the FR-12 does.
  • Sounds amazing. Period. I went through a number of my HX Stomp XL presets with a stupid grin on my face at all times. Not that the Powercab 112 ever sounded bad, mind you, but there's definitely some mojo going on here. Everything from sparkling cleans to dimed 5150s felt great through it.

    Also, i don't know if it's psychological or not, but it feels more like an amp in the room than any other "FRFR" i've tried - particularly when paired with a suitable cab sim. Like, i hacked a quick preset using the Grammatico GSG, 1x12 US Deluxe cab and '63 Spring reverb, and at times i could swear i was playing through a tube combo.
Cons, you ask?
  • Reports are true: it IS noisy. Not horribly noisy though, but notably more than the PC 112, and fairly stable even with the output volume at zero - which leads me to believe this is a power amp issue. It could be related to grounding (which was never great where i set it up), and me using the 1/4" input as i had no XLR cable handy, but the PC 112 always behaved waaaay better with the exact same setup.

    So, be warned. If noise is a major consideration for you, you might want to look somewhere else.
  • The folding tilt-back legs are sturdy, stable, and work perfectly... but are a PITA to operate. I liked the PC 112's integrated short legs way better.
 
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I think this video accurately represents the noise difference between the FR-12 and other "FRFR" solutions.

 
Lysander said:
Had a chance to play with my new toy this afternoon. The TL;DR is i'm sold.

The pros list will be long:
  • This is a light "FRFR"! It's a good 3-4kg (~7lb) ligther than my former Powercab 112, and more compact as well - similar in length and width, but the FR-12 is about 5cm (2in) shallower. As noted, i'm pretty sure it's exactly the same size as a Hot Rod Deluxe combo. Build quality is excellent, and the thing feels sturdy as a brick.
  • Jesus H Christ on a cracker, it's LOUD. I was playing with it at home and had to keep the volume control at around two (out of ten), just so the neighbors wouldn't come over to assassinate me. 100% giggable, guaranteed.
  • Controls are super effective - particularly the high cut, which as far as i can tell, impacts the tweeter alone. Rolling it back to 9 o'clock or so seems to work great to tame harsh presets.
  • I really really really like the looks. Never been a huge fan of Fender combos tbh, but we didn't have a lot of "FRFR" choices looking, and feeling, like an amp in the way the FR-12 does.
  • Sounds amazing. Period. I went through a number of my HX Stomp XL presets with a stupid grin on my face at all times. Not that the Powercab 112 ever sounded bad, mind you, but there's definitely some mojo going on here. Everything from sparkling cleans to dimed 5150s felt great through it.

    Also, i don't know if it's psychological or not, but it feels more like an amp in the room than any other "FRFR" i've tried - particularly when paired with a suitable cab sim. Like, i hacked a quick preset using the Grammatico GSG, 1x12 US Deluxe cab and '63 Spring reverb, and at times i could swear i was playing through a tube combo.
Cons, you ask?
  • Reports are true: it IS noisy. Not horribly noisy though, but notably more than the PC 112, and fairly stable even with the output volume at zero - which leads me to believe this is a power amp issue. It could be related to grounding (which was never great where i set it up), and me using the 1/4" input as i had no XLR cable handy, but the PC 112 always behaved waaaay better with the exact same setup.

    So, be warned. If noise is a major consideration for you, you might want to look somewhere else.
  • The folding tilt-back legs are sturdy, stable, and work perfectly... but are a PITA to operate. I liked the PC 112's integrated short legs way better.
Click to expand...
Awesome glad your enjoying it are you using 1 or a pair for stereo?
 
paisleywookiee said:
Yeah that’d drive me nuts, I think. Then again, I can tend to be a bit of a head case.
Click to expand...

The thing is, I'm one of those people that would be driven nuts (and have been by other amps) but the slight noise floor hiss on this doesn't drive me nuts, so I'd say this is okay? And this is at home volume levels, which is usually the level where it would be most annoying.

Wondering if Lysander has a different noise level though. They are perhaps not all the same.
 
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JiveTurkey said:
I don't find mine that noisy? Played up loud for a long bit this evening. I LOVE the VII line out into FM into it. Fantastic.
Click to expand...
jellodog said:
Wondering if Lysander has a different noise level though. They are perhaps not all the same.
Click to expand...

You know, i've been wondering about the same, because the reports i've seen regarding noise on the FR-12 are split pretty much 50/50.

Mine definitely is - again, not a dealbreaker, but the hiss is there. I guess it can be particularly noticeable coming from a Powercab too, as those amps have a very low noise floor. My PC 112 was basically dead quiet with no input, at any volume.
 
Lysander said:
You know, i've been wondering about the same, because the reports i've seen regarding noise on the FR-12 are split pretty much 50/50.

Mine definitely is - again, not a dealbreaker, but the hiss is there. I guess it can be particularly noticeable coming from a Powercab too, as those amps have a very low noise floor. My PC 112 was basically dead quiet with no input, at any volume.
Click to expand...
I need to test it some more :unsure:
 
Having heard the noise on the YouTube video I have some thoughts about it that may or may not be borne out when I take delivery next week.

I've been wrestling with whether or not I should get a FR-10 to go along with the FR-12 I ordered. By all accounts the noise is less on the FR-10 so it may be the better choice for practicing in a silent room. I'd originally considered getting two FR-12s so that I could run them in stereo but I could use a FR-10 for that purpose just as easily or use them separately depending on what the situation calls for.

If it's just one or the other I think the FR-12 would be the better choice for me for gigging. It has a volume edge over the 10 and has more bottom end. In addition, the noise would be less of an issue for gigging since it would be inaudible at concert volume.

But do I really want to sink that much money into these given that I recently bought a Blackstar St. James that could play the role I was thinking the FR-12 could play when gigging? I wouldn't even be considering this but the St. James also has a noise issue and it was audible enough that I found it annoying. I'm concerned that the FR-12 may be no better in that regard.

So my options are:

1. Keep the FR-12 if the noise isn't a deal breaker
2. Keep the FR-12 for gigging and get a FR-10 for practicing.
3. Get a FR-10 and send the FR-12 back if the noise level is unacceptable
4. Send the FR-12 back if the noise is too much and just live with the noise of the St. James

Fortunately Sweetwater has a good return policy so I'll spend some time next week deciding whether or not I want to keep the FR-12 and if I like it enough that getting a FR-10 to go with it makes sense.

Time will tell. Either way, I'm looking forward to checking it out. By all accounts the 12 should pair well with my FM9.
 
My Powercabs are dead quiet but I wonder how loud can the Hiss be? and then is it even audible when playing ?
it should not be a deal breaker IMHO, its the tones when playing that matter

:idk
 
Stone said:
My Powercabs are dead quiet but I wonder how loud can the Hiss be?
Click to expand...

The video i posted above compares noise levels between the FR-12 and QSC CP8. I found the latter fairly representative of the PC 112 - if anything, i think Powercabs are even quieter.
 
Prior to my Powercabs I had the Headrush FR-108 and there was some Hiss more so than the PC but it would not bother me as hiss would be gone when I'm playing :)
 
I found I preferred the sound of the CP8 the Fenders to me sounded nasaly somewhat and slightly darker
but yes it shows how everything is based on ones preferences no right no bad just preference
(y)
 
I think I was reading about a Fender-supplied "hack" for the hiss at TheOtherPlace, saying that the aux input is wide open, (and it shouldn't be), when even nothing is plugged into it, and that is what is causing the noise?
 
Baba said:
I think I was reading about a Fender-supplied "hack" for the hiss at TheOtherPlace, saying that the aux input is wide open, (and it shouldn't be), when even nothing is plugged into it, and that is what is causing the noise?
Click to expand...

There's two different issues being conflated by people at The Other Place™.

That aux input level workaround is for the hiss in the TMP modeller; but some have confused that issue with hiss in the "FRFR" cab, which is a seperate issue
 
Stone said:
My Powercabs are dead quiet but I wonder how loud can the Hiss be? and then is it even audible when playing ?
it should not be a deal breaker IMHO, its the tones when playing that matter

:idk
Click to expand...
It genuinely isn't that noisy, *in my opinion* - pretty much any amount of background noise effectively overwhelms it.
Baba said:
I think I was reading about a Fender-supplied "hack" for the hiss at TheOtherPlace, saying that the aux input is wide open, (and it shouldn't be), when even nothing is plugged into it, and that is what is causing the noise?
Click to expand...

Different issue - see my video here.



The noise we are talking about here is the noise that remains when the TMP is fully turned down.
 
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