BluGuitar Amp X

[Blix]

Calling it now. Even if he does ship this thing it’s DOA with the present business model they’re describing.

Agreed. Only the hardcore BlugBois will buy this.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

How can the whole defining feature of the unit be tied to paid add ons? Surely you buy one of these for the ability to change between different circuits, not to be able to have the opportunity of buying licences to use different circuits. At least include a handful ffs.

Without DLC is it just Mercury+Iridium tones?

Sometimes have a committee/group consensus can be a good thing to filter out real stinkers of ideas. We all have them, sometimes we get attached to them or fail to see the bigger picture. Usually collaboration is good for ironing out the kinks.

 

[2dor]

How can the whole defining feature of the unit be tied to paid add ons? Surely you buy one of these for the ability to change between different circuits, not to be able to have the opportunity of buying licences to use different circuits. At least include a handful ffs.

Without DLC is it just Mercury+Iridium tones?

Sometimes have a committee/group consensus can be a good thing to filter out real stinkers of ideas. We all have them, sometimes we get attached to them or fail to see the bigger picture. Usually collaboration is good for ironing out the kinks.

Yeah, kinda disappointing if it stays this way.

I did post back and suggested they include some BlugPrints for free with a new purchase but yeah... it's their product / decision at the end of the day.

 

[laxu]

There’s just so much that gives me pause.

- CEO who seems to fly by the edge of his seat. How do you know the product will be well supported down the line? It’s not exactly something serviceable. Will the company be around in one year, let alone 5 or 10?

Blug says the goal is for Amp X to be their flagship product for the next 10 years or something, so I guess it depends on how well it sells. I think it's too optimistic and they'll eventually need an "Amp 2" that is much cheaper and closer to an upgraded Amp 1 concept with maybe installable Blugprints but no fx.

- really cool concept/idea, but how well does replicating schematics with solid state components really translate. How well does mimicking big power sections with a nano tube work? Probably fun to play and close enough but it’s kind of Blackstar levels of promising a lot. It’s been attempted so much and there’s always a trade off. I just don’t believe suddenly that there’s a free lunch.

The Amp 1 Mercury already proves the concept. The Amp 1 ME could sound and feel so close to the Bogner Goldfinger I had, that I sold the Bogner. It doesn't have to mimic big power sections..because it already is a big power section. The Amp X is rated like a 150W tube amp, similar to the Amp 1 Iridium. The Amp 1 ME is rated like a 100W tube amp and I have measured it to get about as loud too.
The Amp X seems to mainly aim to get all the nitty gritty details of a particular amp spot on, rather than being ground up designed as a "based on" amp like the Amp 1.

Blug seems to have painted himself into a bit of a corner again when they've been showing off e.g Vox AC30, JTM45 and 6505 tones, with people expecting to get those straight out of the box on the Amp X.

- what’s the chances that the paid stuff becomes free or used as a sales incentive to buy? How reliable will the DRM be? Is it enticing to only include the Blu circuits and paywall meat and potatoes amps? How well protected is the DRM? what about for multiple units?

Would not be surprised if there are Black Friday sales, similar to e.g plugins. It depends on what the pricing looks like - are we talking IR pack money (~15-20 €), or guitar VST plugin (~60-100 €) money?

I would expect DRM is pretty light. Maybe it only works on a "paired to account" device, similar to how e.g Line6 Helix can be tied to a Line6 account. But once the Amp X is unplugged it's not likely you can easily just grab licenses from another device. I don't expect you need to "connect it to verify" like a freakin' Netflix account either.

You could buy a used Amp 1 and a Fractal VP4 for like $1400 USD and IMO have way better effects

Looking at European pricing, a Fractal VP4 + Amp 1 is 1773 € including Finnish VAT. Two boxes, no cab sims and about 1/3 more physical size. For comparison, that's similar money to a Synergy SYN20-IR rig with one module.

Still, not far from the Amp X price if it launches at about 2K € - which honestly is no guarantee with all that's going on.

The thing the Amp X does over those others is an all-in-one solution with some analog fx. But I'm still not convinced that it will be fun to work with as it might be just "pedals with presets" annoyance on a multifx/amp scale.

I've already got a hideously expensive Strymon pedalboard that is very friendly to use with all the time I've spent on MIDI control, and don't really need more sounds than I get from the Amp 1. Now that I also own a Mesa Mark V, I don't really know if I need more amps anyway.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

The Amp 1 Mercury already proves the concept. The Amp 1 ME could sound and feel so close to the Bogner Goldfinger I had, that I sold the Bogner.

I don’t think it proves the concept, unless the goal was specifically to model a Bogner Goldfinger. It just sounds enough like an amp you like that it scratches the itch, but that could be true of lots of gear (which often sounds quite alike). And besides, the concept to me of the X is that the circuits can be adjusted and that lots of things are possible.

It doesn't have to mimic big power sections..because it already is a big power section. The Amp X is rated like a 150W tube amp, similar to the Amp 1 Iridium. The Amp 1 ME is rated like a 100W tube amp and I have measured it to get about as loud too.

With the power sections, I mean more from the side that poweramps between different amps all vary a lot. It’s one thing to model the preamps, but as well know, poweramps and cabinet loads etc all affect the amp significantly. Are we convinced that this Nanotube can convincingly model all poweramp types?

I would expect DRM is pretty light. Maybe it only works on a "paired to account" device, similar to how e.g Line6 Helix can be tied to a Line6 account. But once the Amp X is unplugged it's not likely you can easily just grab licenses from another device. I don't expect you need to "connect it to verify" like a freakin' Netflix account either.

Light DRM would concern me as a customer - I wouldn’t be thrilled if people can easily steal content (either from me, or just circumvent paying and disrupt the entire model). It would also need to be robust enough to not cause issues. IMO if they can’t make this product for $2000 without including additional amp models for free then this product is destined to fail. A $2000 modeller would not get those allowances.

 

[2dor]

All very valid points. I wonder if they'll reconsider their stance on what's going to be "canned" in the box when it's, eventually, launched.

 

[laxu]

I don’t think it proves the concept, unless the goal was specifically to model a Bogner Goldfinger. It just sounds enough like an amp you like that it scratches the itch, but that could be true of lots of gear (which often sounds quite alike). And besides, the concept to me of the X is that the circuits can be adjusted and that lots of things are possible.

I'm saying it sounds and behaves like a Marshall style tube amp so it's no different than Marshall vs Bogner vs Friedman etc. Just another flavor in there that's equally good.

With the power sections, I mean more from the side that poweramps between different amps all vary a lot. It’s one thing to model the preamps, but as well know, poweramps and cabinet loads etc all affect the amp significantly. Are we convinced that this Nanotube can convincingly model all poweramp types?

I was thinking more along the lines that a big power section is easier to scale down, like you can reduce the output of the Amp 1 power section with the internal powersoak, and that does have some effect on how it feels to play too. Similar effects to e.g turning my Mark V from 90W -> 45W.

Light DRM would concern me as a customer - I wouldn’t be thrilled if people can easily steal content (either from me, or just circumvent paying and disrupt the entire model). It would also need to be robust enough to not cause issues.

I would expect that BluGuitar owners wouldn't go to great lengths to try to crack it or anything like that. How likely is that some rando is going to plug into your Amp X before the gig and try to download all your stuff? Like all those people just hanging around with laptops, ready to hook them up to Fractals and Helixes wheever they see them?

 

[MirrorProfiles]

I'm saying it sounds and behaves like a Marshall style tube amp so it's no different than Marshall vs Bogner vs Friedman etc. Just another flavor in there that's equally good

Right, but a blackstar owner could say the same thing. Especially if there isn’t a target amp model in mind. I think it’s a fairly loose/vague target, especially when the Amp X’s USP is the fact it can freely model different circuits. The claims are pretty bold in modelling specific amps so IMO it’s better to make those 1:1 comparisons than subjective ones about 2 circuits that were never intended to be the same (even if they do share similarities).

I was thinking more along the lines that a big power section is easier to scale down, like you can reduce the output of the Amp 1 power section with the internal powersoak, and that does have some effect on how it feels to play too. Similar effects to e.g turning my Mark V from 90W -> 45W.

Yes this is not at all what I’m on about with the power section. A 2203 poweramp is very different to a Mark V, which is very different from a Rectifier, which is very different from a Herbert. They all influence the overall voicing and character of their respective amps. Modelling them isn’t just about matching the power or valve type. And what approximates one of these reasonably well may or may not do so well at others. Not saying it’s not possible to do a good job, but it’s a tall order and hasn’t really been done by anyone with a more conventional approach. Maybe if we were at a point where this was trivially easy already, then i’d believe it might be possible to scale down into something like an Amp X.

I would expect that BluGuitar owners wouldn't go to great lengths to try to crack it or anything like that. How likely is that some rando is going to plug into your Amp X before the gig and try to download all your stuff? Like all those people just hanging around with laptops, ready to hook them up to Fractals and Helixes wheever they see them?

Again, not what I’m getting at. That situation is incredibly unlikely for a number of reasons. What about sharing login information or hacking someone’s account?

Lots of proprietary DRM, especially from smaller companies is a PITA and usually very quickly hacked. I think it’s important that the customer AND company are both protected equally. I would not feel enticed to spend money on something if I feel it’s going to be easily hacked, and then quickly abandoned as a result of the finances not making sense any more.

 

[JiveTurkey]

The positives the Blug amps have:

1. It sounds good
2. It's the one to get vs. a Blackstar turd in the same form factor.

That's literally it. Nowhere near anything worth taking a chance on an unproven $2k device.

 

[paisleywookiee]

The positives the Blug amps have:

1. It sounds good
2. It's the one to get vs. a Blackstar turd in the same form factor.

That's literally it. Nowhere near anything worth taking a chance on an unproven $2k device.

. As I’ve said many times, I wish he’d just do a fucking Amp2 in the Orange Tour Baby format.

 

[2dor]

The more I think about that stance on paid-for BlugPrints, it might make some sense in a way for specific amps.

In this vid, Thomas hints at potential collabs with amp builders for licensed "BlugPrints" which would allow the amp builder to get some income from BlugPrint sales. I guess it could make some sense there depending on how they're priced - in a way, they'd be no different than paid-for Kemper / Quad Cortex / ToneX profiles.
Pricing, though, is going to be key if they stick to this approach.



That said, they definitely need to include some in the box otherwise this whole thing kinda stinks.

 

[laxu]

. As I’ve said many times, I wish he’d just do a fucking Amp2 in the Orange Tour Baby format.

Why is that format preferable to you? While I put my Amp 1 on top of my cab at all times, I think it's cool it can double as a pedalboard amp on a larger board if you want to. It's also easy to adjust when the controls are on top.

 

[paisleywookiee]

Why is that format preferable to you? While I put my Amp 1 on top of my cab at all times, I think it's cool it can double as a pedalboard amp on a larger board if you want to. It's also easy to adjust when the controls are on top.

I want knobs for everything. The floor format is dumb. And yes, I’ve used the Amp 1. It’s awesome. Sounds fantastic. I hate that shit on the side, I hate ONE output per impedance, etc.

 

[2dor]

I want knobs for everything. The floor format is dumb. And yes, I’ve used the Amp 1. It’s awesome. Sounds fantastic. I hate that shit on the side, I hate ONE output per impedance, etc.

The more I think about it, I'd probably lean on floor-based especially if it's the only thing you want to lug around - allows easy-switching etc. but may not be that great since the dials won't face straight at you if you have it up on a full-stack.

A 1-U kinda thing may work too if you want to slide it inside a rack but then it wouldn't be the portable solution it is right now.
Would make more sense for the AmpX to get that 1U treatment maybe. That thing seems to be a lot wider & kinda makes it not as "portable" as the Amp1 line is.

 

[paisleywookiee]

The more I think about it, I'd probably lean on floor-based especially if it's the only thing you want to lug around - allows easy-switching etc. but may not be that great since the dials won't face straight at you if you have it up on a full-stack.

A 1-U kinda thing may work too if you want to slide it inside a rack but then it wouldn't be the portable solution it is right now.
Would make more sense for the AmpX to get that 1U treatment maybe. That thing seems to be a lot wider & kinda makes it not as "portable" as the Amp1 line is.

Yeah I’m not saying I don’t understand the reason for the format. I just would like a second option.

 

[EOengineer]

I want knobs for everything. The floor format is dumb. And yes, I’ve used the Amp 1. It’s awesome. Sounds fantastic. I hate that shit on the side, I hate ONE output per impedance, etc.

The side knobs also give me pause. I’ve not heard of issues, but I think many of us see that and throw up a red flag because it seems like something that wouldn’t hold up long term if you were gigging heavily.

 

[2dor]

The side knobs also give me pause. I’ve not heard of issues, but I think many of us see that and throw up a red flag because it seems like something that wouldn’t hold up long term if you were gigging heavily.

Been reading up on these a lot in the past week & haven't come across any post where people report these going bad; looks like they're built as more of "set-and-forget" kinda thing.

 

[GuitarBilly74]

How well does mimicking big power sections with a nano tube work?

Blug has this down. It works really well already in the Amp1. Miles away from the BlackStar stuff. It's really remarkable how right he got this.

I agree with your other points though.

 

[laxu]

Been reading up on these a lot in the past week & haven't come across any post where people report these going bad; looks like they're built as more of "set-and-forget" kinda thing.

I've read some people having issues, but they are literally meant as set and forget. I dial them in a bit for the cab I use, and just park them there.

The design is terrible though. It's impossible to see where it's pointing without a flashlight and turning them is pretty fiddly. I wish they had just dedicated more space for them on the side and used those small Boss style knobs or something.

I've put tiny stickers under the knobs so I can find which ones are the tone knobs without counting first.

 

[ChordInversion]

Yeah I’m not saying I don’t understand the reason for the format. I just would like a second option.

There are a lot of items I would like to be not just "rack or floor," but performers and people who want to buy what performers buy seem to be dead set on those two ways of designing gear, so I think we're stuck with it.