Those Seymour Duncan Powerstage amps are utter tripe
- Thread starter Orvillain
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I do agree. Although I've never done it!
Pretty much since I started playing guitar, I was addicted to multi-channel amps.
The Fryette Sig:X I used to use as a 5 channel amp, more or less. But I'd also ride the volume using an Ernie Ball volume pedal a heckuva a lot too. So it was more like.... I dunno, ultimately, 12 channels, something ridiculous like that.
Over the past 7 years, that sorta went away. I miss playing like that.
northern_fox
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Yeah, that's been my experience for sure. People love to argue about ""FRFR"" and how power amps are modeled so you should never need anything but a perfectly flat amp, etc, but there is an additional piece which is * actually making a sound louder * with its own physics that people tend to brush off as unimportant. I'm not gonna say 'class D bad' since it's used literally everywhere for everything and sounds great, but IME specifically with guitar poweramps AB and tubes have generally felt better to me against real cabs in the room. And that "thump" / transient response is a big part of it.
OrganicZed
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I have one of those Sig:X amps. I love how sensitive it is to playing dynamics.I do agree. Although I've never done it!
Pretty much since I started playing guitar, I was addicted to multi-channel amps.
The Fryette Sig:X I used to use as a 5 channel amp, more or less. But I'd also ride the volume using an Ernie Ball volume pedal a heckuva a lot too. So it was more like.... I dunno, ultimately, 12 channels, something ridiculous like that.
Over the past 7 years, that sorta went away. I miss playing like that.
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Yeah they're sick. I've genuinely owned that amp 4 times though!
deathbyguitar
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This thread just reminds me of the YouTube video I was gonna make - Yamaha DHR12M for "FRFR" side by side with a Dual Rectifier. It's the kind of thing that I'm sure I will get absolutely flamed for but maybe some people will find it useful.
I plan on renting out a storage space and getting a live band to practice playing through real amps and then switch over to "FRFR" for both guitar and bass for comparison.
I plan on renting out a storage space and getting a live band to practice playing through real amps and then switch over to "FRFR" for both guitar and bass for comparison.
I've had a look for the PA50 in the UK but not been able to find any. Plenty of the KSR preamp pedals though.
I'm very much like this at the moment since getting the IRX. Haven't used the amp modelling on the Fm3 much.
I play more with the IRX
Thinking of going synergy route.
Mongillo19
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Synergy is a lot of fun but I just always found myself going back to digital devices. But of course that's just me! The Bogner, SLO, Fryette all sound amazing
The biggest thing I found with the IRX was the response. I played it for a couple of months without touching the FM3 modelling and when I went back to the FM3 it didn't feel as instant in the attack. Possibly latency or something else - I had an Engl Ironball before Fractal and felt the same way.
Def looking at fryette deliverance module.
I do have a powerstage 170 and it is fine but might sell for a Fryette powerstation
Mongillo19
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I should say I had the Pitbull variant of the Fryette but I've heard good things about the Deliverance. Like @Orvillain has mentioned, I just get this idea stuck in my head when playing digital gear of "does this sound like the amp" when in reality I've never played the real deal! It just can be a downer on the process and I totally understand that's something I need to work through but I never turn on a tube amp and think "is this how it's supposed to sound?"
northern_fox
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yeky83
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How often are you pushing a full 100W though...?
I actually get this, as having the IRX has helped me get better tones out of the FM3 as I have more of an idea of the sounds I'm looking for.
Sonically the FM3 are IRX are very close which does demonstrate how good the modelling is on the Fractal.
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It isn't about pushing a full 100W.
Boudoir Guitar
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A big challenge with modelers and power amps of any kind where the power amp is "conservative" (i.e., sub-500 good ol' juicy watts into whatever load it's driving) is gain staging. It's really easy to have presets setup to be shaving quite a bit of output off of things, even if you've got the output at "line level".
For ANY power amp with a modeler for me, if you're running it too hard, it's going to sound not good -- I've had this experience with class D and class A/B power amps (haven't been in a situation with tube power).
It's not about "flat", it's about minimizing distortion for me. Everything loosens up across the entire guitar range, the midrange and treble smear like crazy. Not good.
I've had good experience with the PS-170 relative to class A/B power amps (big and small) and to the return of a 100 watt tube head, but I also haven't run it at "Led Zeppelin cover band" volumes, much less two-guitar-chugging scenarios, and haven't really tested it out with chugs. So who knows...maybe I'd find in that context that even when running well within its usable power band it sucked.
An underpowered class A/B amp sounded great...up to a point. After which it sounded very similar to the Moore Baby Bomb REALLY
For ANY power amp with a modeler for me, if you're running it too hard, it's going to sound not good -- I've had this experience with class D and class A/B power amps (haven't been in a situation with tube power).
It's not about "flat", it's about minimizing distortion for me. Everything loosens up across the entire guitar range, the midrange and treble smear like crazy. Not good.
I've had good experience with the PS-170 relative to class A/B power amps (big and small) and to the return of a 100 watt tube head, but I also haven't run it at "Led Zeppelin cover band" volumes, much less two-guitar-chugging scenarios, and haven't really tested it out with chugs. So who knows...maybe I'd find in that context that even when running well within its usable power band it sucked.
An underpowered class A/B amp sounded great...up to a point. After which it sounded very similar to the Moore Baby Bomb REALLY
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I hear what you're saying, and on paper I agree. But I swear down these prepackaged class D amps are doing something to the low-end in order to obtain their power-rating. Filtering all of it out so that it doesn't reach clipping point as soon, something like that.
I'm not an electronics engineer, but even with clean headroom what I hear from these amps is they remove a ton of low frequency content that just sounds great on guitar, particularly for high gain.
Will Chen
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Isn't it though? The point of those obscenely high class D wattage ratings is handing peaks. I've got no real dog in this fight as any time I play with any real volume these days requires plugs, just curious.
OrganicZed
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I own a Seymour Duncan PS700 and it doesn't seem to reproduce the low frequencies of a guitar signal as well as my other amps (Fryette PS-2, QSC RMX and PLX solid state amplifiers). I did a direct A/B comparison of the RMX 2450 and the PS700. Even at moderate volume (100 dB) the difference was there. I know I wasn't pushing either amplifier anywhere near the limit of their output capabilities. I don't know if the difference is specifically due to the differences in wattage or the amplifier output stage designs, but it was audible nonetheless.
