Some interesting news from Kemper (Profiler Player)

[Boudoir Guitar]

I'm less annoyed with the charging for upgrading as I am the philosophy of releasing a purposefully nerfed product that the user can then upgrade to the spec of the 10 year old flagship rather than...working on a new flagship. Even if they don't want to change the underlying everything because CK is a stubborn SOB, they could still do stuff like:

(1). just double the signal paths either for dual stereo amps or so guitarist and bassist could share a single Kemper at the gig.
(2). Allow serial profiles so you could run a dirt pedal profile into an amp profile.

 

[JiveTurkey]

I'm still not completely (un)sold on the idea of being able to "upgrade" the smallest device up to the flagship save for ins/outs/whatever non-existent hardware differences you can't make up for?

 

[JiveTurkey]

I'm less annoyed with the charging for upgrading as I am the philosophy of releasing a purposefully nerfed product that the user can then upgrade to the spec of the 10 year old flagship rather than...working on a new flagship. Even if they don't want to change the underlying everything because CK is a stubborn SOB, they could still do stuff like:

(1). just double the signal paths either for dual stereo amps or so guitarist and bassist could share a single Kemper at the gig.
(2). Allow serial profiles so you could run a dirt pedal profile into an amp profile.

Stubborn af

 

[mbenigni]

For context on some of the previous discussions, this is what Christoph Kemper said on their own forums:

We are aware that the Profiler Player has the potential to serve the needs of very different users. On the one side there is the connaisseurs of pure amp tones, without the need for sprawling effect arrangements. On the other side there is the wish to play complex Rigs taken 1:1 from the big brother Profiler units. The Profiler Player has the theoretical potential to play full-blown Rigs. But I think it is understandable that we have not drawn a Profiler at half the price of a Profiler Stage but 85%-ish of it‘s featues.
Thus we consider since quit a while to offer one or two software upgrade (with costs), that will boost the Players features towards the Head, Rack and Stage.

The ability to create Profiles on the Player is also a story discussed by our team. There is a few issues to be solved, such as how to use the sole input of the Player for the return path and provide an A/B comparison.

The last paragraph is particularly interesting because it means they might offer a way to create profiles using the Player. That would give it more value because it would work for those with amp collections.

I looked at my used market recently and you can get a used Kemper Rack or PowerRack for only 150-200 € more than the Player, but the Player is much more compact and portable.

I think this is all reasonable and above board. My main issue with this approach is that it leads to a design process that arbitrarily under-leverages some of the hardware, and paints UX into a corner. The control layout etc. imply that the lesser effect count etc. are all that the hardware is capable of. Hearing that it’s been hamstrung for no better reason than product differentiation is just sort of unsettling.

So eventually you may be able to have a player with all the bells and whistles, and I think that’s cool. There is a lot to like about this device. But it’s always going to have a control scheme etc designed for that diminished feature set. This has kind of been a Kemper thing from day one, e.g. painting “delay” and “reverb” labels on immovable effects blocks until finally, years later, agreeing to make them movable. UI literally painted into a corner.

 

[Enchilada Jones]

I had my Stage listed for sale just before this was presented. I just didn’t use it enough and have other options (that also go rarely used)
So, to prepare for its arrival, I fired up the Stage and was making note of which Rigs I’ll want to load into the Player.
Im rediscovering just how great the Stage is. So when the Player arrives I’ll get a good chance to see if it is worthy or will the Player go back to Kemper. I’ll be noting the complaints adding up and see if any of them apply to my use case.

Some I already know don’t apply. I see it as a plus that there is untapped potential in any of the devices. Like when USB was enabled via firmware. Tricky/ clever, yes but I never thought I was entitled to USB audio when I bought the Stage so no foul in my mind. Just joy to have it delivered for free. If it had been offered for a price I thought was fair instead I think I would have still been happy.

For some reason I find the exclusion of Kemper Drives a bit of a foul. The drive/distortion/fuzz, in my mind, are a fundamental component of a device like this. They were for years a weak point and then were finally delivered some time ago. Finally ‘good enough’. The exclusion Is more like a retro grade than an option being trimmed out.

 

[mbenigni]

I'm still not completely (un)sold on the idea of being able to "upgrade" the smallest device up to the flagship save for ins/outs/whatever non-existent hardware differences you can't make up for?

I’m also fine with the non-existent hardware differences. It’s the existent ones that concern me.

 

[Byrdman]

I'm less annoyed with the charging for upgrading as I am the philosophy of releasing a purposefully nerfed product that the user can then upgrade to the spec of the 10 year old flagship rather than...working on a new flagship. Even if they don't want to change the underlying everything because CK is a stubborn SOB, they could still do stuff like:

(1). just double the signal paths either for dual stereo amps or so guitarist and bassist could share a single Kemper at the gig.
(2). Allow serial profiles so you could run a dirt pedal profile into an amp profile.

I would be less annoyed too, but only if those future upgrades and the price for them are spelled out up front so you know what you are getting in to. I think it's kind of chintzy to just throw it out there with no specifics. Is he taking a page out of QC's book here????

 

[Mongillo19]

I would be less annoyed too, but only if those future upgrades and the price for them are spelled out up front so you know what you are getting in to. I think it's kind of chintzy to just throw it out there with no specifics. Is he taking a page out of QC's book here????

Everyone would be losing their minds right now if it was NDSP doing this

 

[Byrdman]

Everyone would be losing their minds right now if it was NDSP doing this

Yeah, for sure!!

 

[JiveTurkey]

Maybe NDSP will add a pay tier to get plugins finally running on the hardware

 

[Deadpan]

What if the update isn’t only software but an additional hardware adapter.

CK mentions trying to solve the only one input issue. With USB audio now available there are other possibilities.

 

[Mongillo19]

Maybe NDSP will add a pay tier to get plugins finally running on the hardware

They might. And I'd be very opposed to it if you couldn't tell but if people are fine with Kemper doing it, they should have no issue with NDSP

And I realize it's different and a little bit of a generalization but I'd argue the main idea is the same

 

[JiveTurkey]

They might. And I'd be very opposed to it if you couldn't tell but if people are fine with Kemper doing it, they should have no issue with NDSP

And I realize it's different and a little bit of a generalization but I'd argue the main idea is the same

One of the bazillion differences for me is Kemper earned their OG place at the table. The other one; um not so much

 

[JiveTurkey]

That petty, dumb nonsense from me aside; Kemper always does things their own way to an absurdist degree. This is absolutely more of that.

 

[Mongillo19]

One of the bazillion differences for me is Kemper earned their OG place at the table. The other one; um not so much

Definitely. But that doesn't mean you can be unclear with that you are getting in a product and implementing a questionable upgrade plan.

The Kemper Player just seems very vague. As @Byrdman mentioned, they aren't being that transparent. You can figure it out by looking at the I/Os but imo it should clearly state this thing does not do profiles and missing some features of the big ones. Almost like a tiered table would be neat.

I still wouldn't like it, but adding in this paid option at launch would be more okay with me as you'd know what you are buying. This does feel very much like a NDSP move to me.

 

[GTR37]

I would be less annoyed too, but only if those future upgrades and the price for them are spelled out up front so you know what you are getting in to. I think it's kind of chintzy to just throw it out there with no specifics. Is he taking a page out of QC's book here????

100% they are following the industry trend with NDSP
I suspect in the future you might see more of this , I think it’s good and it’s bad , but realistically if you picked a hardware unit and then could add what you want as far as amp models and effects a lot of people could be in the market for that I think

 

[JiveTurkey]

I watched a video on it and did not feel any GAS pangs in the slightest. So that was a good sign on my end

 

[TubeStack]

I watched a video on it and did not feel any GAS pangs in the slightest. So that was a good sign on my end

I was thinking we'd have JT pics and reviews for morning reading today.

 

[JiveTurkey]

I was thinking we'd have JT pics and reviews for morning reading today.

I'm running a hardline Timbuk stance on this piece

 

[TubeStack]

I'm running a hardline Timbuk stance on this piece

I mean, you bought the damn ToneX immediately…