Loki (Poly Effects)

[polyeffects]

I'm Loki from Poly Effects. We make Beebo, Flat V and Hector currently.

Ask me anything.

 

[JiveTurkey]

Welcome Loki! I have wanted a Beebo since forever! RJ Ronquillo is a killer player and he makes that Flat V shine! @TJontheRoad is our resident synth guru and I am betting he would dig the Hector!

 

[TJontheRoad]

I think I've almost pulled the trigger on a Hector a half dozen times. Interesting designs at Poly.

 

[2112]

This should be fun!

Vegemite on toast - with or without butter?

 

[yeky83]

Is the Flat V pedal interface a platform for other pedals to come? Seems like it would translate to many other effects...

Your products have been different than anything else in the market. Do you hate knobs? What are some design aesthetics you like to follow when you come up with a new product? How has it been bringing a more synth approach/background, I imagine it's a love/hate relationship with us guitarists?

 

[polyeffects]

This should be fun!

Vegemite on toast - with or without butter?

With. Vegemite is a butter enhancer. I also add dukkah on top that I get from a little Egyptian shop near by.

Is the Flat V pedal interface a platform for other pedals to come? Seems like it would translate to many other effects...

Yes, that's the evil plan. The touch tech took a very long time to get right so I want to use it for a bunch of stuff.

Your products have been different than anything else in the market. Do you hate knobs? What are some design aesthetics you like to follow when you come up with a new product?

I actually quite enjoy knobs and sliders when used in a way that I think is correct. I just find that deeper pedals, with a lot of controls start to get very confusing when the knobs don't show the current value (presets) or the knobs are mapped to many functions that change when you press something else or start it up in a different mode. I think visualisation is a bit part of what what I'm trying to improve (and still working towards!) making it clear what setting your currently on. I also desire flexibility. The whole Beebo design is based on the idea that stuff like the Helix, AxeFx or individual pedals already do a great job of single serial signal flow. Very few things are trying to do interesting parallel flows where you can have pedals (modules) controlling each other and visualising that in a clear way. Flexible modulation basically requires avoiding traditional knobs unless you've got say LED rings around them and they are encoders.

Aesthetic... clear, readable, simple lines, surf 50s ish vibes and colours with brutalist hints.

How has it been bringing a more synth approach/background, I imagine it's a love/hate relationship with us guitarists?

I'm mostly a guitarist and bass player (upright and electric) but I've been doing modular synthesis for more than 20 years. I actually got into synth stuff more because I grew up on a farm and had access to a computer but very little else instrument wise, so I got into modifying and coding audio stuff, playing with trackers / samplers / synths. You could find open source virtual modular stuff for free in the late 90s.

 

[2112]

With. Vegemite is a butter enhancer. I also add dukkah on top that I get from a little Egyptian shop near by.

That sounds amazing.

With Beebo, what is the process of porting some of the open source modular synth blocks? Since the mutable modules are based around knobs and jacks you essentially have to come up with an entire new UI right?

 

[polyeffects]

That sounds amazing.

With Beebo, what is the process of porting some of the open source modular synth blocks? Since the mutable modules are based around knobs and jacks you essentially have to come up with an entire new UI right?

100% recommend dukkah on everything. It adds a satisfying crunch.

Yeah, all the code for Beebo is open source, so people are using modules I've written for Beebo on computers etc. I've been doing open source audio stuff for more than 20 years. The oldest code of mine in Beebo is from around 2003. Quite a few of the modules such as the Mutable ones are ones I've ported. Basically the process is first I see if it's something that could be useful in our context, then I have a look if I can get the code to run at decent performance on our CPU. Some PC stuff is pretty poorly optimised because they assume you're running some 32 core AMD or something... then Jo and I basically design a new UI that covers the functions but tries to make it clearer. For example on the Mutable plaits (multi osc in Beebo) we can have the labels change to what function they do for each module, where as obviously on the physical ones the labels are generic. The Mutable stuff is very well designed though, so a lot of the UI for them is just translating the manual to a screen UI. Coding new UI stuff takes a while though and it's often pretty fiddly so it's not the most fun for me. I'll do it for a little bit then go back to bending metal for the enclosures.

 

[laxu]

I can't decide if the Flat V is genius or ridiculous. What made you decide on that user interface over a more standard physical knobs arrangement or infinite encoders with LED rings?

 

[polyeffects]

I can't decide if the Flat V is genius or ridiculous. What made you decide on that user interface over a more standard physical knobs arrangement or infinite encoders with LED rings?

visability and reliability. Knobs are the part of a pedal that fails most often, followed by foot switches, power jacks and 1/4" connectors. I can't do much about needing the others, though I have contemplated getting a mill turn lathe and making our own more reliable foot switches.

I also find it a bit confusing when you change presets on a pedal without some cunning visualisation and now all the knobs show something that isn't true. All digital devices with analog pots have that problem. Encoders with LED rings, powered faders or LED faders are the clearest solutions. Encoders with LEDs might have been easier but you'd still need buttons or toggles then. More chance for dust or liquid to get in.

 

[TJontheRoad]

I think I've almost pulled the trigger on a Hector a half dozen times. Interesting designs at Poly.

Quoting myself just to say I ordered a Hector. Hector had some growing pains I've read, but Poly is very good with updates and bug fixes.

@polyeffects Any chance Flat V will make it into a eurorack form?

 

[polyeffects]

Quoting myself just to say I ordered a Hector. Hector had some growing pains I've read, but Poly is very good with updates and bug fixes.

@polyeffects Any chance Flat V will make it into a eurorack form?

Eurorack already has a bunch of cunning modulation stuff so I think it would be just a drive thing in eurorack... maybe that could be handy but it'd have to be adapted a lot for eurorack levels, the analog resonant filters wouldn't be a unique selling point in eurorack so I'd probably remove all that and give you 2 gain sections... which I don't think would be that exciting?

 

[TJontheRoad]

Eurorack already has a bunch of cunning modulation stuff so I think it would be just a drive thing in eurorack... maybe that could be handy but it'd have to be adapted a lot for eurorack levels, the analog resonant filters wouldn't be a unique selling point in eurorack so I'd probably remove all that and give you 2 gain sections... which I don't think would be that exciting?

Dual gain is good, but can be overdone. I think the reso filters with pre-gain would be enticing within the same module so you can sculpt the distortion via CV without patching audio elsewhere. You have to position it as an effect rather than filter(s).

 

[2112]

What was your approach for developing the Loopler? The Quad Cortex looper has some similar functionality so I wonder if they took some cues from the way you integrated Echoplex-Pro style looping there.

 

[polyeffects]

What was your approach for developing the Loopler? The Quad Cortex looper has some similar functionality so I wonder if they took some cues from the way you integrated Echoplex-Pro style looping there.

I basically looked at what Andre La Fosse wanted and attempted to do it. It's a port of sooplerlooper but with a very heavily redesigned UI. The UI was an attempt at making that type of looping more obvious. We had big hopes for the Loopler module but it's a pretty huge loss of cash given the time to implement vs the extra sales generated by it. I'm still keen to improve it though, and add some more of the sampler functions. The first bit of serious music software I ever worked on 20 years ago was a sampler, so samplers have a special place for me.

Doug's got a Beebo (specifically a very early Digit version) but I'm not sure if he's ever updated it or played with Loopler, I haven't chatted with him in a while as I haven't been to NAMM since 2020 for plague related reasons.

 

[laxu]

visability and reliability. Knobs are the part of a pedal that fails most often, followed by foot switches, power jacks and 1/4" connectors. I can't do much about needing the others, though I have contemplated getting a mill turn lathe and making our own more reliable foot switches.

I also find it a bit confusing when you change presets on a pedal without some cunning visualisation and now all the knobs show something that isn't true. All digital devices with analog pots have that problem. Encoders with LED rings, powered faders or LED faders are the clearest solutions. Encoders with LEDs might have been easier but you'd still need buttons or toggles then. More chance for dust or liquid to get in.

You probably know better but I've never had a pot break on a pedal. Footswitch, for sure.

Showing preset values is certainly a big issue on most pedals as often there isn't room for LED rings or any other indicators for showing what is going on. But for me losing the tactile feel of real knobs is a bigger issue on touch controls.

 

[yeky83]

Wait wtf Loopler looks awesome, didn’t know that was in there. Beebo eh, hmmm.

 

[polyeffects]

You probably know better but I've never had a pot break on a pedal. Footswitch, for sure.

Showing preset values is certainly a big issue on most pedals as often there isn't room for LED rings or any other indicators for showing what is going on. But for me losing the tactile feel of real knobs is a bigger issue on touch controls.

It's very hard to find reliable encoders too. Feel wise I actually enjoy clicky encoders the most but other people find them "less accurate" that ones without clicks, even though they have the same number of pulses per revolution... so I use clickless ones for Beebo now. One giant LED knob like the Mutable Warps is a cool approach though too.

 

[laxu]

It's very hard to find reliable encoders too. Feel wise I actually enjoy clicky encoders the most but other people find them "less accurate" that ones without clicks, even though they have the same number of pulses per revolution... so I use clickless ones for Beebo now. One giant LED knob like the Mutable Warps is a cool approach though too.

I actually prefer the clickless too, I like the ones on my ASM Hydrasynth Explorer.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Re: Encoders. Even if they appear to be cheap, at the same time the ones Zoom uses on their MS-50Gs seem to be pretty reliable. They "click", which I like, they also feature a switch function and there's always parameter readouts on the screen above. Once you've got the hang of things, this has got to be the unit with the best "size-to-usability" factor there is. Bought one of the two I own around 2014/15, has seen quite some beating (often got thrown into whatever cases as a "just in case" swiss army knife) and it's still working pretty much as on day one. Encoders also feel and act heaps better than those on my HX Stomp.
I think plenty of folks could steal a thing or two from Zoom.