Line 6 Helix Stadium Talk

[GTR37]

I’m sure. It sounded fantastic. And I had a Mark IIC+ RI right next to me, and the Stadium sounds close.

Which footswitch rings are brighter?

That’s a pretty solid endorsement
I think we like similar tones like SLO / 800 so it’s cool that you are liking those

I am on a Fractal kick lately and just loving the simplicity of the AM4
I ordered the smaller stadium so probably won’t see that until February

The good news likely 1.3 will be out by then with 2 or 3 more Agoura models
Some proxy stuff and a whole lot of bug fixes

 

[paisleywookiee]

That’s a pretty solid endorsement
I think we like similar tones like SLO / 800 so it’s cool that you are liking those

I am on a Fractal kick lately and just loving the simplicity of the AM4
I ordered the smaller stadium so probably won’t see that until February

The good news likely 1.3 will be out by then with 2 or 3 more Agoura models
Some proxy stuff and a whole lot of bug fixes

I don’t really need it (don’t really need any of this stuff I guess) but I will get the Stadium, but also likely still get the AM4 as well. They both suit a purpose.

 

[GTR37]

I don’t really need it (don’t really need any of this stuff I guess) but I will get the Stadium, but also likely still get the AM4 as well. They both suit a purpose.

Do any of us really need it
I think you will dig the AM4 it’s a lot of fun and if it a small look at where they are going , future looks promising

 

[Mongillo19]

Credit to @MirrorProfiles for the DI:

AM4:

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

Stadium

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

Both 2C+ with Miko plugin (same cab settings).
My first time successfully reamping (ever) but I'm worried I did it wrong given how different the amps sound. However, it was done over USB for both the stadium and AM so leveling should be correct? Anyway, I got some FOMO on the 1.2 update so I am borrowing a friends to make sure I'm not a dumbass and buy another stadium honestly, I think I prefer the Stadium here but it doesn't really have the dryness of the AM....which I personally associate with the Mark series.

 

[Mongillo19]

Pretty different gain levels here. I think you could make them sound the same if you get rid of the saturation in the Stadium model.

Yeah idk how to do that as mentioned I just ran it over USB for both units so I figured gain levels would be correct? Maybe a bold assumption

 

[HotRats]

I don’t think anyone dismisses those things as potentially important issues. But when a forum member or potential buyer goes on and on about them — and almost seems to put them above everything else — without trying the unit or knowing whether those things are actually better than on the previous generation, and while being rude along the way, it’s not surprising that this creates some friction.

Edit: and just to be clear, I’m not referring to you, @HotRats

That's fair but hei! it's a forum. People here go on and on about the same topics all the time.

It’s not the concern over ring brightness, or any other kind of brightness. It’s the going on about it ad nauseum about topics over and over again, and being a generally disagreeable ass about it.

Yeah Sascha can be annoying sometimes but honestly you guys triggered him in this case.

Also, I think commenting on a UI/UX with any sense of authority before ever even using it is a bit ridiculous.

That's fair but come on, he just expressed his concern about leds, like anyone else does about whatever they believe is important.

Live and let live?

 

[guyonthefox]

Not the absolute best photo for judging this, but I think the Stadium LEDs do look brighter. I haven't played an outdoor gig with it yet (thankfully, who wants to play outdoors in November/December?), but I think these will be an improvement. (Not sure why that one scribble strip is showing up with a line through the middle of it, but it's photo artifact of some sort, not an actual problem with the strip, just FYI.)View attachment 57135

What stand are you using with the Stadium?

 

[Sascha Franck]

Also, I think commenting on a UI/UX with any sense of authority before ever even using it is a bit ridiculous.

No matter how often you repeat it, it doesn't get any more true. Several UI issues can be judged upon without ever touching a unit.
No global blocks = no global blocks. I can use any unit for zero or 4765 hours and would still come to 100% the same conclusion: no global blocks.

I know, "1+1=2" is a concept you don't agree upon, but still, it's a pretty decent concept.

 

[HotRats]

Here you go. This is the IIC+ on the Stadium and Fractal FM3, both at current release firmware. Both run through the same York YA MES OS Mix 01 IR. No reverb or effects or post processing. Settings on both amps are identical. I alternate between the two units with an A/B switcher for each phrase of chords or chugs. I am not revealing which is which until tomorrow. Are there differences? Maybe? None that make any difference to me. I'll use either of those tones. Pick it apart all you want with golden ears, but there's nothing here that couldn't be tweaked into alignment if needed. Oh, and the "feel" is the same to me.

Channel: Lead
Drive: 8.4
Bass: 0
Mid: 0
Treble: 7.1
Presence: 0.6
Deep: On
Bass Shift: Off
TrebShift: On
Bright: Off
Lead Drive: 8.6
Lead Brite: Off
Lead Master: 3.5
Master: 2.3
Power: Simulclass
80 Hz: +4.2
240 Hz: 0
750 Hz: -8.7
2200 Hz: +1.0
6600 Hz: -1.2

Cab: York YA MES OS Mix 01, no high or low cuts

For the Fractal FM3, the model used was the: USA MK IIC+ Deep



The sequence in the above clip is: A - B - A - B - A - B - A - B

wow there's a really, really small difference between them, I didn't expect them to be so close.
A has a litte more low/low mids than B or B is a litte brigher than A, hard to tell wich is wich.

 

[[Nathan]]

I guarantee about 50% of folks are going to get this wrong, and probably most people will cite the wrong reason they "know" which one is which. Just to be clear, the sequence in the clip is:

A - B - A - B - A - B - A - B

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Here you go. This is the IIC+ on the Stadium and Fractal FM3, both at current release firmware. Both run through the same York YA MES OS Mix 01 IR. No reverb or effects or post processing. Settings on both amps are identical. I alternate between the two units with an A/B switcher for each phrase of chords or chugs. I am not revealing which is which until tomorrow. Are there differences? Maybe? None that make any difference to me. I'll use either of those tones. Pick it apart all you want with golden ears, but there's nothing here that couldn't be tweaked into alignment if needed. Oh, and the "feel" is the same to me.

Channel: Lead
Drive: 8.4
Bass: 0
Mid: 0
Treble: 7.1
Presence: 0.6
Deep: On
Bass Shift: Off
TrebShift: On
Bright: Off
Lead Drive: 8.6
Lead Brite: Off
Lead Master: 3.5
Master: 2.3
Power: Simulclass
80 Hz: +4.2
240 Hz: 0
750 Hz: -8.7
2200 Hz: +1.0
6600 Hz: -1.2

Cab: York YA MES OS Mix 01, no high or low cuts

For the Fractal FM3, the model used was the: USA MK IIC+ Deep



The sequence in the above clip is: A - B - A - B - A - B - A - B

sounds much closer on monitors, the 2nd one sounds a touch brighter here (it has some fizz that isn't in A) but with a steeper roll off above it. The last section with the palm mutes still makes B sound like Agoura to me, but the other sections make me think A is Agoura now (because of having a bit less fizz). Thats enough to make me not sure which is which.

My first time successfully reamping (ever) but I'm worried I did it wrong given how different the amps sound. However, it was done over USB for both the stadium and AM so leveling should be correct?

Yeah you'd need to compensate gain levels. My DI is actually pretty much dead on for Helix levels as is, but the Fractal one would need some level added to make it fair. At default values you'd need to add about 6dB IIRC, but I think the input sensitivity control can skew things. I do think most of the differences there are coming from level discrepancies

 

[Orvillain]

Here you go. This is the IIC+ on the Stadium and Fractal FM3, both at current release firmware. Both run through the same York YA MES OS Mix 01 IR. No reverb or effects or post processing. Settings on both amps are identical. I alternate between the two units with an A/B switcher for each phrase of chords or chugs. I am not revealing which is which until tomorrow. Are there differences? Maybe? None that make any difference to me. I'll use either of those tones. Pick it apart all you want with golden ears, but there's nothing here that couldn't be tweaked into alignment if needed. Oh, and the "feel" is the same to me.

Channel: Lead
Drive: 8.4
Bass: 0
Mid: 0
Treble: 7.1
Presence: 0.6
Deep: On
Bass Shift: Off
TrebShift: On
Bright: Off
Lead Drive: 8.6
Lead Brite: Off
Lead Master: 3.5
Master: 2.3
Power: Simulclass
80 Hz: +4.2
240 Hz: 0
750 Hz: -8.7
2200 Hz: +1.0
6600 Hz: -1.2

Cab: York YA MES OS Mix 01, no high or low cuts

For the Fractal FM3, the model used was the: USA MK IIC+ Deep



The sequence in the above clip is: A - B - A - B - A - B - A - B

A is Stadium, B is Fractal??

 

[Lysander]

Here you go. This is the IIC+ on the Stadium and Fractal FM3, both at current release firmware. Both run through the same York YA MES OS Mix 01 IR. No reverb or effects or post processing. Settings on both amps are identical. I alternate between the two units with an A/B switcher for each phrase of chords or chugs. I am not revealing which is which until tomorrow. Are there differences? Maybe? None that make any difference to me. I'll use either of those tones. Pick it apart all you want with golden ears, but there's nothing here that couldn't be tweaked into alignment if needed. Oh, and the "feel" is the same to me.

Reasonably certain A is Fractal, as i noticed it being a bit more boomy than Stadium in other shootouts.

But man, are we in hair splitting territory now - if you didn't tell me those were two different devices, i wouldn't have even noticed. Both sound incredible.

 

[Richard_G]

Thanks for posting these, @Karl Houseknecht, this was very interesting!

 

[GTR37]

A = Agoura
B = Fractal

I didn’t go to any special trouble to match these other than using the same settings and then trying to match levels. Imagine what someone with better ears for that could do.

I had the same results with the 2203, EVH, Revv, and Ecstasy. The AC30 is more different because they are different amps but it is still close. This amp is particularly eyebrow raising because Fractal is known for / prides themselves on their accuracy of the Mark models.

My main point here is anyone claiming “light years” of difference in the modeling quality between the platforms is listening with their eyes. And even I fully expected Fractal to still have an edge. If they do, it’s not something I can quantify.

They were very close
It sounds like the only amp that may have something odd now Is the 5153
And maybe Jubilee
But the Mark 2 , XTC, 800, Revv, SLO
They seem to have nailed pretty good

 

[GTR37]

What are you hearing there?

Again , I am only judging a clip but there seemed to be some discrepancy vs Dead pan real amp and the Stadium
Albeit it could could down to many things mic’s , cab choices etc
Although I think he used same IRs
Mirror pointed it out to , but in your clips I don’t hear that kind of tone
Kind of woofy lows like depth is cranked and and upper mid spike that is a bit too present

 

[Mongillo19]

Me trying to be helpful

 

[JiveTurkey]

Credit to @MirrorProfiles for the DI:

AM4:

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

Stadium

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

Both 2C+ with Miko plugin (same cab settings).
My first time successfully reamping (ever) but I'm worried I did it wrong given how different the amps sound. However, it was done over USB for both the stadium and AM so leveling should be correct? Anyway, I got some FOMO on the 1.2 update so I am borrowing a friends to make sure I'm not a dumbass and buy another stadium honestly, I think I prefer the Stadium here but it doesn't really have the dryness of the AM....which I personally associate with the Mark series.

I like the Stadium better here too. IRL; I got some OK results but greatly preferred the FAS stuff. And again; if I have to use extreme settings to get the results I want; that seems like a step backwards.

 

[Marksh]

I like the Stadium better here too. IRL; I got some OK results but greatly preferred the FAS stuff. And again; if I have to use extreme settings to get the results I want; that seems like a step backwards.

Although @Karl Houseknecht used the same exact settings on both.

 

[JiveTurkey]

Although @Karl used the same exact settings on both.

My point was I'm never setting the presence on .6. Ever. I know you need to listen with your ears and not your eyes but if I dialed the real amp in; the presence is going up just because that's the way I dial it in. This just takes me back to the "Set the master on .5 and you're set!"