Kemper Profiler MK 2

[northcountry]

Here is a better explanation of the technology in German. I used subtitles to translate to English. If the translation was accurate — Not AI. Quick. Higher resolution and also a further expansion of liquid profiling.

 

[hunter]

Here is a better explanation of the technology in German. I used subtitles to translate to English. If the translation was accurate — Not AI. Quick. Higher resolution and also a further expansion of liquid profiling.

Here is what he says.
"Yes, exactly. It's still announced, we're not quite finished yet. The new Profiling 2.0 for the Profiler Mark 2. This applies to the Profiler Head, Rack and Stage and to the Profiler Player. But for the entire Player series we will be making a free software update with our Profiling 2.0. It's a completely new development. It's not AI, but a precise measurement that takes an astonishingly short time. But that was more of a happy accident than the goal. The whole profiling process takes under a minute and it's very high resolution. The goal was that we would improve on our old profiling system. Yes, and we can already see that the old profile is still amazingly good. The new profiling is brilliant, among other things, also with DI profiles. These are profiles that you record without a cabinet. Uh, the old profiling has a few weaknesses, for example. And, another nice thing about the new profiling is that we determine the bass resonance of the cabinet and the speaker and, as I say, the values of this, it makes the frequency and the intensity visible and you can then adjust them. Yes, it's almost like an extension of our Liquid Profiling, where you have real controls, basically from the real device and the real physics. It is almost like an extension to that. It is true that you can take bass resonance and yes, it really does become lively, so the whole thing is moving away at least for us more and more from the idea that a profile is just a snapshot and that you basically have to take it as it is and take it for granted and exactly or if you adjust it if you want to modify things that these modifications are also authentic and not somehow artificial. Okay, that was always our goal. We have to introduce new sounds. It is also intended for Player Level 1." - CK


Less static cabs than IR with a realistic modelling of bass resonance is where I am totally in! Depending how well it's done

 

[Deleted member 3656]

Here is what he says.
"Yes, exactly. It's still announced, we're not quite finished yet. The new Profiling 2.0 for the Profiler Mark 2. This applies to the Profiler Head, Rack and Stage and to the Profiler Player. But for the entire Player series we will be making a free software update with our Profiling 2.0. It's a completely new development. It's not AI, but a precise measurement that takes an astonishingly short time. But that was more of a happy accident than the goal. The whole profiling process takes under a minute and it's very high resolution. The goal was that we would improve on our old profiling system. Yes, and we can already see that the old profile is still amazingly good. The new profiling is brilliant, among other things, also with DI profiles. These are profiles that you record without a cabinet. Uh, the old profiling has a few weaknesses, for example. And, another nice thing about the new profiling is that we determine the bass resonance of the cabinet and the speaker and, as I say, the values of this, it makes the frequency and the intensity visible and you can then adjust them. Yes, it's almost like an extension of our Liquid Profiling, where you have real controls, basically from the real device and the real physics. It is almost like an extension to that. It is true that you can take bass resonance and yes, it really does become lively, so the whole thing is moving away at least for us more and more from the idea that a profile is just a snapshot and that you basically have to take it as it is and take it for granted and exactly or if you adjust it if you want to modify things that these modifications are also authentic and not somehow artificial. Okay, that was always our goal. We have to introduce new sounds. It is also intended for Player Level 1." - CK


Less static cabs than IR with a realistic modelling of bass resonance is where I am totally in! Depending how well it's done

Sounds interesting!

 

[Tanax]

The proof is in the pudding. All that sounds great, but means nothing until we get to hear it

 

[Deleted member 3656]

The proof is in the pudding. All that sounds great, but means nothing until we get to hear it

At least they gave out some information about what they're doing. I think just a sign of life is enough for many. I'm glad they did more than just press two buttons in the editor, at least in terms of explanation.

 

[northcountry]

I’m not against AI but I like the idea that they are charting a course without it and that the profiles may be more adjustable. In a way they are forging their own path. It probably won’t beat AI in null tests, but is that all that important?

 

[Tritium3H]

Only issue with Tonex is that it is not as of yet an all in one device. If you want FX of equal quality you need to go outside the IKM world and spend some $$. Tonex and a VP4 = ~ same as KPP maxed, Tonex w/H90 = > KPP or a used FM3T, Tonex and the appropriate Strymon collection = >> either.

Not to forget the additional latency hit caused by adding another device requiring AD/DA conversion. Unfortunately, S/PDIF is not available on the ToneX, although it is featured on the Fractal VP4. For a complete, feature-rich pedalboard device, the KPP is hard to beat.

 

[DrewJD82]

 

[dws2384]

Here is what he says.
"Yes, exactly. It's still announced, we're not quite finished yet. The new Profiling 2.0 for the Profiler Mark 2. This applies to the Profiler Head, Rack and Stage and to the Profiler Player. But for the entire Player series we will be making a free software update with our Profiling 2.0. It's a completely new development. It's not AI, but a precise measurement that takes an astonishingly short time. But that was more of a happy accident than the goal. The whole profiling process takes under a minute and it's very high resolution. The goal was that we would improve on our old profiling system. Yes, and we can already see that the old profile is still amazingly good. The new profiling is brilliant, among other things, also with DI profiles. These are profiles that you record without a cabinet. Uh, the old profiling has a few weaknesses, for example. And, another nice thing about the new profiling is that we determine the bass resonance of the cabinet and the speaker and, as I say, the values of this, it makes the frequency and the intensity visible and you can then adjust them. Yes, it's almost like an extension of our Liquid Profiling, where you have real controls, basically from the real device and the real physics. It is almost like an extension to that. It is true that you can take bass resonance and yes, it really does become lively, so the whole thing is moving away at least for us more and more from the idea that a profile is just a snapshot and that you basically have to take it as it is and take it for granted and exactly or if you adjust it if you want to modify things that these modifications are also authentic and not somehow artificial. Okay, that was always our goal. We have to introduce new sounds. It is also intended for Player Level 1." - CK


Less static cabs than IR with a realistic modelling of bass resonance is where I am totally in! Depending how well it's done

So no reason it shouldn’t play on mk1 series chip with the same DSP chip then? Also strange that if it’s mostly the same process but higher resolution why it’s taking so long. Anyways, I hope it’s great but I’m sceptical and nothing he said there inspires much confidence of it being a big step forwards. Also, happy accident? Lol. Usually even if that’s the case you don’t mention that. First time I’ve heard him say that the original profiling had any weaknesses though.

 

[Monkey Man]

Less static cabs than IR...

This was always the case but the bass-resonance stuff he talked about is new.

I can't remember the deets but IIRC some of the behaviour due to impedance (physical as well as electrical) was captured.

 

[Gary_W]

Trade shows are really expensive to attend and you book your place a long way in advance. There’s been major shows that Kemper haven’t attended in the past due to having nothing new to show at that time. The fact they were there surely means they were expecting to show the mk2 profiling at this event otherwise, based on past behaviour, they simply wouldn’t have bothered going and saved the budget.

The fact that their website still says ‘expected Summer’ and they then turn up to a show and present precisely nothing are two good indicators that this is running late. I wish they would communicate and throw their users a bone.

But for now there's things about Kemper that are unique. No solution integrates a power amp this way, as far as I know. Liquid profiling is cool even if arguably limited, and the library of profiles dwarfs anything else out there in volume.

I just don't know how sustainable their business is anymore, and how desirable what they'll offer moving on will be, provided other solutions. But clearly they're still doing well in sales for now.

Their mantra has always been that profiling tech gives better results than modelling tech. Moving more towards liquid profiles (I like liquid but the tonestack is ‘just a model’) plus him now finally saying the profiling he always claimed is perfect is not perfect? That’s not helping in the fight against other units out there that claim modelling is the way to go. There are solutions out there (and they are multiplying) where they do the modelling aspect much more effectively than Kemper and now there are things that do both. If their new capture tech isn’t in a (patentable!) class of its own then their offering becomes increasingly difficult to position in a crowded market. And when your marketing department appears to not exist (if their communications style is anything to go by) then that’s an issue.

This was always the case but the bass-resonance stuff he talked about is new.

I can't remember the deets but IIRC some of the behaviour due to impedance (physical as well as electrical) was captured.

Hi MM - I remember you from a few years back on the Kemper forum and I hope you’re keeping well :) Although I still have (and like) my Mk1 toaster, you can probably tell from the above that they’ve lost me as an upgrade customer….. I still wish them well and hope they manage to pull something out of the bag. And learn from some of the other companies that communication, done right, is a good thing.

 

[2dor]

Here is what he says.
"Yes, exactly. It's still announced, we're not quite finished yet. The new Profiling 2.0 for the Profiler Mark 2. This applies to the Profiler Head, Rack and Stage and to the Profiler Player. But for the entire Player series we will be making a free software update with our Profiling 2.0. It's a completely new development. It's not AI, but a precise measurement that takes an astonishingly short time. But that was more of a happy accident than the goal. The whole profiling process takes under a minute and it's very high resolution. The goal was that we would improve on our old profiling system. Yes, and we can already see that the old profile is still amazingly good. The new profiling is brilliant, among other things, also with DI profiles. These are profiles that you record without a cabinet. Uh, the old profiling has a few weaknesses, for example. And, another nice thing about the new profiling is that we determine the bass resonance of the cabinet and the speaker and, as I say, the values of this, it makes the frequency and the intensity visible and you can then adjust them. Yes, it's almost like an extension of our Liquid Profiling, where you have real controls, basically from the real device and the real physics. It is almost like an extension to that. It is true that you can take bass resonance and yes, it really does become lively, so the whole thing is moving away at least for us more and more from the idea that a profile is just a snapshot and that you basically have to take it as it is and take it for granted and exactly or if you adjust it if you want to modify things that these modifications are also authentic and not somehow artificial. Okay, that was always our goal. We have to introduce new sounds. It is also intended for Player Level 1." - CK


Less static cabs than IR with a realistic modelling of bass resonance is where I am totally in! Depending how well it's done

Sounds promising. I personally don’t care what they're using as long as the results faithfully represent the captured gear.

 

[BenIfin]

Sounds promising. I personally don’t care what they're using as long as the results faithfully represent the captured gear.

^ This is all that matters ^

Either it will (i) sound about the same as MK1 Profiling ? -or- (ii) be a bit better sounding than MK1 Profiling (?) -or- (iii) be noticeably better than MK1 Profiling and be on par with the current market leader(s) (?)

I couldn't give two hoots "how" they do it as long as its (iii) ..... here's hoping

 

[Deleted member 3656]

There are solutions out there (and they are multiplying) where they do the modelling aspect much more effectively than Kemper and now there are things that do both.

Many others do modelling more extensively for sure. For example, fractal models the master volume of amps quite well. This can change the tone massively, like it often happens with real amps. For me it's integral to finding a tone I like.

But nobody offers a capturing solution where the captures themselves are tweak-able the way Kemper profiles are. Their definition control, for example, is very powerful, and can also alter the sound substantially. Liquid profiling, even if limited, is combined with profiles a unique way.

Personally, I never tweaked Kemper profiles much at all, but liquid profiling wasn't out then.

 

[Digital Igloo]

The new profiling was running in the Guitar Summit booth. Didn’t get a chance to try it myself but everyone I spoke to who did said it sounds fantastic.

 

[Frodebro]

The new profiling was running in the Guitar Summit booth. Didn’t get a chance to try it myself but everyone I spoke to who did said it sounds fantastic.

You’re probably not their favorite person at the moment…

 

[BenIfin]

The new profiling was running in the Guitar Summit booth. Didn’t get a chance to try it myself but everyone I spoke to who did said it sounds fantastic.

You're a legitimate, genuine class act D.I. Not many of you left in the M.I or business in general for that matter these days :)

 

[LP59]

The new profiling was running in the Guitar Summit booth. Didn’t get a chance to try it myself but everyone I spoke to who did said it sounds fantastic.

Have there been any reports about Kemper's new profiling from anyone in the army of youtubers at Guitar Summit? I haven't seen any. This is the first indication I've seen that Kemper is demonstrating anything. Maybe they are being sworn to secrecy. Or maybe they don't think it's newsworthy?

 

[Gary_W]

The new profiling was running in the Guitar Summit booth. Didn’t get a chance to try it myself but everyone I spoke to who did said it sounds fantastic.

You’re a gent to say so - I am sure they will do a great job with their new profiling and it’s great to hear this from someone. It’s just a shame that it’s you saying it rather than them!! It is insane to throw resources at a show where, till now, the only person I’ve heard so far saying they’ve heard the new profiling is the product manager for a competitor.

I just wish they’d actually communicate with their user base in a way that approaches normality. I completely get that there are things you can tell the market and there are things you cannot. In your role, you live and breath this - you answer what you can, you also sometimes say ‘that’s a future, I can’t talk about it now’. And very few people here give you shit for that approach because you’ve said *something* and they have the confidence that you’ve been as open as you can be right now based upon your throwing people bones as often as you can. You make it look natural and easy which is a compliment because doing this stuff elegantly is neither.

Sure, you can’t please everyone - there are fanboys that defend everything. There are haters. There are tons of reasonable people in the middle that just want info and will accept it. I am not, and never have been, trying to give these guys a hard time. I would encourage them to look at (for example) *your* public communications during this show when you’re launching something shiny and realise that there is a better way. I want them to thrive - I’m buying a Stadium but I have a lot of love for my toaster and hope they can support happy customers for many years. They are being even more ‘them’ than usual right now.

 

[namathan_zirwir]

Just a bit weird, not much info on it, no release date. Basically nothing, besides hearing feedback from a handful of users - saying that it sounds good.

Anyone here get a chance to play it at the Summit?