Kemper Profiler MK 2

[Monkey Man]

Thanks for asking - they’re all good thanks :) I’m a really slow songwriter at the best of times and unfortunately I hit a wall just before covid hit. Lots of other life things too in these last few years…. Consequently, music has taken a back seat and I haven’t actually written / recorded anything in years or played live. Sorry to hear that you’ve been going through it and I hope things are looking up for you and you’re managing to get some music time in.

Haven't written / recorded anything in years either Gary. Many years.
Sorry things got tough for you too man. Hopefully its a case of things can only get better from here on in for both of us.

 

[paisleywookiee]

I guess We all are a little sharp on delivery times. We all want things to be developed quickly... but, in my experience, developing products is a very difficult task. There are always a lot of factors, issues that not always depend on yourself, many of them are unpredicted, and dev times are usually much longer than expected. No matter what kind of product... unless you are launching something "standard", of course. But We want new things. Better than ever things. Groundbreaking things. And that takes time.

I develop industrial products. My boss always want projects to be finished in 6 months... and the result is always around 18 months when everything goes OK. Usually more. Then, the comercial team starts to sell the product a year before it´s ready to launch.

That´s what is offensive to us. They say MK2 is going to be launched in fall... but most probably it wont. Others make an stupid S.O.O.N. campaign... And others do other things. But it´s not usual to see delivery times to be accurately accomplished.

So I´m OK with long delivery times, and I empathize with companies in that regard. However, I get pissed by unreal launch promises.

Yeah, I mean they've only had 14 years to figure something out for a MkII. Gotta give em some leeway.

 

[Sedaxel]

Yeah, I mean they've only had 14 years to figure something out for a MkII. Gotta give em some leeway.

Well... I don´t own a Kemper, but I think the unit has evolved since its launch. Even though they did nothing (or almost nothing) to the profiling tech. And 14 years ago the "updates culture" was not so normal as of today. Nowadays, it´s a sacrilege not keeping a good update pace... But not so much back in the day. Maybe they didn´t keep up the same pace as Fractal, but they didn´t stay sleeping either (again, apart from leaving profiling almost untouched).

I´m curious for what they have to offer now. They have a tough situation because the competition has surpassed them clearly. And the fact that the hardware has not been upgraded as it should, put things even tougher.

As I see it, it´s almost impossible that they launch an up-to-date device because We all already know the MKII hardware... and it´s dated.

 

[PorcinePicker]

I think it's safe to say that Kemper utterly failed to....

 

[paisleywookiee]

Well... I don´t own a Kemper, but I think the unit has evolved since its launch. Even though they did nothing (or almost nothing) to the profiling tech. And 14 years ago the "updates culture" was not so normal as of today. Nowadays, it´s a sacrilege not keeping a good update pace... But not so much back in the day. Maybe they didn´t keep up the same pace as Fractal, but they didn´t stay sleeping either (again, apart from leaving profiling almost untouched).

I´m curious for what they have to offer now. They have a tough situation because the competition has surpassed them clearly. And the fact that the hardware has not been upgraded as it should, put things even tougher.

As I see it, it´s almost impossible that they launch an up-to-date device because We all already know the MKII hardware... and it´s dated.

Oh yeah, they’ve totally kept it moving with new updates. I’m just saying that they knew the time would come that they’d need a MkII device, and therefore should have been planning ahead for that.

 

[Sascha Franck]

I think it's safe to say that Kemper utterly failed to....

View attachment 52548

Or maybe plan C...

 

[dean701]

I think people forget the mindset of Christoph Kemper. I think he was completely content with the original Kemper design. One and done. Many people were happy with it (me included) It was only through the bombardment of feature requests or perhaps boredom that he added things along the way. I still remember the Andertons video where he went on to advertise his new gig bag. He marches to the beat of his own drum. Walking around in sandals and shorts, doing what he wants, when he wants. When it does come out, I think it will be an improvement. I would say spring '26 at this point before everything is stable. Just my opinion.

 

[Deleted member 3656]

I think people forget the mindset of Christoph Kemper. I think he was completely content with the original Kemper design. One and done.

It seems far fetched to me that they believed they could release a unit of this kind and never add new features though. They were one of the first (if not the first?) to have a system of online updates, which they did with their previous product.

"One and done", I believe, applies more to profiling itself. But they couldn't keep that up now that several do arguably overall better with capture functions. It was easier not to update the core function when there were some demands some people made, but there were no alternatives.

Then again, from the translation of the short video, it seems that this was born out of accident? I don't know what this means.

 

[Enchilada Jones]

…


Then again, from the translation of the short video, it seems that this was born out of accident? I don't know what this means.

I was under the impression from his comment about the ‘accident’ that it was about how the process now takes less time.
They planned to improve the quality and feature set it but they didn’t know they would also speed up the process by making those improvements.

 

[Monkey Man]

Prediction:

I reckon that at some point they'll introduce dual playback of Profiles.

Many requested it over the years and Christoph's take was that the hardware simply wasn't powerful-enough to manage it; he didn't poo-poo the idea.

I reckon it's safe to assume that the new DSP / CPU power will take care of that "deficiency".

 

[Orvillain]

Question for Kemper peoples - does the upcoming Helix Stadium 'proxy' functionality give you pause for thought on Kemper 2.0, even with the new improved profiling?

 

[dean701]

it's a rat race right now. Tonex upped their game. Stadium seems like the dream UI. Kemper mk2 eventually will come. Even small products like the Valeton gp-5 are putting out some good sounds (including NAM loading) One thing is for sure, my AXE3 will be going. I'd really like to test drive both the Kemper 2 and the Stadium before purchasing but that seems moot since a lot of the functionality won't be there at launch. The Jon video with Eric left me the feeling that it might be another year before Proxy even rears its head. It sounds like they haven't even plotted out the algorithms yet.

I think Line 6 played too much of an NDSP card with so many features missing. The only difference is, that I think Line 6 will fulfill their promises.

 

[Gary_W]

Question for Kemper peoples - does the upcoming Helix Stadium 'proxy' functionality give you pause for thought on Kemper 2.0, even with the new improved profiling?

I have a pre order in for a stadium after 12+ years with Kemper Mk1

The concept of proxy brought me to the Stadium table because, workflow wise, I’ve been used to buying commercial profiles / downloading from the free user base and then scrolling through until I found a sound I liked…. There’s certainly a message / perception over at the Kemper forum that profiling is superior to modelling and that if you go for modelling you’ll be tweaking forever. I believed this. So having something that did the (in my mindset at the time) ‘superior’ thing of capturing was something I did not want to give up.

I recently tried Helix native and discovered how good modelling can be, even last generation. I hadn’t usd a modelled since Tonelab and Pod XT….. Once I got into the mindset of Native, I found I spent less time dialing in than I spent scrolling through profiles. Plus it made more tactile sense to me - the liquid profiling ON Kemper went some way to making profiles more like the real amp but it still doesn’t give the same experience as something modelled from the ground up in terms of behaviour - you are still better off choosing a different profile if you’re going too far IMO. That might change with Mk2 - I hope so….. But in Native, I enjoyed geeking out with all the controls in the Dumble model for instance and it was positive tweaking - not a depressing rabbit hole. And the eq switches on the Matchless….. these are things you can’t do with the Kemper plus liquid - you’re relying on the profile maker to have done this. Fair enough, different mindset, they both work but I strangely felt closer to the original amp’s ethos with modelling for this reason. This is arguably ridiculous as I’ve never played a Matchless but I enjoyed the model far, far more than I’ve enjoyed profiles of Matchless from commercial vendors.

So although I’m looking forward to what proxy will do, I care about it far less now that I’ve experienced what modelling can achieve. Agoura, along with the focus view to help me dial in what I want in a hurry, is the thing that’s making me buy this rather than Kemper II….. The proxy side of things will be *at least* as good as current Kemper (which has kept me happy for years) and I am factoring in that we’ll be able to clone dirt pedals. You can do this with Kemper 1 but, as you can only run one profile at a time and they have given zero indication that this will change, you’re buying an unknown future if you think they’ll go there…. With stadium, you’ll be able to clone a dirt pedal with proxy and run that into an amp model….. or maybe another clone - who knows??

For me, the promise of better sound on mk2 just wasn’t enough *compared to what else is out there now*. It’ll absolutely be a great unit for folks that want it and I wish them every success but we’re all different and my preferences have changed due to having choice.

 

[dean701]

As long as Line 6 take their time with Proxy and do it right, then all will turn out fine. There are a few modelers out there with sub par profiling/capturing already and I'd hate to see them fall into that category.
I'd rather see NAM integration if that were the case. I think they would capture the market with the best UI and NAM.

 

[2dor]

I think Line 6 played too much of an NDSP card with so many features missing. The only difference is, that I think Line 6 will fulfill their promises.

Stadium isn't released yet though so nobody knows if there really are "so many features missing". True, they did mention Proxy's coming next year and Showcase sooner but after launch but that can pretty much change between now & release.

I wouldn't even draw a parallel to the QC (in terms of promises & delivery) until Stadium's out.

 

[dean701]

Stadium isn't released yet though so nobody knows if there really are "so many features missing". True, they did mention Proxy's coming next year and Showcase sooner but after launch but that can pretty much change between now & release.

I wouldn't even draw a parallel to the QC (in terms of promises & delivery) until Stadium's out.

Don't forget there is only a skeleton crew of Agoura amp models at this point and the effects are still those from the Helix.

 

[dws2384]

Stadium isn't released yet though so nobody knows if there really are "so many features missing". True, they did mention Proxy's coming next year and Showcase sooner but after launch but that can pretty much change between now & release.

I wouldn't even draw a parallel to the QC (in terms of promises & delivery) until Stadium's out.

I think DI said they are getting close to a release candidate of 1.1 already, which would have showcase IIRC. if there’s any company in this space I would count on following through with features they said they would it’s Line 6

 

[Lysander]

I think DI said they are getting close to a release candidate of 1.1 already, which would have showcase IIRC.

He mentioned in passing that they might wrap up development on 1.1 "this week", but there're still a shitton of rounds of testing before signing it off for release.

And yeah, Line 6 and Fractal are the only two players in the game i blindly trust to deliver on their promises these days.

 

[Deleted member 3656]

There’s certainly a message / perception over at the Kemper forum that profiling is superior to modelling and that if you go for modelling you’ll be tweaking forever. I believed this. So having something that did the (in my mindset at the time) ‘superior’ thing of capturing was something I did not want to give up.

I think that perception used to be very common. I've often seen it presented as a fact of the universe. Capture devices are "easy and fast" and modellers are "difficult and slow".

But even though I've found some great profiles along the way (especially with tonex recently), in general it's faster and easier for me to get where I want to with good modelling. It's not gonna be like that for everyone, but I suspect some don't realize how working with modelling doesn't have to be as convoluted as they imagine.

If you settle on some good IRs, it's not rocket science to adjust a good JCM 800 sim for the desired result. You may have to experiment a bit, learning about the amp, yes... But a lot of time can also go into searching for the right capture.

In terms of results, I think both modelling and capturing can be great. I don't think one is somehow inherently superior to the other.

 

[ian_dissonance]

Prediction:

I reckon that at some point they'll introduce dual playback of Profiles.

Many requested it over the years and Christoph's take was that the hardware simply wasn't powerful-enough to manage it; he didn't poo-poo the idea.

I reckon it's safe to assume that the new DSP / CPU power will take care of that "deficiency".

Thought it was more or less confirmed that the DSP is the same in MkI and mkII?