Hopefully....I'm going to eat some crow (Fender Tonemaster Pro content)

[timbuck3]

Yes, a Bassman. Pete Townshend's Bassman, to be precise. He brought it into Marshall's music store and asked if they could make him a copy of it (Fender guitars and amps were extremely hard to come by in England at the time). Some substitutions had to be made due to parts availability, and the original prototypes eventually became the JTM 45.

Interesting.. thanx.. i love the olddd fender 4-10 amps… the had sizzle and balls yet cleaned up well.

 

[JiveTurkey]

Is the crow still on the plate?

 

[texhex]

That's exactly what they are.

Yeah, it's actually a pretty big bust because the amp models can sound very good. The issue is that if you are using your own IR you are screwed because with the SIC set to none it doesn't work correctly for all amp models.

I've been able to pick and choose through a few of the provided SIC options on an amp model that doesn't work correctly with my own IR and get it sounding good but it leaves me wondering how "off" the sound of the final result is from the actual modeled amp. This is when I can back-to-back compare the TMP model directly to the real amp (or even the models in the AXE-III which I trust their accuracy) and the TMP is totally off using my own IR and SIC set to none.

Poor decision on Fender's part to implement it like this but the average Joe TMP user will probably never know the difference because they aren't anally comparing to this degree, but accuracy matters IMO, accuracy all the way through the signal chain, including the IR and SIC. It's literally the core part what I'm paying for in an amp modeler.

I'm keeping the TMP as of now because I got such a ridiculous deal on a used unit but for full retail money this would be a huge deal breaker for me when compared to the AXE, Helix, Kemper, Tonex and any other digital solution that does this correctly.

John Calipari, the head coach of the men’s basketball team at the University of Kentucky was making a comment of the effects of a negative, “non team player” on his teams, and the effect just one bad apple can have on the bunch. But he used a little different metaphor:

"I call a guy in like you to my office, and I say, 'Son, there is a bucket of ice cream and there's a bucket of poop," Calipari said to Patrick. "You can put all the ice cream you want in that poop and it doesn't change. It's poop!

"But you put one pinch of that poop in that ice cream, you ruin that ice cream. Son, you're the poop in our ice cream. You are the poop in our ice cream."

Right now the SIC implementation in the TMP is the poop in the ice cream...

 

[mikah912]

Is the crow still on the plate?

It is. That being said, I can only co-sign the criticism about the SiC implementation. It just makes zero sense, and it disincentivizes you from using third-party IRs. After all, even if you pick a SiC that sounds good with a certain IR....is that what the IR actually sounds like? Or are you Frankenstein-ing something new and weird together?

Also, while I love the spring reverb, the plates and halls are....ok. I appreciate them having a few different "space" reverb types, but none are a bump on the butt on Fractal's. Or even Line 6, frankly.

That's kind of a recurring theme with the effects: They clearly tried to nail breadth out of the gate, but it's at the expense of depth. They have a feedbacker effect that works simply and is easy to dial in...but it has a bug where it just cuts out for a lot of notes in 3-4 seconds. Just dies off. It's not the gate, either. I've tried it on patches with no gate in the chain and no gate turned on in the amp block....same issues. It needs a touch up, but I have no idea if that's even on their radar.

That being said, it's still fun as hell to work with, and the onboard cabs each have a sweet spot where they can sound as good as most of your favorite IRs. I just save those as block presets so I don't have to bother moving around mics, spot-by-spot anymore.

It's still my backup bae. My closest friends and I get away from our families once a year and write and record an album over a Fri-to-Sun period. I brought both my TMP and my FM9 for usage, and the TMP never left the padded bag. Once I set up the FM9, everyone appreciated the wealth of presets, esoteric options to allow us to do proggier stuff, persistent tuner on the display to keep the workflow going, etc. Whenever someone got stuck on their gear (there were about 7 of us in total switching in/out of multiple instruments, so the in-room mixing got muddled and tricky sometimes), I was usually asked to dial them a better tone on my FM9.

@FractalAudio made a beast with that FM9 (and I'm using the non-turbo OG version), and it's going to be tough for any gear to catch up to it. TMP is like the fun, more modern younger sibling that's cool to hang with, but also easy to tell to get lost when you wanna get super serious. I'm keeping it, but I have no misunderstanding where it sits in the pecking order.

 

[timbuck3]

Well fractal is wayyyyyy ahead of fender in rhe modeling area of course. I dont trust fender modeling.. i even trust boss/roland more

 

[metropolis_4]

However the sausage gets made, in the end all that matters to me is how it sounds and feels. And the Fender amp models in the TMP sound and feel very good to me.

I fully agree that some of the effects are lacking and nowhere close to the level of Fractal effects.

 

[mikah912]

However the sausage gets made, in the end all that matters to me is how it sounds and feels. And the Fender amp models in the TMP sound and feel very good to me.

I fully agree that some of the effects are lacking and nowhere close to the level of Fractal effects.

To be clear, there are a good number of TMP models I would have zero issue opting for versus their Fractal counterparts. HBE-100, Soldano, most of the Fenders. The EVH Stealth Blue and Red aren't far behind either.

 

[Tritium3H]

Well fractal is wayyyyyy ahead of fender in rhe modeling area of course. I dont trust fender modeling.. i even trust boss/roland more

Yes, we will be sure to take your non-ownership, non-experience, nonsense opinions into due account.

 

[JCW308]

Yes, we will be sure to take your non-ownership, non-experience, nonsense opinions into due account.

I've owned all of the above. At the same time even. The Fractal does kill just about everything else on effects and amp modeling. Not that the TMP is bad. It's just that the Fractal is so much better.

 

[banned]

Sheesh Tim, everyone knows you - even the new guy

 

[Dominant7]

It is. That being said, I can only co-sign the criticism about the SiC implementation. It just makes zero sense, and it disincentivizes you from using third-party IRs. After all, even if you pick a SiC that sounds good with a certain IR....is that what the IR actually sounds like? Or are you Frankenstein-ing something new and weird together?

Also, while I love the spring reverb, the plates and halls are....ok. I appreciate them having a few different "space" reverb types, but none are a bump on the butt on Fractal's. Or even Line 6, frankly.

That's kind of a recurring theme with the effects: They clearly tried to nail breadth out of the gate, but it's at the expense of depth. They have a feedbacker effect that works simply and is easy to dial in...but it has a bug where it just cuts out for a lot of notes in 3-4 seconds. Just dies off. It's not the gate, either. I've tried it on patches with no gate in the chain and no gate turned on in the amp block....same issues. It needs a touch up, but I have no idea if that's even on their radar.

That being said, it's still fun as hell to work with, and the onboard cabs each have a sweet spot where they can sound as good as most of your favorite IRs. I just save those as block presets so I don't have to bother moving around mics, spot-by-spot anymore.

It's still my backup bae. My closest friends and I get away from our families once a year and write and record an album over a Fri-to-Sun period. I brought both my TMP and my FM9 for usage, and the TMP never left the padded bag. Once I set up the FM9, everyone appreciated the wealth of presets, esoteric options to allow us to do proggier stuff, persistent tuner on the display to keep the workflow going, etc. Whenever someone got stuck on their gear (there were about 7 of us in total switching in/out of multiple instruments, so the in-room mixing got muddled and tricky sometimes), I was usually asked to dial them a better tone on my FM9.

@FractalAudio made a beast with that FM9 (and I'm using the non-turbo OG version), and it's going to be tough for any gear to catch up to it. TMP is like the fun, more modern younger sibling that's cool to hang with, but also easy to tell to get lost when you wanna get super serious. I'm keeping it, but I have no misunderstanding where it sits in the pecking order.

I feel EXACTLY the same way, but substitute Kemper for Fractal. Mine is just sitting in my studio because I'm too stubborn to take the hit selling it, so I"ll keep it and hope that it gets better one day.

 

[timbuck3]

Yes, we will be sure to take your non-ownership, non-experience, nonsense opinions into due account.

Mighty kind of you

 

[Tritium3H]

Mighty kind of you

I was giving you some tough love. Nevertheless, it is true. You constantly opine on equipment (Fractal, Fender TMP, Kemper, etc.) that you have never owned. You have admitted this fact, many times. It is just weird (to me) that you would wade into a positive Fender TMP thread and begin bashing away…with no personal knowledge or experience to justify your beliefs.

I have nothing against you personally, and wish you well.

 

[Desertdweller]

@FractalAudio made a beast with that FM9 (and I'm using the non-turbo OG version), and it's going to be tough for any gear to catch up to it. TMP is like the fun, more modern younger sibling that's cool to hang with, but also easy to tell to get lost when you wanna get super serious. I'm keeping it, but I have no misunderstanding where it sits in the pecking order.

The crazy thing about the Axe FX 3 and it's floorboard variants is that it's so much more than an amp modeler. It's a 100% digital studio solution. Need to run vocals through an 1176 compressor? It's in the box. Need a 10 tap delay to layer into an acoustic part? It's in there. Recorded a piano in a nice room but the room sound didn't really come through the mic? There are several room reverbs that sound just like a big wooden studio room. Want to make your amp sound like it's going through an Avalon mic pre? It's in the cab block. Need big synth pads for the chorus of your song, do it on guitar with the Axe Fx synth and filters blocks.

It's the ultimate swiss army knife of studio gear, not just guitar effects.

 

[timbuck3]

Sheesh Tim, everyone knows you - even the new guy

 

[ChordInversion]

I was giving you some tough love. Nevertheless, it is true. You constantly opine on equipment (Fractal, Fender TMP, Kemper, etc.) that you have never owned.

I don't care whether someone spent the money. I only care if they used the gear they're opining on, and how well they base their opinion. There are plenty of gear owners who know very little. There's no expertise involved in providing a credit card number.

I do own a TMP.

 

[timbuck3]

I don't care whether someone spent the money. I only care if they used the gear they're opining on, and how well they base their opinion. There are plenty of gear owners who know very little. There's no expertise involved in providing a credit card number.

I do own a TMP.

Does trying the tmp for 4 hrs in a private room count?

 

[Mongillo19]

Does trying the tmp for 4 hrs in a private room count?

I'm sure the music store loved that

 

[GTR37]

Does trying the tmp for 4 hrs in a private room count?

Have you considered renting ??