Help me pick a wedge--quick!

[la szum]

I've got pretty much everything available from our live sound side, the qsc k series, the yamahas, ev's finally got a CLR, but usually I just bring the ALTO ts210/310/410 whatever, they sound close to my studio monitors where presets from the control room translate great live. Some of the others have more SPL, but just arent worth the extra cost or weight if I had to buy them for this.

The real standout, which I can almost never use because they are constantly out on rental rigs are the Turbosound wedges...wherever you stand, the things sound pretty much the same, unlike all of the regular two way wedges I have tried. The Celestion F12s do something similar, but to me they sound very very different than the studio monitors

That's nice to know.

I figured a long, long time ago the "FRFR" Chase was probably not worth the time and money
invested.

I did a quick search on the Fractal Forum in my early days using a digital modeller and quickly
found out (once again!) how full of shit guitar players are.

The dudes praising one "FRFR" option over all the others were quickly onto another "FRFR" in a matter
of months. Guess they don't read their own threads.

Feedback from others seems to only be as good as their words on a Gear Forum are----which often isn't all that
good. Humans have this infatuation with novelty followed by boredom setting in. Rinse and repeat.

 

[JiveTurkey]

That's nice to know.

I figured a long, long time ago the "FRFR" Chase was probably not worth the time and money
invested.

I did a quick search on the Fractal Forum in my early days using a digital modeller and quickly
found out (once again!) how full of shit guitar players are.

The dudes praising one "FRFR" option over all the others were quickly onto another "FRFR" in a matter
of months. Guess they don't read their own threads.

Feedback from others seems to only be as good as their words on a Gear Forum are----which often isn't all that
good. Humans have this infatuation with novelty followed by boredom setting in. Rinse and repeat.

But a $110 turd is still a $110 turd. That's what makes this particular "hunt" such a PITA

 

[la szum]

#trustnoone

#allchasingourowntails




I am not going to say which ones, but I have plunked down change on something that is
purported to be significantly better, and costs considerably more $$, only to be disappointed.

I know that is what we are here for, though.

 

[la szum]

But a $110 turd is still a $110 turd. That's what makes this particular "hunt" such a PITA

I don't enjoy my $199 Squier any less than I enjoy my $2k+ PRS guitars. in fact, I
enjoy 2 different Squiers more than either PRS Core I still own.

Some of this is objective, for sure, but most of it is subjective, if you ask me. We all
wrapped up in our heads about some thing or other related to gear, chasing tone,
and the $$$ it does or does not take to get us to wake the fuck up about it all.

(Sorry, spent the day with aging/almost dead/dying people.... so feeling more philosophical
than I typically do).

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

That's nice to know.

I figured a long, long time ago the "FRFR" Chase was probably not worth the time and money
invested.

I did a quick search on the Fractal Forum in my early days using a digital modeller and quickly
found out (once again!) how full of shit guitar players are.

The dudes praising one "FRFR" option over all the others were quickly onto another "FRFR" in a matter
of months. Guess they don't read their own threads.

Feedback from others seems to only be as good as their words on a Gear Forum are----which often isn't all that
good. Humans have this infatuation with novelty followed by boredom setting in. Rinse and repeat.

The "FRFR" forum madness seems to be driven mostly by the expectation of various users is ALL.OVER.THE.PLACE. From "Its insanely loud in my living room and doesn't give me an instant migraine. Must be good to "it doesn't sound like an amp-in-the-room when I play stuff-that-is-not-trying-to-sound-like-an-amp-in-the-room through it, it sucks" to "it does sound like an amp-in-the-room when I play stuff-that-shouldn't-sound-like-an-amp-in-the-room through it therefore it is awesomely inaccurate!!!" to "well, its no Meyer, but..."

 

[JiveTurkey]

#trustnoone

#allchasingourowntails




I am not going to say which ones, but I have plunked down change on something that is
purported to be significantly better, and costs considerably more $$, only to be disappointed.

I know that is what we are here for, though.

What's even worse. I agree with this completely, too "FRFR" shopping SUCKS in every single way that a shopping experience could suck!

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

What's even worse. I agree with this completely, too "FRFR" shopping SUCKS in every single way that a shopping experience could suck!

"This is gonna be fun to try to flip..."

 

[JiveTurkey]

"This is gonna be fun to try to flip..."

If there EVER was a reason to abuse the Amazon return policy (for all the mass market turds, at least) this is it

 

[la szum]

What's even worse. I agree with this completely, too "FRFR" shopping SUCKS in every single way that a shopping experience could suck!

I settled on stuff I can multi-purpose and also use elsewhere (vocal monitor, keyboard amp, etc.)

I am going to hide while I say this.... but some of the more expensive options sounded a little
too hi-fi with a modeller. Not sure how to describe it----other than a couple of turds
darkened my tone in a way more preferable to me.

Also, DSP in EVERY fucking "FRFR" is an epic fail! Cumulative latency is a real issue. Wish it was easier to
avoid.

 

[JiveTurkey]

I settled on stuff I can multi-purpose and also use elsewhere (vocal monitor, keyboard amp, etc.)

I am going to hide while I say this.... but some of the more expensive options sounded a little
too hi-fi with a modeller. Not sure how to describe it----other than a couple of turds
darkened my tone in a way more preferable to me.

Also, DSP in EVERY fucking "FRFR" is an epic fail! Cumulative latency is a real issue. Wish it was easier to
avoid.

You are talking to an idiot who bought a pole mount plate off Amazon and put a Mustang GT on a PA speaker stand, 6ft in the air.



Think about that for a moment.

 

[pipelineaudio]

I have zero regrets on the alto ts210 I bought when it was first available. I wanted to buy more but they were on the 4 series by then so I got those.

 

[Alex Kenivel]

I have a QSC K8.2. It has trouble producing some low fundamentals with a bass, and certain low notes in the guitar register (esp palm mutes) cause it to rattle. I think the rattling started happening over time but their licensed tech couldn't reproduce let alone figure out the problem. Then there's the Mode 4 Protect issues the bigger K.2 speakers had..really makes me regret my purchase and keeps me away from QSC.

 

[la szum]

MMMMMmmmmm..... injection molded plastics.....

They're everywhere!

 

[la szum]

I wish all FRFRs had simple 3 band EQ rather than DSP and dumbass Presets. How can I trust my
ears if I am not allowed to use them??

Even better... 3 band EQ with a Parametric/Sweepable Mids.

 

[Sascha Franck]

You are talking to an idiot who bought a pole mount plate off Amazon and put a Mustang GT on a PA speaker stand, 6ft in the air.

Fwiw, I have been reading about your endeavours accidentally @ TOP before and, well, I always thought about it as a pretty decent idea. Possibly would've went for a little less height and maybe I would've thought about adding an option to slightly angle it, but others than that, it's a great idea. Nothing as annoying as lifting up amps using whatever it is you may find at whatever venues.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Btw, I'm using an Alto TS310 myself, quite happy with the sound, but it could be better built quality. Scratchy pots with plastic shafts, not exactly what the doctor ordered (fortunately no issues once they're set, but still...). I decided to get them after a direct comparison with Mackie Thumb 12"s (which I found to be awful) and a Yamaha DBR/DXR10 (had both there). Sonically, I almost prefered the Altos over the Yamahas, but these days I'd perhaps go for the DBR because of the built quality.
I also think that the TS310 is a huge step forward compared to the TS210 (which I had borrowed before). Found the latter to be pretty flubby.

One thing all these designs seem to share is that their dynamic response will suffer once you play louder. The reason IMO is plain and simple: weight. You just need some weight to stop these things from shaking at higher volumes. I have played a number of gigs through an old, non-DSP-non-class-D powered 12" RCF wedge (easily coming in at double the weight of the Alto), and while there was pretty much no difference at lower volumes, that thing stayed pretty solid even at very high rockband-alike stage levels.

 

[gdhi11]

I'm itching to try this thing out--it's been sitting here a few days, but my living situation really prevents me from using anything without headphones.

 

[ericbr1]

I'm itching to try this thing out--it's been sitting here a few days, but my living situation really prevents me from using anything without headphones.

What a bummer!!!! I remember when I was young.. .ha. . Lots of things I wish I could do over, but living in an apartment/condo is not one of those things! Get that thing hooked up and blast thru it!

 

[pipelineaudio]

I wonder if the same flubby issue is why the turbo sounds are so damn heavy given how light their amps are.

I never really noticed with my altos,but they will physically shake the whole speaker with how light they are which can make them rattle against the tilted amp stands I put them on

 

[Sascha Franck]

I wonder if the same flubby issue is why the turbo sounds are so damn heavy given how light their amps are.

No idea, but it's not unlikely, I'd say.
I mean, you can build an extremely solid and stiff enclosure of feather light materials these days, especially ever since the event of neodymium speakers. But for very obvious reasons, it's quite easy to imagine what will happen when you blast some loud attacks (especially in the lower ranges) through them. After all, that "chest thump" that we may for example know from 4x12s has to be supported somewhere. And in case the cab is too light, it's pretty much becoming a flubby affair just because of its own "rebound". Hence, lots of energy isn't pushed towards the right direction anymore but goes pretty much wasted.

I never really noticed with my altos,but they will physically shake the whole speaker with how light they are which can make them rattle against the tilted amp stands I put them on

I can defenitely notice my TS310 becoming somewhat "spongier" at higher volumes. Nothing all that bad (and IMO for its price it's holding up pretty well anyway), but I could defenitely do with a tighter response at higher volumes, especially as soon as the music's density is increasing.

Having said all that, I have been really astonished about the Fender Rumble a bass player brought to some gigs last year. I mean, I can lift that thing with my pinky (!) and there's still quite some punch coming out of it. But then, I haven't played through it myself and the bassist was pretty much seconding what I said above, as in "yeah, volume is just right, but it's losing some punch and definition under my fingers once it's getting loud".