Can’t decide between Kemper Stage or Fractal

[laxu]

I hope you are walking around the house permanently speaking in an Australian accent.

"What's up, legends?! Uh...I mean, wife!"

 

[TimOwens316]

I haven't read the whole thread TL;DR, haha. That being said, I have the AX8 and the Kemper Rack and Stage (and the QC, please forgive me). As you know, with the Kemper you are relying on the profile, there are some really good factory profiles, some really good free profiles (if you are willing to spend a Sh!tload of time searching through them), and then there are the third party profiles. You can easily spend hundreds of dollars on commercial profiles (like I did) and not get anywhere. In the end, you are stuck trying to find profiles that will work for you.

With the Fractal you are stuck with the amp models that they offer, but there are a bunch of them to chose from. IMHO, and I'm sure this will piss off some people, they are not always accurate, don't expect to dial in the gain and tone controls like you would the actual amp and get the same result, it probably won't happen, BUT, if you can find an amp model close to what you are looking for it really doesn't take a ton of time to tweak it to suit your needs, as long as you are using the computer editor, again this is IMHO.

You mentioned ambient tones, I'm not a big FX guy but I'm pretty sure that the Fractal will win this contest every time.

The other question (at least for me) is the monitor. I use a guitar cab for a stage monitor. That makes things a little bit more complicated with the Kemper. For the most accurate results you would want what they call a Merged Profile, that way you could drive the guitar cab with a clean power amp and send a different signal to the mains that includes the cabinet portion. The problem is that there are not a bunch of Merged Profiles available. I've tried several commercial Merged Profiles and they are honestly not very good. I think the issue is that the Kemper has problems making accurate Merged Profiles, that is (IMHO) why most commercial vendors don't sell them. On the other hand it is easy to setup the Fractal to drive a guitar cab and send a separate signal to the mains that includes a speaker IR.

Just my $0.02.

 

[Mongillo19]

For the most accurate results you would want what they call a Merged Profile,

They could also use DI right? Or are you saying with merged one output can be to a "FRFR" and the other with cab disabled to your power amp?

 

[riffy]

Please, don't take this as a commentary upon the fractal line of products, because it's not. You can have trouble dialing in any type of component modeler.

Some people have it in them where they can dial in and tweak out great sounds very quickly and very easily. Others don't. For the ones that don't have that ability, finding profiles or captures is truly much easier.

 

[TimOwens316]

They could also use DI right? Or are you saying with merged one output can be to a "FRFR" and the other with cab disabled to your power amp?

So as I understand it, a DI profile is made from the FX loop of an amp, so it only includes the preamp, not the power amp. A DA (Direct Amp) profile includes the preamp and power amp as the signal is taken between the amp and speaker cabinet. A Merged profile is made by combining a DA profile and a studio profile (the studio profile includes the mic'd cab). Whenever you merge a DA profile and a Studio profile the Kemper does the math and gives you the ability to send a DA signal to your guitar cab on stage and at the same time a Studio profile to the mains that includes the cab and mic(s).

IME, the problem is that while the Kemper is pretty good at making Studio profiles it kind of struggles with DA profiles, so if you don't have an accurate DA profile the resulting Merged profile won't be accurate, in fact, it can be pretty darn bad.

Hope that makes sense.

 

[jellodog]

Please, don't take this as a commentary upon the fractal line of products, because it's not. You can have trouble dialing in any type of component modeler.

Some people have it in them where they can dial in and tweak out great sounds very quickly and very easily. Others don't. For the ones that don't have that ability, finding profiles or captures is truly much easier.

Fair point! Also - I couldn't help but notice that super cute doggo in your avatar. Awww.

 

[Fireproof]

I hope you are walking around the house permanently speaking in an Australian accent.

In the mornings he wakes up and rolls over to his wife and says “Good morning Legend!”

 

[Fireproof]

"What's up, legends?! Uh...I mean, wife!"

I swear I replied with my comment before I saw yours. Too funny.

 

[Speedyone]

Thank you EVERYONE for your contributions. I truly appreciate it!

I spent a ton of time researching Fractal and Kemper.

I have decided to go with the Kemper, for a few reasons:

1. I don’t ENJOY tweaking. I’m almost 50 years old, and spent my formative years playing through rack gear, combo amps, pedalboards, etc. I’m a “fiddle with the knobs until it sounds good” type of guy, and never ENJOYED any modeler I’ve ever had— various Boss GT units, Pods, Helix (x2), Vox Tonelab, V-Amps, J-Station, etc, etc. Too much time tweaking to get it to sound 90% close to “the real deal” just didn’t satisfy me. It may simply be that I am not skilled enough to know how to duplicate the sounds of my pedalboards and amps with modelers. That’s my fault, not the modeler’s.

I have NO DOUBT, NONE, that Fractal sounds as good or better than anything. However, I came across many videos featuring Kemper Profiles of amps like Fender Blackface and Silverface, 5150, Vintage Marshalls, where it sounded EXACTLY like the real amp!

I have yet to find a Fractal Video where the amp tone is IDENTICAL to what I have been used to playing. Not saying it isn’t POSSIBLE to create identical amp tones, I just couldn’t find those videos. I found many that showcased ambient sounds and delays/verbs which absolutely blew me away. However, I’m most interested in raw amp tones, with effects being secondary.

2. The Kemper is cheaper, and there is no wait to get one.

3. My favorite amp I have ever owned was a Gibson Lab Series L5. (Had two of them.) As a HUGE Ty Tabor fan, the fact that I can get profiles of this exact amp is amazing to me!

4. No lag when switching presets, and no NEED to create dual amp paths or use any programming hacks to make it happen; just instant channel switching.

Part of my style is sort of like Eric Johnson, where I like to switch back and forth between clean chording and high gain leads— like the intro to his first REH video.

So instant switching (EASY instant switching,) is a HUGE plus for me.

So, there’s my reasoning.

I think that I’ll be more pleased with the Kemper than any modeler I’ve ever owned. And if I can’t get the sound I want out of it, then there’s no point in trying anything else— I might just be an old fart with no technical aptitude!

I should get my Kemper by Friday, so with any luck, I’ll post back again next Saturday to share my thoughts.

Thanks again everyone, and I hope this new gear does it for me!

:)

 

[Speedyone]

Here is a link to one of the most incredible tones I’ve ever heard, from the Axe FXII.

(I have watched this countless times, and if the Kemper could do it, I’d be in heaven!)

 

[Mongillo19]

Here is a link to one of the most incredible tones I’ve ever heard, from the Axe FXII.

(I have watched this countless times, and if the Kemper could do it, I’d be in heaven!)

Hope the Kemper works out for you! To be fair, the Kemper usually gets 90% of the way their as well. Both the tone x and QC seem to be more accurate. Have you thought of looking into those?

If the Kemper could do higher gain better id be all over it. Although bands like Parkway Drive, Killswitch, and Trivium have used or use Kempers so maybe it's just me lol

 

[Stone]

Thank you EVERYONE for your contributions. I truly appreciate it!

I spent a ton of time researching Fractal and Kemper.

I have decided to go with the Kemper, for a few reasons:

1. I don’t ENJOY tweaking. I’m almost 50 years old, and spent my formative years playing through rack gear, combo amps, pedalboards, etc. I’m a “fiddle with the knobs until it sounds good” type of guy, and never ENJOYED any modeler I’ve ever had— various Boss GT units, Pods, Helix (x2), Vox Tonelab, V-Amps, J-Station, etc, etc. Too much time tweaking to get it to sound 90% close to “the real deal” just didn’t satisfy me. It may simply be that I am not skilled enough to know how to duplicate the sounds of my pedalboards and amps with modelers. That’s my fault, not the modeler’s.

I have NO DOUBT, NONE, that Fractal sounds as good or better than anything. However, I came across many videos featuring Kemper Profiles of amps like Fender Blackface and Silverface, 5150, Vintage Marshalls, where it sounded EXACTLY like the real amp!

I have yet to find a Fractal Video where the amp tone is IDENTICAL to what I have been used to playing. Not saying it isn’t POSSIBLE to create identical amp tones, I just couldn’t find those videos. I found many that showcased ambient sounds and delays/verbs which absolutely blew me away. However, I’m most interested in raw amp tones, with effects being secondary.

2. The Kemper is cheaper, and there is no wait to get one.

3. My favorite amp I have ever owned was a Gibson Lab Series L5. (Had two of them.) As a HUGE Ty Tabor fan, the fact that I can get profiles of this exact amp is amazing to me!

4. No lag when switching presets, and no NEED to create dual amp paths or use any programming hacks to make it happen; just instant channel switching.

Part of my style is sort of like Eric Johnson, where I like to switch back and forth between clean chording and high gain leads— like the intro to his first REH video.

So instant switching (EASY instant switching,) is a HUGE plus for me.

So, there’s my reasoning.

I think that I’ll be more pleased with the Kemper than any modeler I’ve ever owned. And if I can’t get the sound I want out of it, then there’s no point in trying anything else— I might just be an old fart with no technical aptitude!

I should get my Kemper by Friday, so with any luck, I’ll post back again next Saturday to share my thoughts.

Thanks again everyone, and I hope this new gear does it for me!

:)

Awesome I'm sure you will enjoy your Kemper, and es we all go with what is best for our needs and wants

 

[JiveTurkey]

What are you going to be using to monitor it with? That is the Million Dollar question.

 

[DrewJD82]

The wife is also fed up of hearing me talk about the FM9 and watching every video about the FM9

My ex dealt with it for almost 15 years; I’d write “AxeFX” on every grocery list, it’d be the answer to every Jeopardy question, birthday gift idea lists, Christmas lists, I tried putting one on the wedding registry, I remember when I finally ordered it, “Does this mean you’re finally going to shut up about it, or is this going to make it worse?”

 

[Stone]

My ex dealt with it for almost 15 years; I’d write “AxeFX” on every grocery list, it’d be the answer to every Jeopardy question, birthday gift idea lists, Christmas lists, I tried putting one on the wedding registry, I remember when I finally ordered it, “Does this mean you’re finally going to shut up about it, or is this going to make it worse?”

 

[dronerstone]

Thank you EVERYONE for your contributions. I truly appreciate it!

I spent a ton of time researching Fractal and Kemper.

I have decided to go with the Kemper, for a few reasons:

1. I don’t ENJOY tweaking. I’m almost 50 years old, and spent my formative years playing through rack gear, combo amps, pedalboards, etc. I’m a “fiddle with the knobs until it sounds good” type of guy, and never ENJOYED any modeler I’ve ever had— various Boss GT units, Pods, Helix (x2), Vox Tonelab, V-Amps, J-Station, etc, etc. Too much time tweaking to get it to sound 90% close to “the real deal” just didn’t satisfy me. It may simply be that I am not skilled enough to know how to duplicate the sounds of my pedalboards and amps with modelers. That’s my fault, not the modeler’s.

I have NO DOUBT, NONE, that Fractal sounds as good or better than anything. However, I came across many videos featuring Kemper Profiles of amps like Fender Blackface and Silverface, 5150, Vintage Marshalls, where it sounded EXACTLY like the real amp!

I have yet to find a Fractal Video where the amp tone is IDENTICAL to what I have been used to playing. Not saying it isn’t POSSIBLE to create identical amp tones, I just couldn’t find those videos. I found many that showcased ambient sounds and delays/verbs which absolutely blew me away. However, I’m most interested in raw amp tones, with effects being secondary.

2. The Kemper is cheaper, and there is no wait to get one.

3. My favorite amp I have ever owned was a Gibson Lab Series L5. (Had two of them.) As a HUGE Ty Tabor fan, the fact that I can get profiles of this exact amp is amazing to me!

4. No lag when switching presets, and no NEED to create dual amp paths or use any programming hacks to make it happen; just instant channel switching.

Part of my style is sort of like Eric Johnson, where I like to switch back and forth between clean chording and high gain leads— like the intro to his first REH video.

So instant switching (EASY instant switching,) is a HUGE plus for me.

So, there’s my reasoning.

I think that I’ll be more pleased with the Kemper than any modeler I’ve ever owned. And if I can’t get the sound I want out of it, then there’s no point in trying anything else— I might just be an old fart with no technical aptitude!

I should get my Kemper by Friday, so with any luck, I’ll post back again next Saturday to share my thoughts.

Thanks again everyone, and I hope this new gear does it for me!

:)

Awww... you mentioned the LAB. Easily my all-time favorite solid-state amps.

I currently own four of them, two of which are L5's. Not to brag, but I found this mint-condition beauty last year. Cost me a whopping 250€, what a freakin' STEAL.

 

[Orvillain]

My ex dealt with it for almost 15 years; I’d write “AxeFX” on every grocery list, it’d be the answer to every Jeopardy question, birthday gift idea lists, Christmas lists, I tried putting one on the wedding registry, I remember when I finally ordered it, “Does this mean you’re finally going to shut up about it, or is this going to make it worse?”

Genuinely, back in the day I would keep myself awake with constant racing thoughts about the Axe FX II. That's just how my brain works.

I'd get one, like it well enough but with a few dealbreakers, so I'd sell it.

A month later I'd be back in the same cycle.

I managed to get out of it until one day I looked at my bank account and miraculously, I had enough to buy an Axe FX III.

Same thing. Sleepless nights thinking about all the cool shit I could with it.

Got it. Sold it. Bought my turbo 5 weeks later.

Yes I'm crazy.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Here is a link to one of the most incredible tones I’ve ever heard, from the Axe FXII.

That tone is all about the FX. In case lush FX are what you're after, the Kemper likely won't be the best idea. It seems to have seen some serious updates in the FX department (I don't own one) but due to the sort of fixed routing and amount of FX blocks, you could run into limitations here.

 

[Eagle]

Also as you dial a Kemper it starts to sound weird if you move away from the profile by much.

 

[NKP]

knowing very well both products (owned 2 kemper and still have the axe 3)

As soon as I have the axe 3, the kemper was taking dust. I prefer the tone of the axe. Impossible to play back with the kemper. Everything is tighter in the axe, less fuzziness.
The kemper is a good product, the clean tones are great, gapless switching, profiling is entertaining. But if I have to choose I stay with the axe without hesitation.