A lot of people will disagree with my hardware modeler ranking

[the swede]

People still use headrush? And what’s st. Rock?

People still use Vox Tonelab with their 30 guitars to.

Helix is dated as is headrush who just buy up old tech and rebrand it

In Music created Headrush, they bought Avid 11, made them take an already in house Akai name, and made them update the Avid 11 engine though. Still Avid people involved I think. 11 rack is still used in studios because it’s worth having it around. Tonelab is pretty dated though. But if your 30 guitars sound good with it to you, good for you.

 

[TSJMajesty]

Didn't read the thread, because I feel the instant sense of Deja Vu and
how it just keeps me locked into The Matrix.



Can someone tell me if anyone said anything new in this thread? Please.

Uh, Tim said...., wait. Nevermind.

 

[norminal]

Can someone tell me if anyone said anything new in this thread? Please.

 

[timbuck3]

People still use Vox Tonelab with their 30 guitars to.

In Music created Headrush, they bought Avid 11, made them take an already in house Akai name, and made them update the Avid 11 engine though. Still Avid people involved I think. 11 rack is still used in studios because it’s worth having it around. Tonelab is pretty dated though. But if your 30 guitars sound good with it to you, good for you.

so i use old tech? bif fing deal..My point was if jon feel kemper is long in the tooth i think it can apply to helix as well 9 yrs later..

 

[the swede]

so i use old tech? bif fing deal..My point was if jon feel kemper is long in the tooth i think it can apply to helix as well 9 yrs later..

It’s cool, no biggie! I did say, if it sounds good to you, it’s all good. I have some pedals that are really old… plastic and falling apart and such.. but I like em

 

[contrario]

Some people think the newer models in Helix sound better and more accurate compared to the old ones modeled before 2022.

The current Helix Core modeling engine is from November 2022. It was further improved in November 2023. There will be further tweaks to the underlying engine this fall. Anyone implying Helix's engine is from 2015 hasn't been paying attention.

Can this verify what they think? If so, are you planning to remodel every amp and fx in your collection from scratch?

It's been discussed here for a while but I think nobody has asked this to you directly before. Learning something about it would be great.

 

[megametal7]

I use 60s technology... what do I know ???

 

[Foxmeister]

Well duh, but that doesn’t make the Kemper a modeler.

You know what does?

 

[OneEng]

Ok. First off, Kemper is certainly no different than QC at a fundamental level. Less flexible for sure, but basically built with the same nuts and bolts from an architecture standpoint.

Second, the video and its conclusions are meaningless because there isn't a context. "Better for what?".

QC stinks for live use. The buttons are simply too close together. Ergonomics alone keep it FAR out of the top 5 for live gigging (the efx are mediocre at best as well).

If you sit in a room and record, it may be OK (if you can live with such an expensive device that has just "ok" effects).

I am not offended. I simply think the review lacks any relevance.

FWIW, I have ONLY seen Kemper and Axe III fx on a touring stage. In fact, last week I saw Willow & Childish Gambini perform in Detroit. Willow's guitarist was using a Kemper Rack and foot controller..... and she is a touring guitar pro.... so there are still quite a few people "still using it". For live work, it is #1 in my book (for most bands) with Axe III Fx being #2 for most bands, and #1 for some depending on the band and how they are using the guitar in their songs.

The Line 6 Helix gets honorable mention simply because it has really great efx, is fairly flexible, ergonomically suitable for a live gig, and a very good value for all it can do.

Pretty much everything else in the list is either a TOY .... or a very expensive TOY, but still a toy for live purposes.

Just curious, what criteria was used for the ranking?

I do believe that there are situations and guitarists where the other devices are a good fit. For someone that only fiddles in their basement, or someone that records, the live aspects of the devices are not important at all. For someone who really loves to fiddle with the setup of a digital amp (I like this term better than "modeler", "Profiler", or "Tone Capture") even a small Fractal is silly powerful and sounds very good... and has the most powerful editor I have ever seen.

For someone that simply doesn't have the $$$ for a Fractal, Line 6 has some crazy good pedals that do a ton for a great value.

Then there is size to consider. For touring (or for me, even weekend warrior work), only a full size pedal board is acceptable. For a throw-and-go rig, a 3 button device is perfect.

You really have to specify what you are attempting to do before you say "these are the BEST" .... don't you think?

 

[timbuck3]

Where is bluamp1?

 

[timbuck3]

Or g&l black spirit? In this list..

 

[norminal]

Where is bluamp1?

 

[GuitarJon]

Where is bluamp1?

Or g&l black spirit? In this list..

Those are analog Amplifiers, not digital guitar amp modelers / multi effect units.

 

[Foxmeister]

For someone that simply doesn't have the $$$ for a Fractal, Line 6 has some crazy good pedals that do a ton for a great value.

It isn't always about the money!

I could easily afford to buy multiple AxeFX3s if I wanted to, but I don't want a rack unit.

I had an FM3 but ended up moving back to my Helix, because I preferred the workflow.

I also bought an FM9 Turbo, because that was the unit I really wanted when I got my FM3, but again sold it and went back to my Helix.

More recently, I sold my Helix because between my HX Stomp and HX Stomp XL I can do everything that I need to do.

I do expect to dip my toe back in Fractal-land at some point, but I'd imagine that I'd be looking at something next-gen.

 

[AFKAEjay(retired)]

QC stinks for live use. The buttons are simply too close together. Ergonomics alone keep it FAR out of the top 5 for live gigging (the efx are mediocre at best as well).

I got the QC specifically for live use, specifically for its formfactor….and many with me…(and I’m a 6’6 dude)
It didn’t even occurred to me the switches where close together untill I read it here…..after some gigs without missteps.
Maybe if you do arena gigs where you need to jump from trampolines on the the right switch you should consider something wider….all the others are just fine when you leave the cowboy boots at home.

 

[[Nathan]]

QC stinks for live use. The buttons are simply too close together.

I have no dog in this fight but just like you said context is everything. I know more touring metal bands that are using QC’s these days over anything else. Some are running them on the floor individually, some are being used for multi instrument and in a rack somewhere, and some are tempo synched with live patch switching. Bands even have duplicates for redundancy (up to 6 qc’s in a rack depending on the setup).

I agree with a lot of what you said but the reality is that a lot are being used live.

 

[AFKAEjay(retired)]

I have no dog in this fight but just like you said context is everything. I know more touring metal bands that are using QC’s these days over anything else. Some are running them on the floor individually, some are being used for multi instrument and in a rack somewhere, and some are tempo synched with live patch switching. Bands even have duplicates for redundancy (up to 6 qc’s in a rack depending on the setup).

I agree with a lot of what you said but the reality is that a lot are being used live.

The reason the QC has a large group of metal players as users:…those guys wear sneakers…all the country dudes wear boots. Jazz players wear sandals, also no issue there.

 

[Piing]

Second, the video and its conclusions are meaningless because there isn't a context. "Better for what?".

Exactly. There is no context. Better for what?

Looking only at the quality, accuracy, features, and tweakability of the amp modeler itself, the conclusion is easy: currently Fractal is unrivaled. And the same could be said for most of the effects.

Need other features? Budget? Dimensions? Weight? Don't like the Fractal UI or workflow? Got a fever? Need cowbell? Look at other solutions.

 

[AFKAEjay(retired)]

Exactly. There is no context. Better for what?

Looking only at the quality, accuracy, features, and tweakability of the amp modeler itself, the conclusion is easy: currently Fractal is unrivaled. And the same could be said for most of the effects.

Need other features? Don't like the Fractal UI or workflow? Got a fever? Need cowbell? Look at other solutions.

Price, size and capturing capabilities are also dimensions where fractal doesn’t win the race imo.
Good amp sounds is no longer the territory of 2 brands….it almost has become a commodity.
Depending on the user (context), more features / tweakability / accuracy may no longer add value.

When I did my last purchase…the amount of switches and IO cranked into a small device, and capture capabilities where the main axes of the decision.

Iow…there is no “best for everyone” device on the market yet.

 

[the swede]

The reason the QC has a large group of metal players as users:…those guys wear sneakers…all the country dudes wear boots. Jazz players wear sandals, also no issue there.

Howaboudus post-rock hipsters that play barefoot
Nothing works for us…. Except knobs… knobs knobs knobs. And sliders. Switches are yucky… we don’t like touching them at all.