What's preventing you from getting a Helix Stadium (if you really want to buy it eventually)?

[timbuck3]

Nope, I am not kidding. I absolutely love it. Plus, it helps that I know Ali Larter personally.

Like her character would ever be with stinky out of shape chain smoker like Tommy… lol. And the daughter in real life is like 30

 

[BenIfin]

the whataboutism is dumb. People keep bringing up axe II to axe III as some reasonable point of comparison. As if nobody remembers just how shit the axe Fx II screen and user interface were. Truly shit, hot garbage. We won’t even talk about the Ax8. The vast majority of hardcore Fractal users had reason to upgrade JUST for the screen improvement.

Helix is already super great in terms of hardware and UI and functionality. It’s not that surprising there are more folks looking at the new gen there and saying “actually, I’m okay on the OG”.

The Axe IV will likely be near or at $3k. There is no way they can improve the UI to the point that the bulk of threads on it don’t immediately turn into “three grand and it’s still like programming a VCR from 1987?!?!?”

And at that price point it’s going to be a special subset of fractal fanbois that are willing AND able to make the upgrade immediately.

It was a joke / attempt at light hearted humor ... period

 

[BenIfin]

It’s a forum it really ain’t that serious.

Off you go then. Shut the door on your way out.

Yep. No need for you to stick around.

Ditto

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

totally fair views ... Don't take it too seriously

In fairness and less serious than lords n' ladies...have we seen you around on forums before?

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

It was a joke / attempt at light hearted humor ... period

Sorry - I thought red was your "guuuuuuuys, I'm super super serious now!" color.

 

[OneEng]

Only if reverb and delay are the things that matter most to you, in which case...I'd wonder why you'd consider buying any flagship multi-effects unit when Fractal and Line 6 will happily just sell you hardware for their effects.

They aren't the things that matter a lot to me (and certainly lots of others). Good gig workflow and good amp tone are also very important.

If Line 6 want a spot at the top of the food chain, they will inevitably be compared to others at the top. It just makes sense.

Before anyone gets their panties all in a bunch (God forbid anyone should say that the new Stadium is anything less than the 2nd coming!), Stadium is quite good, and best-in-class in many things. It's still fair to compare it today to other things that exist today in the state that Stadium exists today. It's also OK to point out that it is just an infant and it will grow over time; however, that doesn't make comparisons of how it is NOW incorrect.

I think in this day and age 20, 2627 people are just tightening their pocketbooks in general
I see a lot less frivolous spending at least from people around me
But then again, some people around me I spend money like it’s going out of style

I think there is lots of truth in this. I keep hearing about how great everything is, but lots of people aint feelin it. There are lots of people thinking of battening down the hatches and settling in for a long hard haul.

Kinda makes a 2K guitar processor seem kind of out there for lots of people (most?).

 

[BenIfin]

Sorry - I thought red was your "guuuuuuuys, I'm super super serious now!" color.

No need to apologize :)

I'm the color / bolding / italicizing / re-sizing / underlining / all at the same time etc.... "king" around here.

I want to stop but I just **cant**

 

[mikah912]

They aren't the things that matter a lot to me (and certainly lots of others). Good gig workflow and good amp tone are also very important.

If Line 6 want a spot at the top of the food chain, they will inevitably be compared to others at the top. It just makes sense.

Before anyone gets their panties all in a bunch (God forbid anyone should say that the new Stadium is anything less than the 2nd coming!), Stadium is quite good, and best-in-class in many things. It's still fair to compare it today to other things that exist today in the state that Stadium exists today. It's also OK to point out that it is just an infant and it will grow over time; however, that doesn't make comparisons of how it is NOW incorrect.

Brother, if someone saying anything less than complimentary about Line 6 or Stadium raised my blood pressure even an iota, this forum would've sent me into the great big Stadium in the sky a long time ago.

And to be clear, I 9 million percent agree that Kemper's reverbs and delays were incredible when I owned it and also way more varied than even the current lineup of such in Stadium.

It's just.....that's about the only thing I miss about it. And so yeah, I consider Stadium to be a considerable step up in pretty much every other aspect than reverbs and delays. But it's still a great piece of kit, and I could gig one if I had to, no problem.

 

[ejecta]

I have an LT and it’s a solid product, but when you plug into a QC or an FM9 you notice a huge difference.

Not at all my experience. I’ve had these units side by side at various times and I find no “huge”differences at all in them sound wise. Some things I preferred over other but a “huge” difference… nope.

Curious, have you actually used one? I don’t own one, but have spent several hours with it. I wouldn’t remotely consider it “half-baked”.

I think he was half baked when he wrote the post.

 

[PorcinePicker]

"What's preventing you from getting a Helix Stadium (if you really want to buy it eventually)"

<sigh> Didn't see anything about praising or bashing Fractal stuff in this call to arms. That's all been jawed over and gaslit to death


Stadium is its own thing. For now, nothing else out there promises anything like Showcase. Nothing delivers Showcase either, but I'll keep watching this space. I can imagine getting sucked in if we ever "witness the firepower of this fully operational Death Star". (Still wish they'd done away with the Legacy concept though!)

 

[Melodioso]

Coming back on topic, the question for me is :"What's preventing you from selling your Helix Stadium?"

Short answer: I’m giving the Stadium a fair chance, and I’m waiting for a few key things:

1. Agoura preamp models (still missing)
2. Better effects, especially reverbs and compression (to my ears, Fractal still sounds clearly better)
3. Stadium Native, ideally with a hardware-owner discount

Since getting the AM4, my Stadium has mostly been collecting dust. This isn’t a knock on Line 6, and I’m not claiming they can’t compete with Fractal. I genuinely don’t care about brands. I’m not being paid to be anyone’s ambassador. I’m simply enjoying the AM4 tone far more than the Stadium through a tube power amp + cab.

The AM4 is also easy to use—about as straightforward as the Stadium. Sure, it could benefit from a touchscreen and a few quality-of-life features (like copying scenes or blocks directly on the unit without the editor). But the basics are handled better in some ways: a CPU meter and an always-visible tuner are actually useful—unlike a clock (thanks, but I already have a watch).

At this point, my decision is basically damage control. If Line 6 improves the Stadium—better FX, Agoura preamps, and solid reliability then I might keep it long enough to pick up a discounted Stadium Native. If not, I’ll likely sell it (probably at a loss).

A few things also rub me the wrong way: I have zero use for Showcase, I think the touchscreen takes up too much real estate (making the unit unnecessarily huge), and I absolutely hate the Wi-Fi-required connection to use the editor (honestly, one of the worst ideas they’ve had). DSP headroom is another concern—not right now, but if Line 6 brings in more resource-heavy Agoura tech across the board, it could become a real limitation.

Finally, it’s hard to ignore the pricing. Line 6 had some nerve launching a new “flagship” at $2,200 where, at release, the only headline difference felt like “16 new Agoura amp models.” That’s obviously an oversimplification, but it’s genuinely how the value proposition has landed for me in real-world use, as I came back to using my favorites OG Mark IV and Badonk models for heavy tones.

 

[Foxmeister]

Personally, I think if Line 6 nail Proxy by the end of March, a lot of the Stadium criticisms melt away.

Yes, we need more Agoura amps, and some updated FX would not go amiss, but if Proxy comes and is as good as the competition, the massive "hole" between the Agoura and HX amps (many of which are still great models) is going to be filled really quickly.

 

[ian_dissonance]

(Still wish they'd done away with the Legacy concept though!)

why do people keep saying this? More is more.

 

[mbenigni]

On hot tubs and the shittiness of Landman, we agree.

Hotubs and Land Man.

 

[mbenigni]

To clarify, these are just some of the areas of significant improvement from Helix where it was NOT "already really good" to Stadium:

• Factory presets. Now all with scenes, descriptions and plenty of supporting info.
• Clips. Now you know exactly what a factory preset is supposed to sound like.
• Focus View. Helps demystify their large catalog of content as well as showing how useful forgotten legacy content is. Also gives you starting points with amps in any setting.
• Allows for 50 percent more blocks on any given line, and also allows multiple parallels/merges for greatly increased flexibility.
• Combines amp channels for most amps into a single block to save on efficiency in a single preset and signal chain real estate.

Exactly like Axe-FX II -> III. Tons of usability improvements in the beginning, and a handful of content changes to start with.

 

[mbenigni]

Meh, of course you can granulated it down to “the Helix didn’t have this so it’s an improvement on a weakness”.

Anyone that cares what the presets sound like on - $2k modeler probably thinks Landman is great television.

Agree to disagree? Or disagree to disagree? I think this is a little reductive.

The things Mikah is describing may not be "crucial" (what is?) and they may not be of any interest for "serious" players (pros/ semi-pros?), but they certainly add value. Anything that makes a device with this much content "self-documenting" (e.g. "I've never used this amp before, what can the Stadium itself tell me about it before I go running off to Google and break my stride?") is cool. (And fun! Let's not kid ourselves: regardless of price point, the vast majority of buyers, including myself, are buying because these things are fun.)

I miss my old Line 6 Pilot's Guides, and I'm very intrigued by Focus View, etc.

 

[mbenigni]

Trying to compare any of those improvements to the improvement of a literal dogshit green screen to a big color screen is never going to do anything but prove the point that whataboutism is dumb.

The better analogy here would be Stadium's inclusion of a large touchscreen. It lays the foundation for so many other improvements that can be made in firmware/software.

 

[mbenigni]

tension breaker. had to be done. (found this while I was looking for a banana stand gif) I kind of like it. It's been up on a dedicated window for hours.

What the hell is a "banana stand gif"?

You know what, never mind.

 

[mbenigni]

Sorry - I thought red was your "guuuuuuuys, I'm super super serious now!" color.

Chinese New Year was just a couple of days ago. Wearing a little red is traditional.

 

[PorcinePicker]

why do people keep saying this? More is more.

Can't speak for "people", but I'm saying it because there's no rationale for having different quality levels inside a brand new flagship product. If something makes the cut as being worthy of inclusion, don't put a label on it implying "this is crappy". If you want a lighter CPU version of it, put a switch for that on the model/effect itself.