UA Lion '68

JiveTurkey said:
That Tone-X turd was the second and last "amp in a box with something doing everything else" experiment I'm engaging in.
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Daniel Cormier Sport GIF by UFC
 
FuzzyAce said:
I'm getting to the point with a lot of new stuff -- "Does it sound as good as Helix or Fractal?" and many times the answer is coming up "No".
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Yeah. And you know... a little rant here: a few comments on the video and other comparisons like the Helix one at the end talk about "well I can get a good sound immediately with the UA stuff, but with the Helix I have to play around with settings a lot", and I don't get that. I'm pretty new to Helix, but outside of my fiddling with the AC30 model—which had more to do with me just not knowing how to get the AC30 sounds I wanted from an AC30, since I had no experience with Vox amps—I haven't really run into this? Especially not for any of the more mainstream amps on there.

Like if someone doesn't want to do the cab stuff, which I find to be the most fiddly part, then just use the default settings for each cab (which are generally good!) or throw an IR mix on, both of which mimic the experience you get with the UA pedals anyway.

For the amp settings themselves, I expected I'd have to be going between all these settings, making little adjustments, to get a single good sound, since that's how everyone always talked, but I basically just... set it up like any other amp? I barely even bother with the extra controls outside of sag (and I never have to change sag to get a good sound).

I get if someone doesn't want to fuss with the modeler interface and just wants physical knobs (I get it because that appeals to me too), but I don't understand this idea that Helix / Fractal / etc sounds good only if you spend hours tweaking it. It hasn't been my experience at all. I just set it up like any other amp.
 
FuzzyAce said:
I'm getting to the point with a lot of new stuff -- "Does it sound as good as Helix or Fractal?" and many times the answer is coming up "No".
Click to expand...

I've been at the point for a while too.

But even if a product does sound as good, the Helix and Fractal devices are full "studios in a box" with all the effects and everything else that you could possibly need. So even then, it's a hard sell to me.

Too little too late UA.
 
synthpenguin said:
Yeah. And you know... a little rant here: a few comments on the video and other comparisons like the Helix one at the end talk about "well I can get a good sound immediately with the UA stuff, but with the Helix I have to play around with settings a lot", and I don't get that. I'm pretty new to Helix, but outside of my fiddling with the AC30 model—which had more to do with me just not knowing how to get the AC30 sounds I wanted from an AC30, since I had no experience with Vox amps—I haven't really run into this? Especially not for any of the more mainstream amps on there.

Like if someone doesn't want to do the cab stuff, which I find to be the most fiddly part, then just use the default settings for each cab (which are generally good!) or throw an IR mix on, both of which mimic the experience you get with the UA pedals anyway.

For the amp settings themselves, I expected I'd have to be going between all these settings, making little adjustments, to get a single good sound, since that's how everyone always talked, but I basically just... set it up like any other amp? I barely even bother with the extra controls outside of sag (and I never have to change sag to get a good sound).

I get if someone doesn't want to fuss with the modeler interface and just wants physical knobs (I get it because that appeals to me too), but I don't understand this idea that Helix / Fractal / etc sounds good only if you spend hours tweaking it. It hasn't been my experience at all. I just set it up like any other amp.
Click to expand...
Yep. Anything gear related will take a bit of time to get to know the ends and outs, what it's capable of and how it suits your needs best. I haven't found the Helix hard at all to get good tones though. I think the challenge is in creating a workflow and building a nest of tones/presets that's going to aid you in recording or live use. There is so much there that it could be daunting for the player that just wants to plug and play, turn a few dials and go. I get that. The UA stuff seems good, and they seem to have a loyal base of customers. I just think these style boxes that are catered towards one style of amp would be ideal if they were tube-based, like the Friedman IR-X as an example.
 
jellodog said:
I've been at the point for a while too.

But even if a product does sound as good, the Helix and Fractal devices are full "studios in a box" with all the effects and everything else that you could possibly need. So even then, it's a hard sell to me.

Too little too late UA.
Click to expand...
Exactly. If you're going to do an amp in a box / IR thing like the UA you should make it tube-based. Just my opinion.
 
synthpenguin said:
Yeah. And you know... a little rant here: a few comments on the video and other comparisons like the Helix one at the end talk about "well I can get a good sound immediately with the UA stuff, but with the Helix I have to play around with settings a lot", and I don't get that. I'm pretty new to Helix, but outside of my fiddling with the AC30 model—which had more to do with me just not knowing how to get the AC30 sounds I wanted from an AC30, since I had no experience with Vox amps—I haven't really run into this? Especially not for any of the more mainstream amps on there.

Like if someone doesn't want to do the cab stuff, which I find to be the most fiddly part, then just use the default settings for each cab (which are generally good!) or throw an IR mix on, both of which mimic the experience you get with the UA pedals anyway.

For the amp settings themselves, I expected I'd have to be going between all these settings, making little adjustments, to get a single good sound, since that's how everyone always talked, but I basically just... set it up like any other amp? I barely even bother with the extra controls outside of sag (and I never have to change sag to get a good sound).

I get if someone doesn't want to fuss with the modeler interface and just wants physical knobs (I get it because that appeals to me too), but I don't understand this idea that Helix / Fractal / etc sounds good only if you spend hours tweaking it. It hasn't been my experience at all. I just set it up like any other amp.
Click to expand...
Most people want instant gratification and that's all it's about. They want to be impressed the moment they play the first note and don't want to do any programming to get their tone. That's much easier to achieve when options are few and fixed - people end up in a mindset that this is just the way the piece of gear sounds and work around it. With a Helix or Fractal it's probably easier to get into the mindset that since you have all these options, you need to use them and find that ultimate tone.

I tried the new Helix 3.7 amps yesterday (Aristocrat with 4x12 Greenback 25/30 was my favorite!) and it certainly didn't take me much effort to get them to sound good, but I wasn't blown away with the default settings or the default cab choices for some of them. With Fractal defaulting its amp models to everything at noon, and cab sim set to a 1x8 Champ, that's unlikely to yield good results out of the box. Obviously factory presets are another matter.

With the UA Lion, I was actually disappointed that it didn't sound better to me out of the box, after seeing the hype and hearing good results in demos. It felt like "more of the same" rather than some "ooh so much better" some people are saying online. I had tried the Dream before and that sounded good but I didn't find any magic in it either.
 
riffy said:
I sent mine back. I should have known. But, I tried it anyway. It does sound pretty good. Not as good as my Kemper Marshalls though.
Not even as good as my GE250 Captured Marshalls.

The app would not stay connected via bluetooth either. Such a great idea, but poorly executed by UA, which seems the norm
from what everyone says about their pedals.
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You and I seem to really have similar tastes and sensibilities so this cools my interest. I think I’ll just stick to loading down my amps or continue the capture device tryouts.
 
ejecta said:
Specifically what made the Tone X a turd for you… more so the UI or tone or combo of both?
Click to expand...
The UI sucked. Dead simple yet somehow still convoluted and CLUNKY. The second tip of the turd was the inability to get more than one good capture for 20 failed or subpar captures for no rhyme or reason. If it sucks to use, needs outboard gear to complete and the main selling point worked like 5% of the time for me? It's going back. As we both know; too much great gear in the world to spend more time with something that doesn't do the trick for us.
 
JiveTurkey said:
The UI sucked. Dead simple yet somehow still convoluted and CLUNKY. The second tip of the turd was the inability to get more than one good capture for 20 failed or subpar captures for no rhyme or reason. If it sucks to use, needs outboard gear to complete and the main selling point worked like 5% of the time for me? It's going back. As we both know; too much great gear in the world to spend more time with something that doesn't do the trick for us.
Click to expand...
Was the outboard gear supposed to help with the consistency of capturing or does that not make a difference in your experience?
 
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