They have no retail presence and in some parts of the world flat out no distribution.
It’s also kind of the modeller for nerds and enthusiasts. A lot of guitarists find it intimidating compared to everything else. Cliff also does what Cliff wants and doesn’t answer to anyone. Firmwares are massively abundant compared to anyone else ever. All of that makes them pretty unique.
I guess the closest thing to this setup is kemper, but they have retail a presence and you don’t need to be a nerd to sit there and audition a bunch of profiles and move on, it’s a different user mindset.
I believe that Fractal does have distribution and retailers in the EU, but in the US, only on-line sales. Still, Fractal and Kemper pale beside the likes of Yamaha. Still, your point is valid. Fractal is the weakest of the 3 in sales infrastructure.
As an engineer, your math skills should be at least a tad better.
Fair statement
.
RE: the new firmware.
Kemper Amps
web.archive.org
At least by May 28th, they were referring to it as the most precise amp recreation ever achieved. Not even "the most precise we've ever achieved" but literally taken as read,
ever achieved.
Then by July it was changed:
Kemper Amps
web.archive.org
The only thing I can take from this is, Kempers engineers and marketing team aren't in sync with one another.
This is the most obvious evidence so far that we shouldn't expect Kemper to be more accurate than NAM IMO. If Kemper had the goods on accuracy, they would flat out state it.
Now, I can say that within my own product development, even when the product was genuinely "the best" in some aspect, marketing, sales, and lawyers have cautioned me into using less aggressive language.
Seeing how CK operates and from seeing a few interviews with him, he doesn't strike me as the kind of guy that holds back though.
Accuracy vs precision is taught in high-school science classes no?
In the context of an amp capture and model system:
- Precise but not accurate => You always get the same capture all the time but it's not close to the real amp being captured (not accurate).
- Accurate but not precise => A capture may some times nail the real amp being captured (accurate) but doesn't do it consistently over multiple captures. The process doesn't give you a similar result every time, it's inconsistent.
- Accurate and Precise => Every capture consistently nails the real amp.
Great point! Still, they backed off of "Accurate" as well.
Betrayed is a little strong; as mentioned, I’ve had fantastic value from my Mk1. I just think they needed to be more careful with their messaging here. They have been inferring the new method is better - I know the language has changed (precise vs powerful) on the website but they’ve made a thing of saying the mk1 units don’t have the legs to use the new method whereas player and mk2 do. It’s not a case of jumping ship as such….. my choices are ‘stay with Mk1’ or ‘do something else’. I don’t think mk2 is a choice for me as, if a sound quality improvement is all there is, then that’s not enough when their previous stance has been ‘it’s already there’. At the time Mk1 launched I think the choice if you wanted top-notch digital core sounds was Kemper or Fractal. Fractal was harder to buy, more expensive, had a reputation on the Kemper forum for switching hardware all the time (maybe undeserved but that’s a perception played upon). They haven’t realised that’s not the only competitor capable of excellent core sounds these days.
Fractal is still harder to buy and more expensive .... but they have seemed to become more stable with respect to hardware. Kemper still holds the crown in my book for the "most stable tone" though as Fractal (and any modeler really) changes existing tones from firmware to firmware. Kemper SHOULD be touting this as a selling point, but are hanging their hat on profiling accuracy .... even if indirectly.
While I'm not in anyone's mind specifically, I think just as there is radical pro Kemper mindset, where everything else is a turd, the opposite can also form as reactionary anti-kemper sentiment.
I feel bad for some of the attacks on you on this thread. I think people need a reminder this is an online forum and that there's a lot we don't know about each other.
Thanks for the kind words.
I enjoy debate in general and discussion. It is unfortunate that personal attacks are allowed on this site (they are nearly universally not allowed on forums in general). You are correct, there is a great deal we don't know about each other, and basic common curtesy should be something we all practice (including me) in our discussions.
I think accuracy is a spectrum for all current tech. Even NAM is not perfect if the barometer is NULL testing. Kemper isn't on the level of NAM, obviously, but it's certainly accurate enough to where it confuses many people in blind tests.
I made this test myself 7, 8 years ago. Kemper felt somewhat different to the source, if I remember right, but it's tough for me to tell the sound difference. And this is also a good tone for my taste.
When I bought my Kemper in 2013, it wasn't in the hope of having better tone than my VHT UL or Fender BF. It was that I just couldn't keep lugging my tube amp rig around any more (or my folded horn subs for the PA).
It came as quite a surprise to me when the tone of the Kemper was just as good, or better in many respects to my old rigs and pedal boards.... but really, it was the setup and teardown I was after.... and that is still amazing.
The problem with the new one is DSP is the same so there’s nothing but software in the mk 2 that’s going to be different. That can still be good but it doesn’t say much about future proofing the unit. It also is starting from o 15year old base. I know sounds good is good but why buy a new hardware that is essentially the same. I know the high gain people have issues with it but the original is a proven product that has toured the world over for over a decade so we will have to see. Also it’s not expensive.
It really is super cheap right now to buy a used MK1. Even new, Kemper is much less expensive than Fractal. It's certainly the value champion in my book at this time. It will be interesting to see how the Stadium prices go after a year or two on the market though. I am guessing that Yamaha will sell the crap out of those units.
The "new profiling technology" would be the main selling point.
Thing is, these require an external computer for the profiling process, and MKIIs run the
exact same DSP hardware as the OG Kempers. All in all, this almost assuredly means new profiles are but a software improvement they're tying to the MKII to boost sales.
I'd normally tread more carefully around such assumptions, but Kemper already has an unfortunate track record, with the introduction of tiered updates for the Profiler Player
I agree. Considering cash flow potential, I still see an MK1 upgrade coming .... but not for free. I agree with you. Now, there is also a possibility that Kemper will use the new profiling (and fixed efx blocks) to push new MK2 sales alone. If this is the case, then it is likely a new Stadium might be in my future in a few years
.
Still, my MK1 has paid for itself many times over since 2013. At a bare minimum, it got me out of buying a new tube amp, cab, or new efx pedals every few months!
. Inaudible artifacts that lead to null test discrepancies in an amp sim test, like phase differences or ultrasonic frequencies are quite rare for amp sims.
