IDEA: Helix Lunchbox Amp Head

Digital Igloo said:
Given the current prices of Helix/HX boxes, what would people be willing to pay for such a beast? We looked at a comprehensive Helix-in-a-combo and Helix-in-a-head years ago and felt it'd be too expensive to do right. But public perception may have changed by now.
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It would be awesome if there are tiers like HX Stomp and Full Helix versions of this. I would more than happily take a Lunchbox version with lesser power and HX Stomp-esque DSP limitations for 1100-1500 CAD. This is a very uneducated guesstimate.
 
Digital Igloo said:
Given the current prices of Helix/HX boxes, what would people be willing to pay for such a beast? We looked at a comprehensive Helix-in-a-combo and Helix-in-a-head years ago and felt it'd be too expensive to do right. But public perception may have changed by now.
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I do remember your thoughts on this from a few years at The Other Place™ when we were asking for Helix in a powered head (or combo) and that you thought it would be too expensive to attract enough buyers to make it worthwhile.

Since that time, the price of tube amps (Marshall, Mesa Boogie, Friedman, Fender... whatever) has become excessively expensive. And those amps only have a handful of voices and no effects, for the most part.

I'm not sure on a $ figure off the top of my head, but I can say this:

Given the frankly ridiculous amount of money I've spent over years on boutique amps, some handwired (as well as regular amps e.g. Deluxe, Princeton), I'd say I'd be willing to pay "a decent amount more" for a powered solution with everything in the box than you might guess my price ceiling would be. If that makes sense?

Especially given what I recently paid for an Axe-Fx III and Foot controller, after selling off most of my analog gear and FM9.

I know this has to make sense for L6 in terms of selling a lot of units, but there are plenty of people on forums like these that seem like they would be more than willing to give something like this a try, even if it is considered moderately expensive (Tim excluded ofc).

Most of us have been on the exhausting merry-go-round for so long, looking for the perfect solution that if it was put in front of us, we'd probably charge at it full speed.
 
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eggpl@nt said:
I know you’re joking, but counterpoint: the Rack is $1600 to Floor’s $1700. Removing the stuff that makes Floor, Floor doesn’t seem to save (the consumer) much. That’s why I’d expect this hypothetical thing to start at the $1600 price point, then of course there are costs added for the amplifier and whatever else L6 would choose to add to make the Helix Cranium the amp head we all crave.
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I'd say the HX Stomp is the template here as you don't need all the Floor/Rack can do, mostly you'd be running in mono etc. But adding more onboard control to it, a poweramp and expecting it to be a bit less popular than the current devices, it would probably be 1200 euros at minimum for the head.

IMO a tube power section is not at all necessarily, but it needs to be a good solid-state poweramp with plenty of power on tap. That'll probably cost a good bit.

Right now there isn't all that much to choose from between the complex multifx and the simple pedal style amp sims. You have to cobble together a solution yourself where it's either the menu and navigation hell on Fractal/Helix or it's too simple for some.

IMO the Yamaha THR100HD had a lot of really great ideas for exactly this sort of things. The blendable channels, stereo poweramp were all cool things. Where it failed was the built in reverb wasn't great, the poweramp was a bit underpowered, it had a lot of quirks and the boost desperately needed a volume control. Take that, make a version two with Line6 Helix modeling.

4F65014FF9E14C298658B6DD7A2254C7_12073_4096x1506_6dfe518c4dab1abae35d28d0f3329126.jpg


Funnily enough, I'm basically describing a Line6 Duoverb here.

duoverb_on_white_v01-928aded84715372752ce11e78d6153e5.jpg
 
paisleywookiee said:
I respectfully disagree. BluGuitar Amp1 series has shown you can get amazing tone in a far smaller size, minimal tubes.
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Achilles said:
They certainly don't need to be.
There's no way a 100 watt SS amp should be as large or heavy as its tube counterpart
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Please don't recommend Class D. Please!!! We've got one chance to get the $1150 Helix Amp we deserve. Let's do it right!
 
laxu said:
I'd say the HX Stomp is the template here as you don't need all the Floor/Rack can do, mostly you'd be running in mono etc. But adding more onboard control to it, a poweramp and expecting it to be a bit less popular than the current devices, it would probably be 1200 euros at minimum for the head.

IMO a tube power section is not at all necessarily, but it needs to be a good solid-state poweramp with plenty of power on tap. That'll probably cost a good bit.

Right now there isn't all that much to choose from between the complex multifx and the simple pedal style amp sims. You have to cobble together a solution yourself where it's either the menu and navigation hell on Fractal/Helix or it's too simple for some.

IMO the Yamaha THR100HD had a lot of really great ideas for exactly this sort of things. The blendable channels, stereo poweramp were all cool things. Where it failed was the built in reverb wasn't great, the poweramp was a bit underpowered, it had a lot of quirks and the boost desperately needed a volume control. Take that, make a version two with Line6 Helix modeling.

4F65014FF9E14C298658B6DD7A2254C7_12073_4096x1506_6dfe518c4dab1abae35d28d0f3329126.jpg


Funnily enough, I'm basically describing a Line6 Duoverb here.

duoverb_on_white_v01-928aded84715372752ce11e78d6153e5.jpg
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Fair point. I figured “all the power of Helix” would be the preferred spec, but I didn’t consider “all the mono power of Helix.”
 
SKU said:
Please don't recommend Class D. Please!!! We've got one chance to get the $1150 Helix Amp we deserve. Let's do it right!
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Don't know how many times I've said this on forums, but I'll say it again:

Not all Class D amps are the same.

Many of us have been burned by crappy Class D amps, and there's a lot of those out there. But there are very good ones out there too. It's important that they are way over spec'd in terms of available clean power so that there is little chance of the amplified signal having an unacceptable level of THD, especially in the upper frequencies, which you can get with switch mode power supplies.

Loving my FR-12 right now. The power amp is Class D.
 
JiveTurkey said:
Here's the conundrum. I don't want some Pedalbaby/Katana class a/b power amp turd coloring up modeling that should stand on it's own.
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If my Internet searching skills are still in shape then Class AB and Class A ( tube or SS ) offer most of the times ( i.e. every time, in this context ) more fidelity so we're good.
 
JiveTurkey said:
Here's the conundrum. I don't want some Pedalbaby/Katana class a/b power amp turd coloring up modeling that should stand on it's own.
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Exactly. And class AB gets really damn heavy really fast as you go up the power rating scale and require more iron to the point where they're unfeasable.
 
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