IDEA: Helix Lunchbox Amp Head

The Catalyst, I bet, implements similar stuff to the Helix. It would make no sense for them to re-write an entire architecture for a cheap amp. I'd bet it's not the old Pod stuff either although that sounds quite good with the DT50.
It only makes sense that they finally decided to go with a tube power stage in this upcoming Helix Amp, similarly to DT50 but with full blown Helix tech.
 
SKU said:
The Catalyst, I bet, implements similar stuff as the Helix. It would make no sense for them to re-write an entire architecture for a cheap amp. I'd bet it's not the old Pod stuff either although that sounds quite good with the DT50.
It only makes sense that they finally decided to go with a tube power stage in this upcoming Helix Amp, similarly to DT50 but with full blown Helix tech.
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So what happens if you select an amp model that uses el34s irl? Or el84s?
 
JiveTurkey said:
So what happens if you select an amp model that uses el34s irl? Or el84s?
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I'd imagine the power stage would be designed to be linear so it wouldn't matter much. The Fryette PowerStation works the same with any amp.
It would only impart that tube thuddy goodness rather than colour the actual sound too much.
 
The simplest solution here would be a stereo-powered Helix rack. All the benefits of the existing UI and existing form factor. Stereo outputs to keep the stereo field, and you can plug it into whatever you want. FR-FR cab, 112, 212, 412. You can mount it in a rack, or you can put it in a Tolex box and have it match your cab. Whatever you like.
 
CakeEater said:
The simplest solution here would be a stereo-powered Helix rack. All the benefits of the existing UI and existing form factor. Stereo outputs to keep the stereo field, and you can plug it into whatever you want. FR-FR cab, 112, 212, 412. You can mount it in a rack, or you can put it in a Tolex box and have it match your cab. Whatever you like.
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but...
hx_amp.jpg
 
So you guys would shell out $2500 for a Badlander but want the Helix Amp to be less than half of that? I think a Helix amp should be at least $2000 and sound like it.
Any serious cost cutting will just be a beefed up Catalyst.
 
ragingplatypi said:
So you guys would shell out $2500 for a Badlander but want the Helix Amp to be less than half of that? I think a Helix amp should be at least $2000 and sound like it.
Any serious cost cutting will just be a beefed up Catalyst.
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Agreed! That's pretty much the point I was trying to make without committing to a dollar value. You've worded it more succinctly than me though!

This things needs to be a quality item, otherwise don't bother.
 
paisleywookiee said:
Personally, I’m not saying that’s what I’d want. I’m saying that’s what’s most likely to happen. There’s no market for a $2000 modeling amp.
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When you say there’s no market do you mean no supply or no demand?

As far as supply, the powered Kemper is the only thing close to this that exists.

As far as demand, the market would conceivably be the same as the market for other $2000+ amps. Which is to say, a small market.

But I’d imagine any amp maker who is just motivated by money probably quits and winds up building toasters or submarines.
 
ragingplatypi said:
When you say there’s no market do you mean no supply or no demand?
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I agree with @paisleywookiee, the demand is likely not there.

People who buy amps tend to put anything that has even the whiff of solid-state into a "it should cost less" category. While there is a group of people who are willing to buy e.g an Axe-Fx 3 and a rack poweramp, who would probably like an Axe-Fx 3 with a built in poweramp, but that group is unlikely big enough to support that sort of product.

I'd say the Kemper has been a bit special because it's been more like a "turn your amp collection into a single amp" type thing with its profiling capabilities.

For example past modeling amps from Line6 have failed because they had the stigma of the POD amp modeling not being quite there. I think Helix amp modeling is more accepted now and to me the main blunder on the budget range Line6 Catalyst amps are how they handle effects compared to their direct competitors.

The budget range -> high end digital amp also gets weird because the "betterness" is not immediately apparent on the surface level. "The Catalyst costs 300 euros, why does this higher end model cost 1200 euros?"

Meanwhile that conversation isn't usually done on e.g production vs boutique amps from the same country. The assumption is more like "Victory costs more than Marshall because V is a smaller company than M and V is built to a higher standard."
 
Catalyst with Helix software would probably increase the cost in hardware by $50 ...
Also the Catalyst sucks because it's basically a playback machine running modelling as compared to something like DT50 which although is older tech sounds better because it's built like a regular tube amp with a digital preamp.
 
paisleywookiee said:
No demand. DI himself has said it.
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He _did_ say that in the past. And yet in this very thread he said that things may have changed:

Digital Igloo said:
We looked at a comprehensive Helix-in-a-combo and Helix-in-a-head years ago and felt it'd be too expensive to do right. But public perception may have changed by now.
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I thought that's what the last few pages of this thread have been responding to? It's what I was responding to anyway.
 
Honestly I think on the high end stuff hype (read: marketing) goes a long way. I never heard a Two-Rock before seriously considering if I should get one. They sold themselves well and then the right people validated their claims. Line 6’s regular marketing has never been great. I didn’t take the Helix seriously until I started hearing the real hype from players I trusted, and saw people on the message boards validating it.

If I was going to spend big money on an amp I’d want to see videos with team Helix like they put out for the Catalyst models, showing their experience and love of power tubes and big iron, and then explaining how they dealt with that section of the amp. Then I’d want to see accounts of third parties saying “yeah, they did it.” Then I would drive two hours to the one music store that has one for me to check out.
 
ian_dissonance said:
Now I just want a less-featured PowerCab that’s a solid "FRFR" and that’s it, no modeling/speaker modeling/FX. The Firehawk 1500 didn’t exactly fly off shelves and I doubt it’s because it didn’t have tubes in it.
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Personally, I would also rather Line 6 put out an improved PowerCab.

I think they need to design a cabinet that can be either open back or closed back to really make it work.
 
ragingplatypi said:
Personally, I would also rather Line 6 put out an improved PowerCab.

I think they need to design a cabinet that can be either open back or closed back to really make it work.
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Open back might be cool if they stick with speaker modeling. My selfish desire is to forget all that nonsense and just make it a solid box with a good amp and some good coaxial drivers that looks like a guitar cab. Preferably vertical 2x12 orientation. Actually, I think I just want a Laney FR212 but for $100 less with the new cab smell.
 
Personally, I don’t get it.

You’re gonna need a floor controller. If you’re carrying the amp and controller anyway, just get whatever good amp you like and plug your helix in.

For what they would have to charge for the thing to do it right, I’d rather just buy whatever amp I wanted to go along with the helix.

D
 
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