I don't get the Dumble thing

[Achilles]

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

...Or more specifically, I don't get why Dumble clones are several grand more than most other types of amps.

I was listening to That Pedal Show where they were able to play Robben Ford's real Dumble amp, which prompted this thread.

I've played a couple of Dumble style amps but no idea what specific Dumble model they were based on. I've also played the Dumble in the Axe-Fx 3 as well as all the other Dumble-like amps in the Fractal.

To me Dumbles when clean sound basically like Fenders with a lot more midrange emphasis. When overdriven, they start to take a character more like a Bassman or Marshall. I have nothing against the sound, when done well they sound very nice, but not in some different category that you couldn't get out of much more pedestrian amps with some choice pedals.

Yet somehow these amps, and clones of them, have become almost mythical as if there's something so magic about them that warrants the prices asked. I'd say a lot of the "magic" is in the Celestion G12-65 speakers often paired with these amps.

Funnily enough go to speakers in Dumbles were EV12L.

As for folks wigging out about prices, in the early 90s Dumble, Rivera, THD, Soldano and Bogner were all just above 2k

Only ODS type amp I ever liked was the original Two-Rock Emerald Pro.

When I was playing with Steve Kimock he had an ODS that was ok but I preferred his Two-Rock Opal.

Henry Kaiser's SSS killed.

And the best Dumbkes I played were the modded Marshalls he did.

As for prices of the clones... When I look at amp prices in Germany on just about anything I mosdef would rather buy a Diezel or Driftwood for a fraction of the price.


But yeah midels, profiles, clones...no cigar.

 

[Mongillo19]

And the best Dumbkes I played were the midded Marshalls he did.

As for prices if the clones... When I look at amp prices in Germany on just about anything I mosdef would rather buy a Duezel or Druftwood fir a fraction of the price.

Did you play Scrabble with your keyboard halfway through typing

 

[la szum]

They just seem really narrow tonally---even if they are made for each player
they were originally sold to. It's not like one guy got a 4 stage cascading gain
preamp fire breather and someone else got a NMV with just a single stage of
preamp gain. They all follow a Big Al topology, even if the components/component
values were adjusted for each player.

Hell, a vintage Silverface Bassman Head seems far more versatile at about $1000.
Or a JCM800.

Just. Don't. Get. It. Noting to do with price or mystique either.

 

[PLX]

They just seem really narrow tonally---even if they are made for each player
they were originally sold to. It's not like one guy got a 4 stage cascading gain
preamp fire breather and someone else got a NMV with just a single stage of
preamp gain. They all follow a Big Al topology, even if the components/component
values were adjusted for each player.

Hell, a vintage Silverface Bassman Head seems far more versatile at about $1000.
Or a JCM800.

Just. Don't. Get. It. Noting to do with price or mystique either.

 

[Life Eats Life]

Killer!!!

 

[jazzarian]

Someone I know should have bought one circa 1990.

 

[jazzarian]

For me, the “Dumble thing” is all about the feel and the way the notes “bloom.”

Larry Carlton "Last Night" circa 1986 or so.

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

Did you play Scrabble with your keyboard halfway through typing

Seemingly

 

[Boudoir Guitar]

...Or more specifically, I don't get why Dumble clones are several grand more than most other types of amps.

I was listening to That Pedal Show where they were able to play Robben Ford's real Dumble amp, which prompted this thread.

I've played a couple of Dumble style amps but no idea what specific Dumble model they were based on. I've also played the Dumble in the Axe-Fx 3 as well as all the other Dumble-like amps in the Fractal.

To me Dumbles when clean sound basically like Fenders with a lot more midrange emphasis. When overdriven, they start to take a character more like a Bassman or Marshall. I have nothing against the sound, when done well they sound very nice, but not in some different category that you couldn't get out of much more pedestrian amps with some choice pedals.

Yet somehow these amps, and clones of them, have become almost mythical as if there's something so magic about them that warrants the prices asked. I'd say a lot of the "magic" is in the Celestion G12-65 speakers often paired with these amps.

Is there a piece of gear that gets you genuinely giddy with excitement over its sound? Not just "oh, yeah, that'll do. And what a convenient package and set of features!" But just puts a huge smile on your face because of the sound that comes out of the speaker?

As to the Dumble thing, I was all sorts of "I just don't get these" over all the digital version up the Line 6 Grammatico thing. The Synergy OS module clean channel is also special -- just a really big huge clean sound that isn't always appropriate, but when it is, is really really special. But also not so special for me to keep it, I guess, so there's that.

 

[jazzarian]

They just seem really narrow tonally---even if they are made for each player
they were originally sold to. It's not like one guy got a 4 stage cascading gain
preamp fire breather and someone else got a NMV with just a single stage of
preamp gain. They all follow a Big Al topology, even if the components/component
values were adjusted for each player.

Hell, a vintage Silverface Bassman Head seems far more versatile at about $1000.
Or a JCM800.

Just. Don't. Get. It. Noting to do with price or mystique either.

"Hell, a vintage Silverface Bassman Head seems far more versatile at about $1000.
Or a JCM800."

OK, has anyone extolled the virtues of multichannel amps, vs ancient single channel amps destined to be used in conjunction with a pedal board, in your lifetime?

Boogie and Dumble were some of the early examples of 2 channel amps. The Boogie Mark IIC+ and the non-HRM Dumble amps had great clean channels as well as very dynamic, harmonically rich and soothing overdrives, with no pedals required in the signal chain. Many people like amps that perform like these. Enter companies like Fuchs, Bludotone, Sebago Sound, various Two Rock, Kane, Amplified Nation, Glaswerks, etc etc.

I've played many and purchased a good deal of amps like these. I'd rather these than placing a Zendrive in front of a Fender, but that's just me.

 

[laxu]

Is there a piece of gear that gets you genuinely giddy with excitement over its sound? Not just "oh, yeah, that'll do. And what a convenient package and set of features!" But just puts a huge smile on your face because of the sound that comes out of the speaker?

The more amps I've tried, the less blown away I am by anything. Hardly anyone makes anything new, and many of the amps I've bought in recent years have been bought by the strength of their feature set rather than any particular uniqueness in sound (not that I'm even looking for that). Of course they needed to sound great too, but I feel there's not many bad sounding amps out there today, just amps that don't fit your particular preference.

These amps are also highly subject to trends. The Fuchs or Bludotone amps were once thought to be the bees knees, but now few people talk about them because they've moved on to the next thing that is "even more Dumble". I tried to coax some "What is it about these amps that makes them so great and worth the cost?" answers from Tag at TOP but only got "Well just give the maker a call, he's a real nice guy and will explain" deflections.

Once the price is really high, you get into this exclusive club and the members of that club tend to say the amp is the best thing since sliced bread, so it's a small group of people hyping up these amps. The only way to ascertain if they are "the best" is to buy one and try it for yourself. Nobody wants to admit that what they bought wasn't all that. Doesn't matter if it's Dumble style amps, Wizards etc.

This is usually not intentional and the people are probably just excited about their amp and want to share it with others. I'm sure everyone here has done that with their favorite amp, modeler etc.

 

[Eagle]

Anyone saying they don’t get it hasn’t played though one. It’s that simple. Even though it’s not my thing five minutes plugging in and you are in another dimension. You will probably play differently and you will get it. Disclaimers;
Models and clones are not the same. Amps are the sum of the parts and part of the process was listening to the amp and knowing if something wasn’t exactly what he had in mind and having the experience to swap out parts until it was . Not just a static circuit with fixed values for parts. Dumble would hear the cumulative effect of that particular set of components with all their tolerances interacting and know what to tweak. I’m not saying no one else could ever do this but I am yet to hear it.
Most amp techs repair stuff sat with a multi meter but Dumble used a guitar and his ears.

 

[laxu]

OK, has anyone extolled the virtues of multichannel amps, vs ancient single channel amps destined to be used in conjunction with a pedal board, in your lifetime?

That's just a different approach rather than better or worse. I feel I've gotten just as good tones from pedals in front of a clean channel or edge of breakup setting, as I've gotten from multichannel amps. The two are not the same, but it's just a different sound. Pedals can often do something that no amp does on its own. Whether that is something you want is a whole another question.

 

[laxu]

I wouldn’t have mind of the guys from TPS had drawn a QC DI profile from that amp though. If Ford did so…and it wouldn’t surprise me if his appearance on the TPS was the beginning of marketing on that..,he would make a nice buck. I’d draw my creditcard on the spot for a capture of that iconic amp.

I wish they had just played some chords. These amps seem to be very much designed around lead playing.

I don't think the TPS guys have a QC. They are pretty anti-multifx in the first place.

 

[James Freeman]

That's what happens when people who don't play music get involved, collectors, auctioneers, lawyers, and other sleaze of the land.
There is nothing "special" about dumble amps, they are indeed just a modified fender with added gain stage/s, like everything else.

 

[dronerstone]

As I said earlier, I love the Grammatico GSG in the Helix, but I haven't looked real deep into "that" sound, and I have no clue if I've ever heard one IRL.

From the little I know about them, and amp electronics in general, I'd agree on the "Fender with lots of low mids" thing.

Apart from that, I find D-style amps to sound a bit raunchier than your average Fender, with added body/heft (low mids again), and they seem like they'll start to fart out when pushed, but in a nice, musical way.

So, really great amps I guess, but the mystique is only an ever-lasting fad, imho. Ymmv

 

[laxu]

Anyone saying they don’t get it hasn’t played though one. It’s that simple. Even though it’s not my thing five minutes plugging in and you are in another dimension. You will probably play differently and you will get it.

This is the kind of mystique building that is kind of the same as "this modeler does not feel right to me" statements. I can't go play an unobtainium amp any more than I can jump into someone else's brain to perceive how something feels to them.

Maybe you are right, and the real deals are just that good. But you rarely hear these sort of statements thrown around for amps that any Joe Schmoe can just go try at Guitar Center.

As for clones and digital models not replicating the "real" experience...why not? The few clones I've played certainly did the things that I associate with the Dumble sound, the same things you can hear e.g on that TPS video.

 

[mbenigni]

 

[mbenigni]

My budget:

With my budget there’s a lot less legroom.