I think I was wrong about this amp...

[MatrixClaw]

So, I had this 1x12 cab mostly sitting around unused and it's taking up too much space in my music room, but I prefer the sound of it to the speaker in the 5:25... so I reached out to a guy who was selling a 5:50 head to see if he'd be interested in any trades, then I could sell the 5:25 and use the little tiny stack for the same purpose. Turns out, he wanted to switch to a small tube combo, so... I traded him the 5:25 for it:



I didn't have a chance to A/B them, but first impressions are that this one is tighter on the high gain mode and overall quite a bit brighter. Sounds great. Definitely happy with the trade and the grill almost matches my cab!

 

[laxu]

Worth it just for the purple tolex!

 

[AFKAEjay(retired)]

Interesting developments A/Bing my Iconic 40 and Express 2:25 today. I was planning on selling the Iconic, if the Express favored well against it, and buying the new Fryette GPDI/IR but...

I expected the comparison to be pretty cut and dry: the Iconic would be better at high gain, the Express would be better everywhere else. I was wrong... kinda.

The Express is a DARK amp in comparison. I just couldn't get anywhere close to the sparkle that the Iconic has on its clean/crunch settings and on high gain, the Express sounds like it has a blanket over it, even when the lows are at 10 and the treble is maxed. I didn't like it in any setting, from cleans to edge of breakup to blues, crunch and modern metal. Next to the Iconic, it sounded weak and muddy.

The only area the Express won was on its reverb. The Iconic's reverb is weird and warbly, it doesn't ramp in like the Express does, it just gets louder. The reverb on the Express is usable when dimed, the Iconic's is usable till like 3/10.

That said, I was curious if maybe the speaker was the issue, so I plugged the Express into the WGS ET65 I have in the Iconic and it definitely sounded much clearer. Still dark, but not boomy and just overwhelmingly filled with low frequencies. I felt like a brighter speaker like a V30 or maybe a Greenback would've worked nicely, though I'm skeptical how it'd affect the lower gain tones. I'd like to try it with the V-Type in my PRS cab. I couldn't A/B the amps at this point to compare them though - the Iconic did sound noticably worse plugged into the Express's speaker, though.

However, the interesting development comes when I listened back to the quick cell phone recordings I made in the room while testing them. There was no comparison. The Express destroyed the Iconic. The brightness of the Iconic that I loved in the room, translated to a shrill ice-picky high end and lack of weight in the low end. The Express sounded full and lush with a much more even tonal range.

I recorded it with my phone on the floor pointed towards the middle of both of them. Wondering if the cabs are just super directional and simply A/Bing them sitting in front of them isn't going to cut it. Now I need to properly mic both and try again!

Reversed story here. I want to sell an amp…and express was the primary candidate for it.

Last check versus a supersonic 22 and a supersonic 60…supersonic 60 will leave the building I’m afraid. (Prob the speaker is a tad too bright for my taste)

Again confirmed that at low volume levels this amp sounds a lot better with a little volume attenuation in the loop.

 

[MatrixClaw]

Reversed story here. I want to sell an amp…and express was the primary candidate for it.

Last check versus a supersonic 22 and a supersonic 60…supersonic 60 will leave the building I’m afraid. (Prob the speaker is a tad too bright for my taste)

Again confirmed that at low volume levels this amp sounds a lot better with a little volume attenuation in the loop.

Interesting! The Supersonic is one that's been on my list to try for a while. I had planned on getting that instead of the Deluxe Reverb I traded for this, but found the Deluxe for a great price locally and went with it (only to find out the guy sold me a broken amp that I had to dump another $250 in!). I'm really digging the 50w head. It's a lot different sounding than the 25 (in a good way). One thing I've noticed with these amps - the EQ controls aren't that powerful. The Contour does a ton and then the BMT knobs are just tiny fine tuners. I wish it had a presence control, as I feel like it's lacking some top end sizzle, but I have an EQ that can get me there, at least.

 

[newholland]

Reversed story here. I want to sell an amp…and express was the primary candidate for it.

Last check versus a supersonic 22 and a supersonic 60…supersonic 60 will leave the building I’m afraid. (Prob the speaker is a tad too bright for my taste)

Again confirmed that at low volume levels this amp sounds a lot better with a little volume attenuation in the loop.

i know a mark sure does. at low volume with a 100k pot in the loop the amp sounds 1000x better if you can get the master to at least 2 and the lead master to at least 2. mesas need their voltage

 

[AFKAEjay(retired)]

Interesting! The Supersonic is one that's been on my list to try for a while. I had planned on getting that instead of the Deluxe Reverb I traded for this, but found the Deluxe for a great price locally and went with it (only to find out the guy sold me a broken amp that I had to dump another $250 in!). I'm really digging the 50w head. It's a lot different sounding than the 25 (in a good way). One thing I've noticed with these amps - the EQ controls aren't that powerful. The Contour does a ton and then the BMT knobs are just tiny fine tuners. I wish it had a presence control, as I feel like it's lacking some top end sizzle, but I have an EQ that can get me there, at least.

The supersonic 22 is my fav amp, next to a great handbuild Dumble clone. I think the speaker in the 60 is a bit bright for my taste though.
But maybe there is some “amp confusion”? The supersonic doesn’t have a contour…maybe that’s the pro sonic?

 

[MatrixClaw]

The supersonic 22 is my fav amp, next to a great handbuild Dumble clone. I think the speaker in the 60 is a bit bright for my taste though.
But maybe there is some “amp confusion”? The supersonic doesn’t have a contour…maybe that’s the pro sonic?

Sorry, was referring to the Express with the Contour. That's good to know - so it's just the 60w version of the Supersonic you don't love? They are different circuits from what I've read?

 

[AFKAEjay(retired)]

Sorry, was referring to the Express with the Contour. That's good to know - so it's just the 60w version of the Supersonic you don't love? They are different circuits from what I've read?

To my ears the preamp section is the same.

I still think it’s a great amp. To my ears a bit “scooped”…what you would expect from a Twin for example.
Not many scenarios where I’d want that…in most cases I gravitate to mid focused / darker sounds.

If I remember correctly you missed a bit of chime with the express…you might even prefer the 60.

I suspect it’s cause of the speaker, I run preamps into returns of my combos, and the 60 always was a little brighter then avarage, ussually poweramps don’t cause that difference.

Btw, slaving the express by the send of the ssonic..is a actually a nice combination.

 

[AFKAEjay(retired)]

Sorry, was referring to the Express with the Contour. That's good to know - so it's just the 60w version of the Supersonic you don't love? They are different circuits from what I've read?

Couldn’t help myself…wanted to know if it was indeed the speaker that makes the 60 a bit brighter then the 22. It wasn’t.
Swapping a preamp between powersections of the 22/60 into the same speaker gave a brighter result on the 60.
Swapping the speakers between the ones in the 22/60 using the same pre and powersection was more or less equal.

 

[MatrixClaw]

Couldn’t help myself…wanted to know if it was indeed the speaker that makes the 60 a bit brighter then the 22. It wasn’t.
Swapping a preamp between powersections of the 22/60 into the same speaker gave a brighter result on the 60.
Swapping the speakers between the ones in the 22/60 using the same pre and powersection was more or less equal.

Interesting. I was reading more about the two, the power sections are obviously different - 6V6 vs 6L6, which would result in a different sound, since the 6V6s would distort quicker, but channel 1 of the 22 is supposedly a Deluxe Reverb, while the 60 is a Vibrolux or Bassman. This is mostly why I was looking at the 22. I wanted that Deluxe Reverb tone that I could get a cool edge of breakup sound on, plus the Burn channel that would cover most rock sounds.