Guitar brands and third party manufacturers. Who makes it , where and does it matter.

[mbenigni]

The

I get the modern relativism schtick and that it's all subjective but at some point you hit the common sense, objective truths wall.

It's not entirely clear to me how this relates to my own comment. FWIW, I don't own any Harley Bentons LOL. All I'm saying is sometimes you need several guitars to get the job done. So if your budget is fixed at $x, your guitars are going to have cost $x/y, where y is the number of guitars required.

And that's about as objective as I can get.

 

[SKU]

The

It's not entirely clear to me how this relates to my own comment. FWIW, I don't own any Harley Bentons LOL. All I'm saying is sometimes you need several guitars to get the job done. So if your budget is fixed at $x, your guitars are going to have cost $x/y, where y is the number of guitars required.

And that's about as objective as I can get.

It was tangential to your comment, not criticism. In the sense that I get it that some people need a bunch of guitars but most people who buy multiple cheap guitars are amateurs so they don't really need multiple guitars especially multiple cheap guitars. I've been there, it is what it is. GAS is addiction ...

 

[mbenigni]

It sometimes seems like the older I get, the cheaper my guitars get. (Marriage, home ownership, fatherhood...) These two are both Indonesian. ~$350 used for the Jem Jr; ~$900 new for the SG.

IMO the Jem Jr is a ridiculous value. Looks, neck carve, attention to detail, finish (neck and body) are as nice as on any solid body guitar I've played. The only arguable let down is the bridge, but a real Edge would probably double the cost of manufacture. Needed a good setup. Otherwise, a steal.

The SG veers more into the "manufacturer selling 'cool factor'" territory, with Iommi inlays and custom pickups (which I don't personally like all that much.) On the one hand, it's a well-executed neck through with a lovely heel carve, nice inlay, binding, and fret work... "good bones". On the other hand, the guitar just will not stay in tune. I've changed tuners (stock parts sucked) and added a String Butler (surprisingly effective), which improved but did not correct. I honestly think the neck is just too thin to support 24 frets of leverage hanging off the body. Or maybe the truss rod isn't adjusted properly to compensate? I wish I knew a tech I could trust. Me setting up a Gibson/ Epi is like me trying to speak French lol.

Anyway, I digress. Point is, they're both (relatively) cheap. They're both Indonesian. They're both beautiful.

 

[mbenigni]

It was tangential to your comment, not criticism. In the sense that I get it that some people need a bunch of guitars but most people who buy multiple cheap guitars are amateurs so they don't really need multiple guitars especially multiple cheap guitars. I've been there, it is what it is. GAS is addiction ...

100%. I'm reminded of that scene in Glengarry Glen Ross where Pacino monologues about how most people buy things - not because they want the things - but because they want the experience of buying the things. I can remember being young and impressionable and walking out of stores carrying gear I felt ambivalent about simply because I didn't want to be the dweeb who came and left empty handed for no reason... again. (I'm well over that. In fact, I rarely bother walking into stores in the first place now. )

See previous comment:

But mostly it's a matter of having limited resources, but still wanting the experience of buying a guitar now and again.

 

[JiveTurkey]

It sometimes seems like the older I get, the cheaper my guitars get. (Marriage, home ownership, fatherhood...) These two are both Indonesian. ~$350 used for the Jem Jr; ~$900 new for the SG.

IMO the Jem Jr is a ridiculous value. Looks, neck carve, attention to detail, finish (neck and body) are as nice as on any solid body guitar I've played. The only arguable let down is the bridge, but a real Edge would probably double the cost of manufacture. Needed a good setup. Otherwise, a steal.

The SG veers more into the "manufacturer selling 'cool factor'" territory, with Iommi inlays and custom pickups (which I don't personally like all that much.) On the one hand, it's a well-executed neck through with a lovely heel carve, nice inlay, binding, and fret work... "good bones". On the other hand, the guitar just will not stay in tune. I've changed tuners (stock parts sucked) and added a String Butler (surprisingly effective), which improved but did not correct. I honestly think the neck is just too thin to support 24 frets of leverage hanging off the body. Or maybe the truss rod isn't adjusted properly to compensate? I wish I knew a tech I could trust. Me setting up a Gibson/ Epi is like me trying to speak French lol.

Anyway, I digress. Point is, they're both (relatively) cheap. They're both Indonesian. They're both beautiful.

View attachment 19251

I LOVE SGs (other than the rather limited standard finish choices they offer) but they seem to be very temperamental.

 

[mbenigni]

I LOVE SGs (other than the rather limited standard finish choices they offer) but they seem to be very temperamental.

Limited?? What shade of black were you looking for?

"Temperamental" might be too kind.

 

[JiveTurkey]

Limited?? What shade of black were you looking for?

"Temperamental" might be too kind.

YOU FORGOT GROSS BROWNRED!?!!!!??!?!?!!?

 

[mbenigni]

YOU FORGOT GROSS BROWNRED!?!!!!??!?!?!!?

POTHEAD RED™!

BONGWATER BROWN™!

 

[Achilles]

First guitar I ever gassed for before I even knew what that meant. Brand new 1971-72? SG hanging on the wall of the one mom & pop music store in town. Had just gotten my 1st electric - K-Mart strat clone - and already knew I needed something better. I burned so much time just staring at this thing in total wonderment. Kind of like the apes and the monolith in 2001.

I just knew all the guitar powers of the universe had to be locked up inside of this thing - but it was so far beyond reach at that point.

This is a 72 for reference.

Weirdly, an SG is one of the few iconic electrics I've never owned at any point.

 

[Eagle]

Ugh. A neck can absorb energy from the strings, and a stiffer neck will absorb less energy from the strings. Whether this is a good thing or a bad thing is ENTIRELY subjective - I (and many others) are not a huge fan of it on solid body electric guitars.

There's a mandolin maker that I believe was a physics professor in a former life and had access to legit measurement tools that has done loads of studies on this. This "transferring energy from strings to body" is nonsense.

David Cohen

Cohen Musical Instruments Twenty-year GAL member Dave Cohen built his first mandolin in 1973 while a graduate student at Florida State U. He taught college chemistry and did research in Richmond, V…

www.search.luth.org

Dr Dave taught Chemistry.
What do you think is happening when you press a guitar firmly against a table and the table amplifies the sound? Agreed about string energy dissipation through the neck (and everything else) but dead and zingy are opposite ends. All necks are somewhere along the spectrum as is anything in contact with the guitar. The energy will find the easiest way through or back in to the string if that is the path of least resistance (why high mass hardware adds sustain at the expense of tone/acoustic volume. Volume verses sustain in acoustic instruments , same in electric except volume is now best replaceable in desired attributes for the builder because volume is now external. Hence the solid body electric but a 335 doesn't sound like a Les Paul.

 

[dk_ace]

I want to know where it was made.

If it is made outside of the US (especially in Asian markets), and the price is remotely close to US instruments, I have zero interest.

That’s just me. I’m not paying close to the same money for a guitar made in Asia as the US. It might be just as good, but I don’t care.

D

 

[spawnofthesith]

I want to know where it was made.

If it is made outside of the US (especially in Asian markets), and the price is remotely close to US instruments, I have zero interest.

That’s just me. I’m not paying close to the same money for a guitar made in Asia as the US. It might be just as good, but I don’t care.

D

Somewhat agree here. I believe there is intentional obstinance by some when this conversation comes up, plain and simple: it costs a lot more money to manufacture a guitar in the US than it does in many Asian countries. And then there's the double down on obstinance where someone will be complaining out one side of their mouth that *insert USA brand* is overpriced, while defending similarly priced imports from Indonesia out the other


And I'm sure someone will try and argue with me here, but I have yet to play an import that is "just as good" as any of my USA guitars. Call me a snob all you want EDIT: I lied, MIJ guitars have been up there on the same level in my experience.

 

[Eagle]

Somewhat agree here. I believe there is intentional obstinance by some when this conversation comes up, plain and simple: it costs a lot more money to manufacture a guitar in the US than it does in many Asian countries. And then there's the double down on obstinance where someone will be complaining out one side of their mouth that *insert USA brand* is overpriced, while defending similarly priced imports from Indonesia out the other


And I'm sure someone will try and argue with me here, but I have yet to play an import that is "just as good" as any of my USA guitars. Call me a snob all you want

Aristides,Mayones both as good as anything ever built in USA.

 

[spawnofthesith]

Aristides,Mayones both as good as anything ever built in USA.

Edited my post to say I lied already, because I consider the MIJ stuff I've played and owned to be on that same level. I guess I should have been more specific meaning I was referring to MII, MIC, and MIK (not that I think those are bad guitars either)

 

[dk_ace]

Somewhat agree here. I believe there is intentional obstinance by some when this conversation comes up, plain and simple: it costs a lot more money to manufacture a guitar in the US than it does in many Asian countries. And then there's the double down on obstinance where someone will be complaining out one side of their mouth that *insert USA brand* is overpriced, while defending similarly priced imports from Indonesia out the other


And I'm sure someone will try and argue with me here, but I have yet to play an import that is "just as good" as any of my USA guitars. Call me a snob all you want EDIT: I lied, MIJ guitars have been up there on the same level in my experience.

I have an MIJ strat that I kept instead of a USA strat, it was simply better.

It might have sounded like I have a problem with Asian guitars and I don’t. I just have a problem paying just as much for them as US instruments. At the time, those MIJ Strats were sleepers at $5-700 which I was very happy with.

D

 

[Eagle]

I had a MIJ 54 limited edition 60th anniversary Japanese home market only strat that was pretty much perfect. But I sold it because I couldn’t get on with 7.25” and vintage frets . I didn’t have the hart to mod it because it was mint.

USA custom shop pickups and CTS/ CRL , I should have kept it.

 

[JasonE]

I have an MIJ strat that I kept instead of a USA strat, it was simply better.

It might have sounded like I have a problem with Asian guitars and I don’t. I just have a problem paying just as much for them as US instruments. At the time, those MIJ Strats were sleepers at $5-700 which I was very happy with.

D

IMHO, and I have met many others that share the opinion, back in the late 70's and 80's the Fender guitars coming out of Japan were better built than the US built Fender guitars. I had a Strat back then that was made in Japan and I compared it against the US stuff in the shop and it was just a better built guitar all around and played and sounded better than the US built guitars. They were having some QC issues in the US back then. They had their act together in Japan.

 

[DrewJD82]

It sometimes seems like the older I get, the cheaper my guitars get. (Marriage, home ownership, fatherhood...) These two are both Indonesian. ~$350 used for the Jem Jr; ~$900 new for the SG.

IMO the Jem Jr is a ridiculous value. Looks, neck carve, attention to detail, finish (neck and body) are as nice as on any solid body guitar I've played. The only arguable let down is the bridge, but a real Edge would probably double the cost of manufacture. Needed a good setup. Otherwise, a steal.

The SG veers more into the "manufacturer selling 'cool factor'" territory, with Iommi inlays and custom pickups (which I don't personally like all that much.) On the one hand, it's a well-executed neck through with a lovely heel carve, nice inlay, binding, and fret work... "good bones". On the other hand, the guitar just will not stay in tune. I've changed tuners (stock parts sucked) and added a String Butler (surprisingly effective), which improved but did not correct. I honestly think the neck is just too thin to support 24 frets of leverage hanging off the body. Or maybe the truss rod isn't adjusted properly to compensate? I wish I knew a tech I could trust. Me setting up a Gibson/ Epi is like me trying to speak French lol.

Anyway, I digress. Point is, they're both (relatively) cheap. They're both Indonesian. They're both beautiful.

View attachment 19251

A new Edge cost $50 less than a whole new JEM Jr!

 

[mbenigni]

A new Edge cost $50 less than a whole new JEM Jr!

For us punters, yeah (and worth every penny IMO). I'm sure cost to Ibanez is much less. But yeah, you wouldn't want to bolt one to a $500 MSRP guitar LOL.

 

[laxu]

Does any of this matter to you guys or are you just looking at the product in isolation?
I know a lot of people not happy with Strandberg charging £2k plus for made in Indonesia regardless of the finished article.
It has been the case in the past that the manufacturer has used countries with lower cost to produce only their low to mid price products but today any factory in China can produce anything that they want at any price point.
I would love to know what you guys think?
If it’s open is it fine? Or when companies just don’t say and hide the information is this relevant or just marketing.

I currently own guitars made in (in rough region order):

• United States
• Canada
• Finland
• Poland
• Slovenia
• Japan
• South Korea
• Indonesia
• China

All of these guitars are good. So the country of manufacture or factory doesn't matter to me much, the quality of the guitar does.

For example my only acoustic is a Chinese made, all solid wood Ibanez AW800 because I liked how that guitar played, sounded and felt better than the Martins, Yamahas and others I played when shopping for one. 17 years later it's still great.

Out of these countries, Indonesian made guitars have been the most impressive to me for price vs quality. The Ibanez BTB33 bass and the Schecter Coupe hollowbody I have are nearly flawlessly built, certainly well above their price tags.

I think it is interesting to know which factory made which guitar, but especially for older guitars it's difficult to find out. But it makes no difference to me in enjoyment of the individual guitar.

With Strandberg, to me the issue is not the country of manufacture, but the quality vs price. It feels like those Asian labor savings are not translated to the buyer price. I've played Japanese made Strandbergs that sold for about 3000-4000€ some years ago, and those were really nicely made and totally worth the money, but expensive to import.

On the flip side, the 2400€ Korean made Strandberg Boden I briefly owned was literally the worst quality guitar I have ever owned. Unusably bad fretwork, chunk of wood missing near the nut, worst quilt top I've ever seen, finish flaking off the hw right from the start and more. It was a disgrace they tried to sell it at all - but somehow that guitar made it from the Korean factory all the way to Sweden and then to Finland only for me to have to discover it's a bag of shit and return it. I put Strandberg on my "do not buy list" because of that.