A lot of people will disagree with my hardware modeler ranking

[DrewJD82]

Hahahahha the online speculation/bickering/anger over 'y not my amp? or peddle?'/all the @'s DI would be dealing with....I can totally understand why they don't get more detailed than "there's an update coming"!

Look at our upcoming Fractal product thread, no one even needs any additional details than there being a product that requires FW and BOOM.

 

[DrewJD82]

My thoughts in regards to 'this update broke my presets'. how much are they mangling the amp to sound like something it's not in order for these smaller updates to require more than a simple turn of the B/M/T/MV knobs?

I can definitely give some leeway to the guys who primarily rely on poweramp distotion for their base tone across their presets, depending on the amp and MV, that can definitely change how the EQ of the amp sounds and require more than just a simple knob turn, but even then, none of these updates have taken any amp out of the ballpark it's always been in.

 

[JiveTurkey]

Honestly; the only brand that routinely does that much regular retooling is FAS. The HX stuff has some bits from time to time. I just don't see that big a change. I have to work to hear things in FAS as is. So Lead Ears McGinty status duly noted; it's really a non-issue. Unless you are one of those preset per song wingnuts.

 

[timbuck3]

Let me get this straight…what you are saying is that any guitar player using a helix stomp, or fm3 or QC…isn’t a serious guitar player…and isn’t in the high end segment?

This doesn’t even make sense.

 

[paisleywookiee]

Hahahahha the online speculation/bickering/anger over 'y not my amp? or peddle?'/all the @'s DI would be dealing with....I can totally understand why they don't get more detailed than "there's an update coming"!

Look at our upcoming Fractal product thread, no one even needs any additional details than there being a product that requires FW and BOOM.

ALL AMPS MATTER!!

 

[la szum]

Hey
Don’t let the Debbie downers get to you!
A voice of reason is refreshing to see

Thanks, Cheech!

I love gear and talking it as much as the next guy (or gal!). I just think there are
times when the convo(s) can get into the weeds, so much so that the primary aim
of why any of us wanted to play guitar (or acquire gear) gets lost in the shuffle.

I never once thought when I was 15 that I wanted to play guitar so I could argue
and debate 40 years later on the Internet that didn't exist when I was 15.

 

[la szum]

Honestly; the only brand that routinely does that much regular retooling is FAS. The HX stuff has some bits from time to time. I just don't see that big a change. I have to work to hear things in FAS as is. So Lead Ears McGinty status duly noted; it's really a non-issue. Unless you are one of those preset per song wingnuts.

iLock Preset Guy chiming in.

 

[OneEng]

Let me get this straight…what you are saying is that any guitar player using a helix stomp, or fm3 or QC…isn’t a serious guitar player…and isn’t in the high end segment?

Ok, it is quite clear at this point that my wording was way off in the first post.

Back to my original point, there are MANY (most) gigging musicians both touring, and local bar band guitarists that WOULD NOT use a 2 or 3 button digital guitar amp live.

There are many gigging musicians who WOULD use such a device, but I still contend that for most gigging musicians that are attracted to a digital guitar amp, are going to want a better floor board than that.

Just to put this in perspective, can someone post a touring guitarist on a big stage using ONLY a 3 button digital amplifier?

As for the strange off-shoot topic of tone changing when updating the firmware, for ME that is a DEAD NO. As has been eluded to in other posts regarding having tones for different types of songs, I have worked hard over years to accumulate a library of sounds that I use live and that work very well with a wide variety of songs and sit in the mix nicely. Kemper tones DON'T change when up update firmware. Not since 2013 when I bought mine.

I know others here are arguing that people should just stop wining and update their patches when this happens. Seriously? I suppose some people are just used to being screwed by the OEM of their digital amp and don't mind it anymore.

I wonder why this topic isn't one of the metrics used by these geniuses that make these "best digital amps" videos? Perhaps they only talk about using the device vs having to actually gig with it for a living?

Again, my point is that without the perspective of "best for what?", any "best digital amps" comparison is simply useless.

 

[paisleywookiee]

Yup. True.

Alas, crying is a full-time occupation for some, and then they double down with it
being a favourite pasttime after all those work hours spent crying.

I am really put off by the online guitar community at the moment. I know
real struggle--as I suspect many of us do---and having to rework presets is
not anywhere close to real struggle. Nor is the ream of issues coming from
the folks who seem to turn everything to shit that they touch. What a gift!

We live in a literal Golden Age. Getting out of our own fucking way and
realizing this is 99.9% of the challenge.

#cryingaboutthecrying

 

[FuzzyAce]

Yup. True.

Alas, crying is a full-time occupation for some, and then they double down with it
being a favourite pasttime after all those work hours spent crying.

I am really put off by the online guitar community at the moment. I know
real struggle--as I suspect many of us do---and having to rework presets is
not anywhere close to real struggle. Nor is the ream of issues coming from
the folks who seem to turn everything to shit that they touch. What a gift!

We live in a literal Golden Age. Getting out of our own fucking way and
realizing this is 99.9% of the challenge.

#cryingaboutthecrying

We are gear spoiled for sure. It's very hard for me to complain and nitpick about features considering what you get for the money, especially with modelers. Honest feedback can be good, but a lot of guys get really carried away expecting a perfect piece of gear (not gonna happen) and never seem satisfied. I'd rather put that passion more directly into the music/creative side of things than spend an exorbitant amount of effort on technical aspects. I've done more than enough of that in the past, there's only so much time we have, right? But this is the GEAR forum so whatevs.

 

[Orvillain]

I'm not suggesting that the improvements to Helix Core in 3.80 will be massive, nor that we'll even specify what's changing/improving. Only that the engine has continued to be refined over time—sometimes notably—so anyone claiming we're running 9-year-old tech is spouting nonsense. There's some trickery afoot with how we improve things without affecting people's presets and we'd rather wave our hands with a "nothing to see here." The next time around we may just say screw it, let's make any improvements obvious.

Similarly, many have mistakenly claimed BOSS never improved their modeling until AIRD because everything before was called "COSM."

IMHO, if you make improvements to the underlying modelling, oversampling improvements, lower aliasing, whatever it is... I think you should make quite a song and dance about it.

 

[norminal]

I think you should make quite a song and dance about it.

 

[Baba]

I never once thought when I was 15 that I wanted to play guitar so I could argue
and debate 40 years later on the Internet that didn't exist when I was 15.

Shit, TIME wasn't even invented when you were 15

I turn 55 tomorrow . . .

 

[GTR37]

View attachment 27467

 

[Baba]

Regarding preset changes with updates, I mean, I have read a few die hard Fractal users complain about this, (including a close friend, who is very "cult-like" with Fractal), and with me being more in the HX camp, and NOT having to deal with it, given the choice, I'd rather NOT.

When you take your car in for service, and they completely jack up the seat position, sure, you can "just adjust it back to your position", (if you can find it, that is), but now that we have memory positions, isn't that A LOT more convenient? One is NOT as easy as the other.

Being an HX user, I can see the PITA in that. I don't want my device sounding different, every time there is an update, or want to have to go in and "figure out" what is different, or figure out how to get it back to where I had it.

 

[Rock Chalk]

Regarding preset changes with updates, I mean, I have read a few die hard Fractal users complain about this, (including a close friend, who is very "cult-like" with Fractal), and with me being more in the HX camp, and NOT having to deal with it, given the choice, I'd rather NOT.

When you take your car in for service, and they completely jack up the seat position, sure, you can "just adjust it back to your position", (if you can find it, that is), but now that we have memory positions, isn't that A LOT more convenient? One is NOT as easy as the other.

Being an HX user, I can see the PITA in that. I don't want my device sounding different, every time there is an update, or want to have to go in and "figure out" what is different, or figure out how to get it back to where I had it.

IMO, after an update, or anytime for that matter, if you can’t just grab the BMT knobs of the amp model and find your tone, then you’re doing it wrong…or got the wrong amp….or both.

 

[Vic Winters]

Regarding preset changes with updates, I mean, I have read a few die hard Fractal users complain about this, (including a close friend, who is very "cult-like" with Fractal), and with me being more in the HX camp, and NOT having to deal with it, given the choice, I'd rather NOT.

When you take your car in for service, and they completely jack up the seat position, sure, you can "just adjust it back to your position", (if you can find it, that is), but now that we have memory positions, isn't that A LOT more convenient? One is NOT as easy as the other.

Being an HX user, I can see the PITA in that. I don't want my device sounding different, every time there is an update, or want to have to go in and "figure out" what is different, or figure out how to get it back to where I had it.

My concern wouldn't be the sound change, but if the updated blocks required more DSP than before and I could no longer run a preset.

 

[ejecta]

Crying about having to rework presets is lame. Don't upgrade if your presets are that precious.

But the drives were updated…. again.

 

[dean701]

IMO, after an update, or anytime for that matter, if you can’t just grab the BMT knobs of the amp model and find your tone, then you’re doing it wrong…or got the wrong amp….or both. View attachment 27471

This isnt just a BMT thing though and I know Cliff is determined to make everything as close as possible to the real amps.
New preamp, cathode follower and power amp algorithms are not just BMT related.
I know how you all feel and that's fine. The main issue in my post was that blocks are not updated automatically, so out of your 1024 presets you can have tons with updated blocks (manually performed) and tons that arent...and yes, my unit is booked full of both presets and IRs.
Maybe Cliff will slow down with the updates..maybe not..its up to him but the past 6 months has been one of his more active periods. I upgraded to 27 then backed down to 25. I simply dont have the time to rework everything again right now.
Regardless, bring on the hate.

 

[Mongillo19]

Crying about having to rework presets is lame. Don't upgrade if your presets are that precious.

I imagine you have to readjust presets to account for your venue about the same as what you have to adjust after an update?