A lot of people will disagree with my hardware modeler ranking

[TheTrueZoltan!]

This is what made my MX5 sound more "real" and punchy as well. Something similar to the image below:

View attachment 27342

I believe people refer to this as "James Freeman EQ" in the other forum..

Depending on the context this is also know as the Dunning-Kruger-Effect curve (context: chuckleheads) or the Hype Cycle (context: NDSP QC).

 

[TubeStack]

Hahahaha.....I've had so many accounts deleted there, I just gave up.

People there really hate the truth and memes.

It's like a cult there.

Hey that could be a name for this place: truthandmemesforum.com...

 

[GTR37]

Probably because the Head rush sounds really crap on its own
I think one of my accounts got locked over there - for saying the truth..

They just need to apply the Sadites studio compressor at the end of the chain

 

[norminal]

They just need to apply the Sadites studio compressor at the end of the chain

 

[Alex Kenivel]

 

[FuzzyAce]

I have owned 7 Line6 products, Pod, Pod rack, X3 live, Spider Valve, Helix, Stomp, Stomp, and I think I can say, that it will take A LOT for me to buy another one

Dude, you've owned 7.
7! Are you sure it's gonna take a lot for you to own one more?

 

[FuzzyAce]

I believe people refer to this as "James Freeman EQ" in the other forum..

Would be sweet to call it the Freeman Utility EQ, or FU EQ... if you will.

 

[bigmenace]

They just need to apply the Sadites studio compressor at the end of the chain

Duh, they got the MXR ten band EQ with the new update, that should do the trick.

 

[Perrymusica]

This is what made my MX5 sound more "real" and punchy as well. Something similar to the image below:

View attachment 27342

I believe people refer to this as "James Freeman EQ" in the other forum..

Correct, and that's just one part of the process. You have to take into account what amp emulation you use (a Fender is not the same as a Dual Rectifier), the dimensions of the cabinet, whether it's open or closed, and the speaker model. Everything has an influence, I'd like to see Helix implement this in their factory cabs, for example.
Anyone who wants to can try it on their Helix. In this case I made real Cabs specifically for the Helix Matchstick with H30 + Greenbacks speakers. I'll be happy to send them to you by email.

 

[dean701]

Everytime I try a Line6 product, I think.. ehhh, I`ll keep my Axe Fx (Helix, and 2 times the Stomp)
Everytime I try a Fractal Audio product I think... sounds good, hard to use, and the endless updates that did brink my presets
Everytime I turn on my Quad Cortex I think... I did the right thing, selling the Axe Fx I had

I just love the option of captures, and the option to have 4 capture or more in a row. It`s easy to use, and looks sexy

I have owned 7 Line6 products, Pod, Pod rack, X3 live, Spider Valve, Helix, Stomp, Stomp, and I think I can say, that it will take A LOT for me to buy another one
I have owned 3 Fractal Audio products, Axe Fx Ultra, Axe Fx II & MFC-101. If Fractal get a Capture option, I will get one to try out!
I had a Axe Fx III on loan while I also had my Quad Cortex to test, but ended up not sending back the QC

So far, I like my tone better with the QC, for Guitar and for Bass

But this is just my journey the last 12 years

Since we somewhat agree on your summary, I'll simply add the reliability component and one other thing that will cause this forum to explode.

1) device reliability
-I have had many Line 6 devices and never ever had a problem with hangs or crashes. I did have a Line 6 LT and the pedal broke and Line 6 even fixed it outside of the warranty period
-Kemper - outside of a firmware update crash - it was totally reliable
-FAS - I have had regular crashes where the audio on my AX3 and FM9 will hang due to either too much fiddling with core parameters or high cpu lockout
-QC - I had to return a unit because it was completely unstable. I tried another one earlier this year but felt uneasy because it still seemed too buggy. Audio drops, output level fluctuation. The included power supply is still a joke

2) Can of worms open.
For some reason this is seldom talked about and I'm not sure why.
There are plenty of complaints about the dated UI for Fractal but I don't see much talk about the block versioning.
Before you go shitting on me, I do feel that the Axefx is clearly the most capable device around with respect to effects and routing, and it does sound great...and then better...and then not.. and then better again after re-tooling.

The biggest pain point for the Fractal ecosystem for me is the versioning anomalies and the sheer amount of code changes/revisions. The fine tuning needed to maintain staying current can be overwhelming.
One could also stay on the current code but new versions also include bug fixes so sometimes it may be in your best interests to upgrade despite being completely content with your sounds. Changes sometimes happen that change the behaviors of the underlying algorithms that affect almost everything......and (here it is), after upgrading, you can actually have effects blocks that still show the parameters from the older code versions if you don't manually reset those blocks.

For example if you have a preset that was last saved with older block versions (ex. fw22) they, and that version's parameter controls, will stay in tact until you either manually refresh the blocks or if you are creating a new preset from scratch.
This is tremendously confusing, as there is no way to tell which version of each block is currently running.

Here is my best example. I have a preset that I made 5 copies of so that I could tinker with different things. Over time, this has ended up with one of the presets having a FW22 reverb, another for Fw23 reverb and so on. That's just the reverb. This can happen across the gamut.
There is no visible version mapping per block so I really don't know which version of each of the different blocks are running. More specifically, there are different dials on each of the reverb blocks now. Older blocks will show the controls that were available in that version, newer blocks will show the up to date dials. As I said, the blocks can be manually refreshed to use the new versioning or if you create a new preset and choose that reverb, the new controls will be revealed. However, in some cases, I prefer the preset with the older blocks. ffs.
You can even copy an old reverb block and paste it to a new preset and then it's back on the old parameters. It's mind numbing and the only product that I know that does this.

Like I said, this is my biggest gripe.
For those that create simple presets and/or only maintain a few core sounds that might not seem like a big deal.
Some people just use an amp and cab block. For me, I use kitchen sink presets mostly that are fully populated with multiple phasers, reverbs, chorus, pitch, amps... In the end, I have no available preset slots so revamping 1024 presets is a lot of fun. I spend more time f'ing around than anything else. Not to forget every new firmware update might have a new bug that will need fixing. For those that actually sell presets, I can only imagine how they try to keep up with things for their customers.

This is the underlying reason why I rank the Fractal behind the QC and the Kemper. I would categorize this as an 'ease of use' problem.

Since this is a heavily trafficked forum for Fractal users, I'll expect they'll cry out to defend their product. I've owned all of the platforms and I'm just casting my opinion. I currently still have an FM9 and AXE3 but after upgrading to 27 I saw no real benefit so I downgraded back to FW25.

 

[Orvillain]

This whole thing is entirely subjective really. I can't fathom how people still regard Kemper as a competitor. It sounded shit in 2015, let alone almost 2025 !!

And I've already been through the "random forumer trying to get me fired for the way I talk online" nonsense. People are...

 

[luckymethod]

So, I recently made a ranking video in which I ranked all the hardware modelers that I own and it was a lot of fun. However, since then some things have changed and I wanted to do an update and see how my ranking would be now. Of course this is VERY subjective and everyone will disagree and I actually encourage that because all of these devices do things well nowadays, none of them are BAD. And we all use them differently. So I'd be curious to know how you disagree (or agree) with my list and why. :)



And I have to echo this but nowadays ALL modelers are pretty amazing! It's just that some are better than others...

Tedious engagement bait. Unsubscribe.

 

[JiveTurkey]

Tedious engagement bait. Unsubscribe.

 

[norminal]

Tedious engagement bait. Unsubscribe.

 

[Digital Igloo]

For years I’ve heard persistent rumors that the POD 2.0 was used for portions of White Pony. Has L6 ever considered modeling the POD??

Less modeling and more converting the assembly code, but yes, briefly, because a few artists have been bugging us about it for years.

I took your listening blind test after the Helix came out, and I was right 70% of the time, about what was the real amp

Congrats! IIRC, the real amp was correctly guessed exactly 49.5% of the time, which is about as successful a shootout as we could've hoped for.

I do remember a couple people claiming they got higher scores than they actually did. We may or may not have been able to see the data for logged in users.

 

[OneEng]

Ok, I will willingly concede that there are many instances of people using Helix live (vs just Kemper and Fractal Axe III Fx); however, I would also say (as another posted pointed out) that through countless shootouts of the top high end digital amps, Helix generally brings up the rear. Personally, when I hear the "real thing", Kemper, Axe III Fx, and Helix, in a blind listening test, I can most reliably pick out the Helix as being the weakest of the bunch.

Interestingly, my preference for the other 3 is split. Just goes to show you how close (and good) Kemper and Helix sounds are to the real deal.

What I would say is that no serious band guitarist would use a 2 or 3 footswitch pedal live..... this is true no matter who makes it.

Also, with respect to the comment on gigging players not wanting a rack mount unit, it is actually by far and away the preference of most professionals (and certainly my own). There are many reasons:

• Frequent gigging requires robust transportation of your digital equipment. Only a good rack can provide this.
• A rack stacks nicely with other rack gear on stage (or off stage).
• A rack with an external foot controller is IDEAL for gigging as it allows you to get all the cables (except one) routed to the rack ..... away from your gigging position. This leaves your gigging area blessedly free of clutter.

All that being said, I would be mostly happy with a full sized Helix, but I would miss my Kemper's "feel" and low to medium gain tones.

 

[paisleywookiee]

Also, with respect to the comment on gigging players not wanting a rack mount unit, it is actually by far and away the preference of most professionals (and certainly my own). There are many reasons:

Where did you get these metrics?

 

[Orvillain]

Where did you get these metrics?

Pulled it out of his knobflap.

 

[likitlikeyoulikeit]

Pulled it out of his knobflap.

 

[Orvillain]

With the Kemper, I've made about 400 profiles over the years. Was planning on selling them, but then the evil mega-corp I work for told me I wasn't allowed. But I was able to tell the difference between the real amp and the Kemper, the majority of the time. I even made this video showing my experience:


The Kemperite response is one of a few things:
1. Differences don't matter. MUHHH MIXXXXX!!!
2. The profile sounds better than the real amp. LULZ!!!!!
3. YOU DID IT WRONG!! MY PROFILES COME OUT EXACTLY THE SAME!! (yeah well, you've got fucking pigshit ears then pal!)

Out of all of the modellers/profilers on the market, the Kemper is the one I've owned the most. I bought the fucking thing 6 times. Since 2011 I've spent way more on Kemper than I ever did on Fractal!!! None of them lasted longer than year, and I'm a fucking idiot for going back to see if the world is different. They even very nearly got me with the liquid profiling!!!

I'm much more likely to get another QC than a Kemper at this point. Solely based on the fact that with the QC you can run multiple captures in a single preset.

In 2024, the Kemper is a terrible value proposition. IMHO.