5153 50w EL34 - Better/Worse than 6L6/Stealth?

[GreatGreen]

And no disrespect to Great Green but the Stealth has more gain on the blue channel. Not a ton, but enough so for me to call it significant.

I disagree, friend. I had two Stealth 50's in my studio and my 50w 6L6 v2 on an amp switcher and to my ears, the Blue channel had the same amount of gain on tap across all three amps, as did the Red channel across all three amps.

Maybe the amps I had around and the amps you tested were just different enough, or the tubes were just different enough, for it to make a difference. Maybe a factory revision was made and we played different revisions. I can't say you didn't hear something you claim to have heard. But we can agree to have had differing experiences.

I suppose the message there is "buyer beware" lol.

 

[deadpool_25]

I disagree, friend. I had two Stealth 50's in my studio and my 50w 6L6 v2 on an amp switcher and to my ears, the Blue channel had the same amount of gain on tap across all three amps, as did the Red channel across all three amps.

Maybe the amps I had around and the amps you tested were just different enough, or the tubes were just different enough, for it to make a difference. Maybe a factory revision was made and we played different revisions. I can't say you didn't hear something you claim to have heard. But we can agree to have had differing experiences.

I suppose the message there is "buyer beware" lol.

Yeah it's interesting. I was directly a/b'ing as well using an aby pedal. And I felt like not only was the gain different, but the "voice" was slightly different too although I couldn't quantify it even back then, let alone after having sold all three versions off lol.

For anyone paying attention, I'll say all of these amps are fantastic and I don't think you can go wrong with any of them. I'll caveat that by saying the blue channel on the EL34 is MUCH different. Whether you like that difference is very subjective. Some people love it and some absolutely hate it. The good thing is that it's easily modified (even mentioned by Howard Kaplan on Tone-Talk) to bring it in line with the rest of the series.

 

[GreatGreen]

Yeah it's interesting. I was directly a/b'ing as well using an aby pedal. And I felt like not only was the gain different, but the "voice" was slightly different too although I couldn't quantify it even back then, let alone after having sold all three versions off lol.

For anyone paying attention, I'll say all of these amps are fantastic and I don't think you can go wrong with any of them. I'll caveat that by saying the blue channel on the EL34 is MUCH different. Whether you like that difference is very subjective. Some people love it and some absolutely hate it. The good thing is that it's easily modified (even mentioned by Howard Kaplan on Tone-Talk) to bring it in line with the rest of the series.

Did your 50w standard 6L6 have the concentric pots or was it an original version?

edit: Totally agree they're all fantastic amps either way.

 

[spawnofthesith]

I’ve heard pretty widespread reports of the stealth having more gain, and I believe it’s advertised as being tweaked… would be sheisty af if they were jacking the price up like that for a simple cosmetic change


That said, I can’t imagine needing any more gain than what the 6l6 offers lol

 

[deadpool_25]

Did your 50w standard 6L6 have the concentric pots or was it an original version?

I had the original version many years ago and sold it because the volume jump between green and blue was too much. More recently I had the concentric knob version.

 

[GreatGreen]

I had the original version many years ago and sold it because the volume jump between green and blue was too much. More recently I had the concentric knob version.

Gotcha. I did my comparisons with the concentric knob version.

 

[maddnotez]

Seems like I'll disagree with most here with confusion.

The 5150iii 50w EL34 is incredible. I play death metal and brutal stuff and it's definitely a top 5 amp for me.

I do prefer 100w typically but my friend has a stealth and id take the el34 over it any day without question.

I dont really care about the volume issues or modding or what not. Im going straight to the red channel for the brutal stuff and it is a killer amp.

 

[deadpool_25]

Seems like I'll disagree with most here with confusion.

The 5150iii 50w EL34 is incredible. I play death metal and brutal stuff and it's definitely a top 5 amp for me.

I do prefer 100w typically but my friend has a stealth and id take the el34 over it any day without question.

I dont really care about the volume issues or modding or what not. Im going straight to the red channel for the brutal stuff and it is a killer amp.

There's really no debate on the red channel. It's fantastic. There's really no debate on the green channel either as it's similar to the other green channels. The questions surround the EL34 blue channel being so significantly different than the other blue channels and even the designer has discussed how different it is.

Again though, some people love it some hate it. It's subjective. But that blue channel is objectively very different.

 

[maddnotez]

There's really no debate on the red channel. It's fantastic. There's really no debate on the green channel either as it's similar to the other green channels. The questions surround the EL34 blue channel being so significantly different than the other blue channels and even the designer has discussed how different it is.

Again though, some people love it some hate it. It's subjective. But that blue channel is objectively very different.

Yeah I definitely misread the OP.

I certainly wouldn't buy it for the blue channel at all.

 

[BahamaDada]

I certainly wouldn't buy it for the blue channel at all.

OP here. Will only shell out 900€ if all 3 channels are great.

 

[RaceU4her]

There's really no debate on the red channel. It's fantastic. There's really no debate on the green channel either as it's similar to the other green channels. The questions surround the EL34 blue channel being so significantly different than the other blue channels and even the designer has discussed how different it is.

Again though, some people love it some hate it. It's subjective. But that blue channel is objectively very different.

I thought clipping the c137 made it like the other blue channels which everyone loves.

 

[maddnotez]

OP here. Will only shell out 900€ if all 3 channels are great.

Obviously you can buy what you like but if you're looking at other 2 channel amps what difference would it make with having 3 channels with one you didn't like?

The red channel is amazing imo.

 

[Desertdweller]

As with the JVM205 combo mods for me are a big no-no.

I have nothing against them, I just don't want to do them or pay money to have them done. If it's not good in stock it's not good.

Check my post here:

Thread 'The 5150 III EL34 50 watt head C137 mod, and taming the red channel'

Feb 1, 2023

So I did a couple of mods to the 5150 III 50w EL34 a couple years ago that really make the amp quite a bit better. I posted this on another forum then, but it's a dead now so I figure why not update it and post it here?

Blue Channel C137 Mod
I have yet to hear anyone that truly likes the stock blue channel on the 50w EL34 amp, which is an absolute shame because all the other 5150 III heads have an amazing blue channel. Fender put in a fail-safe to fix this thankfully, and I'm not the first to do this simple and great mod. Simply snipping a small capacitor fixes this.

This is...

• Desertdweller
• Replies: 16
• Forum: Amps & Cabs

• 
• 
• 

It’s literally snipping the wire on one side of the C137 cap and it’s done. It’s only needed on the 50w variant, as the 100w EL34 model and all the 6L6s models are already set without a need for the mod. It’s really not the most complicated mod. The EL34 model is the Stealth, just biased for EL34s instead of 6L6s. I generally prefer 6L6s, but the EL34 version of the 5150 III is simply an awesome amp.

 

[Genghis]

I don’t mind the Blue channel on mine, but I might have a tech friend install a mini-toggle for the C137 mod and have two voicings on that channel.

Red channel is insanely over the top. Really only need it at around 9 o’clock on the gain dial, but it seems like you can get ridiculous gain that doesn’t get mushy as you go way beyond that.

Spent some time playing with both channels and I really don’t get the hate for the Blue channel. I like that it is very different than the Red channel. Sometimes I like that channel for leads as it is a bit more open sounding and looser feeling.

 

[BahamaDada]

Obviously you can buy what you like but if you're looking at other 2 channel amps what difference would it make with having 3 channels with one you didn't like?

The red channel is amazing imo.

If I pay 900€ for a head I want it to be all around good. Wouldn't you want that, too?

 

[Desertdweller]

I don’t mind the Blue channel on mine, but I might have a tech friend install a mini-toggle for the C137 mod and have two voicings on that channel.

Red channel is insanely over the top. Really only need it at around 9 o’clock on the gain dial, but it seems like you can get ridiculous gain that doesn’t get mushy as you go way beyond that.

Great idea on the toggle switch. The stock blue channel is not a useful sound to me but you're right, why not have both if you can?

For the red channel, replacing one of the tubes with a 12au7 really helps bring down the gain and makes the whole knob useful. It's way overgained otherwise.

 

[Genghis]

Great idea on the toggle switch. The stock blue channel is not a useful sound to me but you're right, why not have both if you can?

For the red channel, replacing one of the tubes with a 12au7 really helps bring down the gain and makes the whole knob useful. It's way overgained otherwise.

I am probably going to do the 12au7 as well. I did that with my old 6L6 version I had a few years ago and it helped. Thinking about getting some E34L power tubes as well, but the difference is so subtle and the tubes that are in there are still good.

 

[Orvillain]

I really like the OG 50-watt 6L6. I didn't really like the 100watt EL34S I had.

 

[Desertdweller]

I am probably going to do the 12au7 as well. I did that with my old 6L6 version I had a few years ago and it helped. Thinking about getting some E34L power tubes as well, but the difference is so subtle and the tubes that are in there are still good.

I did the E34L swap too and I didn't notice a difference, but I have a friend who did it and swears by it, so YMMV for sure.

 

[Genghis]

I did the E34L swap too and I didn't notice a difference, but I have a friend who did it and swears by it, so YMMV for sure.

I have done that with other amps and did E34L in the outer sockets of my Simulclass Mk IIC+, but it needed tubes anyway. I’m pretty sure the difference is so subtle that minor adjustments of the tone stack can get me where I want with either. I got as far as looking up the price on Eurotubes, but yesterday they were out of stock on the E34L tubes. If I just get the 12AU7 it will save me $50.