SHOW OFF YOUR PEDALBOARD!

[Sascha Franck]

Just a general observation not directed at anyone (or a board) in particular: I see what I think is pretty little loopswitchers in this thread. Why is that so? And no, it's neither a rhetoric nor a provocative question but a genuine one as in: Do you see any advances in not using a loopswitcher? I could actually think of some, but in the end, I would never run an even just slightly larger board without one.

 

[gearJunkie]

Just a general observation not directed at anyone (or a board) in particular: I see what I think is pretty little loopswitchers in this thread. Why is that so? And no, it's neither a rhetoric nor a provocative question but a genuine one as in: Do you see any advances in not using a loopswitcher? I could actually think of some, but in the end, I would never run an even just slightly larger board without one.

My main pedalboard is a Voodoo Lab Dingbat w/ PX-8+ switcher. It's simple, quiet, MIDI controllable, and extremely space efficient.

However, it is presently slightly disassembled and in the process of reconfiguration as I complete the rework of my secondary board shown in the post above yours.

I love the PX-8+ on my main board, but I don't have any issues using my secondary board without a loop switcher. There's a little more tap dancing, but that's half the fun (sometimes).

 

[dronerstone]

Just a general observation not directed at anyone (or a board) in particular: I see what I think is pretty little loopswitchers in this thread. Why is that so? And no, it's neither a rhetoric nor a provocative question but a genuine one as in: Do you see any advances in not using a loopswitcher? I could actually think of some, but in the end, I would never run an even just slightly larger board without one.

You mean multi-channel ones that will do presets etc?

My personal main reasons against something like that, while I'm sure they're convenient:

- huge
- expensive
- messy wiring (double the cables)

 

[Sascha Franck]

You mean multi-channel ones that will do presets etc?

Yes.

- huge

Not really.
On my old board, I was using a Mooer L6. Fairly small. And working very well, even if it's kinda like the cheap skater's loopswitcher.

- expensive

The Mooer is €140. I think that's very affordable.

- messy wiring (double the cables)

That's true (well, maybe not exactly double the cables in case you stack things in loops, which I did).

I do however agree that, while possibly not "huge", they take up space on your board that could otherwise either be saved (bad) or used for more pedals (good!).

But then, once everything is arranged and cabled up, the comfort is just incredible.

As an example: I developed a habit of having all my lead sounds organized that most often they're a variation of a rhythm sound. To get there, the most typical switching I'm going for 95% of all times is to add a sort of pre-boost (either a compressor or a somewhat "hairy" boost), a post-EQ (for the final lead level/frequency balance) and some spatial effect (typically delay/reverb). That'd be 3 switch taps, usually too much if all you want is to play a little fill. With a loopswitcher it's one-switch-goodness.

I also think it's easier to run a sort of hybrid setup, using either multiple (such as drives) or programmable items (such as a delay unit) in the loops, so you would preselect the sounds between songs and then be ready to go - all with the actual switch locations staying the same. For instance, looper preset 3 would always be my dirt rhythm sound, looper preset 4 would be the dirt lead tone, regardless of what I had preselected in the loops themselves. That way you don't need to remember which pedal to step on during a song.

Whatever, in case you don't need rapid switching between pretty different sounds but are more into kinda "gradually" shaping your tone, you possibly don't need a looper. Might even be counterproductive as some pedal combinations aren't easily possible anymore.

 

[dronerstone]

Yes.



Not really.
On my old board, I was using a Mooer L6. Fairly small. And working very well, even if it's kinda like the cheap skater's loopswitcher.



The Mooer is €140. I think that's very affordable.



That's true (well, maybe not exactly double the cables in case you stack things in loops, which I did).

I do however agree that, while possibly not "huge", they take up space on your board that could otherwise either be saved (bad) or used for more pedals (good!).

But then, once everything is arranged and cabled up, the comfort is just incredible.

As an example: I developed a habit of having all my lead sounds organized that most often they're a variation of a rhythm sound. To get there, the most typical switching I'm going for 95% of all times is to add a sort of pre-boost (either a compressor or a somewhat "hairy" boost), a post-EQ (for the final lead level/frequency balance) and some spatial effect (typically delay/reverb). That'd be 3 switch taps, usually too much if all you want is to play a little fill. With a loopswitcher it's one-switch-goodness.

I also think it's easier to run a sort of hybrid setup, using either multiple (such as drives) or programmable items (such as a delay unit) in the loops, so you would preselect the sounds between songs and then be ready to go - all with the actual switch locations staying the same. For instance, looper preset 3 would always be my dirt rhythm sound, looper preset 4 would be the dirt lead tone, regardless of what I had preselected in the loops themselves. That way you don't need to remember which pedal to step on during a song.

Whatever, in case you don't need rapid switching between pretty different sounds but are more into kinda "gradually" shaping your tone, you possibly don't need a looper. Might even be counterproductive as some pedal combinations aren't easily possible anymore.

Size: I'd have a rearrange the whole board, to me personally, this outweighs the benefits.

Price: I give you that, €140 is fairly affordable. I've been looking at rather expensive upper-tier ones a few years ago, compared to the Mooer you mentioned, these would've been far outside of my comfort zone (for a mere QOL tool).

Cables: I currently run a 10-pedal assembly (including a parallel loop blender) using 10 patch cables, all of them EBS Flats. Using 10 pedals in a loop switcher, without stacking, would mean 20 cables.

I see your points, although I guess it's a matter of use case, and if it makes sense for the individual rig.

If I was a touring pro and have better gear budget/resources, along with people to transport my stuff, I'd definitely consider going all-in and putting pedals in rack drawers with a huge switching device, e.g. by RJM or such.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Size: I'd have a rearrange the whole board, to me personally, this outweighs the benefits.

Yeah well, been hassling with that for my first loopswitcher board as well, especially as I always need a case along with it. Turned out to become a custom built thing, which, while ordered as a DIY kit from the local case guru, still was quite expensive. But I kept using that very case for well over 20 years by now (even my latest board incarnation is still using it).
It's also that most typical premade boards won't work well with a loopswitcher as you ideally need two levels, so the cables running out from the back of the loopswitcher could completely run below the actual board level. That's been an easy to solve thing for me, though, I just measured things out and ordered a few ready-cut casewood strips and screwed them together accordingly (cost me 20 bucks or so).

Price: I give you that, €140 is fairly affordable. I've been looking at rather expensive upper-tier ones a few years ago, compared to the Mooer you mentioned, these would've been far outside of my comfort zone (for a mere QOL tool).

To be honest, I would've prefered one of the other contenders (had an eye on the ones from Moen, which are also pretty compact, decently priced and coming with some neat functions) but was rather short on money back then, so I tried the Mooer, which worked a lot better and lived a lot longer than I had expected (had to open it once to clean it and readjust some of the springs between the outer switch and the actual switch on the PCB).

Cables: I currently run a 10-pedal assembly (including a parallel loop blender) using 10 patch cables, all of them EBS Flats. Using 10 pedals in a loop switcher, without stacking, would mean 20 cables.

Defenitely a drawback. But then, once bought, it's done - and it's not that those patch cables would cost a fortune (fwiw, the cheap HB flat ones work as well as the EBS Flats, I have both kinds - and at least in a buffered environment there's no sound difference).

If I was a touring pro and have better gear budget/resources, along with people to transport my stuff, I'd definitely consider going all-in and putting pedals in rack drawers with a huge switching device, e.g. by RJM or such.

I used to use a rack with loopswitcher(s), but ultimately, I love not having to care about a rack and an additional floor controller. Grab pedalboard and that was it - I just love it. Also, once you go for decent rack units, things become expensive quickly.

Fwiw, I wish there were more modeling and FX solutions with analog loops onboard, such as the Tone Master Pro has. Or such as the Boss MS-3, which however has only FX, no modeling, but in case there was a somewhat bigger version (let's say with 6 switches and 1-2 additional loops), I'd defenitely consider it.