Randy Rhoads Tone Tutorial??

[PLX]

That's what I was thinking, too. Something clean and high wattage. Maybe some EVs?

Something efficient (clean).

 

[la szum]

Ready for more shame and ridicule.



Been listening to Diary Of A Madman today and almost cried. Again.
What a loss.

Man, that album is so layered and lush and interesting. I just feel like
Randy doesn't get enough credit for his tones. The multi-tracking
that he used in almost a Page-esque vein was simply something
that guys like Eddie Van Halen were NOT doing. Who else was in the
Rock/Metal vein?

Maybe I find the compositions and performances so interesting that
Randy's Triple-tracked distorted guitars are just icing on the cake, versus
too much salt on the plate.

I am picking this up again and going to try and lock in some of the vibe,
even if I am not going to nail it. The journey is the destination, right?

 

[MirrorProfiles]

probably taking a dump on a few peoples cornflakes here, but I listened to some RR era Ozzy the other week for the first time since I was a teenager.

Was really surprised at how much I couldn’t tolerate the sloppy timing - so much stuff is rushing ahead of the beat and coming in early, and it gives a kind of anxious/rushed feel. I know some people will say “oh that’s part of his sound, embrace it”, but after years of tidying up sloppy guitarists in the studio, I just couldn’t stomach this. Maybe in part to how the band was assembled at the time.

Not saying he can’t play by any stretch, he was obviously a monster guitarist with an amazing style. But I wish he had his ass kicked in the studio, or at the very least, just delaying the guitars a few ms.

 

[PLX]

simply something that guys like Eddie Van Halen were NOT doing

Ed was not classically trained, like Randy.

EVH struggled in improvisational situations, when he was unfamiliar with the song he was to play over.

 

[Achilles]

Remember getting Tribute and then picking my jaw up off the floor like it was yesterday.
His speed during the Suicide Solution solo along with his choice of lines/phrasing.....

 

[TubeStack]

Meh. I’d rather listen to a rushing Randy Rhoads track than any current “tidyed up” recording.

Over-tidying and “the grid” is part of what has killed rock’n’roll, in my opinion.

 

[MirrorProfiles]

Meh. I’d rather listen to a rushing Randy Rhoads track than any current “tidyed up” recording.

Over-tidying and “the grid” is part of what has killed rock’n’roll, in my opinion.

There’s plenty of recordings made before Randy Rhodes that sound great, and plenty of current stuff that isn’t gridded that’s also great. Being gridded generally sucks, all the interesting stuff happens in the grey areas between (same with tuning). And just as with tuning, it can played tastefully or it can sound bad.

Randy Rhodes gridded would suck too, but if it was grooving in a pocket I’d find it way better than racing ahead of everyone else. Perfectly happy to accept some people might like (or not be bothered by) that sound. Just sounds bad to me, and makes me enjoy his playing less.

 

[la szum]

Ed was not classically trained, like Randy.

EVH struggled in improvisational situations, when he was unfamiliar with the song he was to play over.

Jimmy Page was not classically trained either.

No disrespect, but I don't think that had any thing to do with that.
More about it being a stylistic choice. Randy was more Brian May and Jimmy Page
(intricately layered multi-tracking approach to guitar) than he was Hollywoood or LA.

And I had not thought about it all that much until today.

 

[la szum]

There’s plenty of recordings made before Randy Rhodes that sound great, and plenty of current stuff that isn’t gridded that’s also great. Being gridded generally sucks, all the interesting stuff happens in the grey areas between (same with tuning). And just as with tuning, it can played tastefully or it can sound bad.

Randy Rhodes gridded would suck too, but if it was grooving in a pocket I’d find it way better than racing ahead of everyone else. Perfectly happy to accept some people might like (or not be bothered by) that sound. Just sounds bad to me, and makes me enjoy his playing less.

 

[TSJMajesty]

probably taking a dump on a few peoples cornflakes here, but I listened to some RR era Ozzy the other week for the first time since I was a teenager.

Was really surprised at how much I couldn’t tolerate the sloppy timing - so much stuff is rushing ahead of the beat and coming in early, and it gives a kind of anxious/rushed feel. I know some people will say “oh that’s part of his sound, embrace it”, but after years of tidying up sloppy guitarists in the studio, I just couldn’t stomach this. Maybe in part to how the band was assembled at the time.

Not saying he can’t play by any stretch, he was obviously a monster guitarist with an amazing style. But I wish he had his ass kicked in the studio, or at the very least, just delaying the guitars a few ms.

That's the thing though- it's Rock-n-Roll. It's not Classical where perfection is part of the genre. It's wild, with reckless abandon.

And I'm much more in the camp of playing accurately, personally, but with rock guitar, it's whatever goes for that player's style.

I really, really appreciate the effort and practice it takes for a player to play a certain # of notes exactly timed to a certain # of beats, especially if that player can also weave in and out of time at will, more than the ones who just go for it, can play fast, and come up with great licks. But I'd never take anything away from guys who just didn't bother getting their timing aligned to a grid either.

 

[PLX]

No disrespect, but I don't think that had any thing to do with that.

Ed was terrified of double-tracking his guitar parts (or even doing overdubs) in the early day while in the studio.

He insisted to Donn and Ted that they allow them to "just play live" like they do on stage and record them that way.

Randy was a master at it.

 

[la szum]

Meh. I’d rather listen to a rushing Randy Rhoads track than any current “tidyed up” recording.

Over-tidying and “the grid” is part of what has killed rock’n’roll, in my opinion.

I can only imagine the effort he put into it. With Pro Tools triple-tracking is a lot
easier. Tell me other guitarists who were doing that back in the day like he was??
It was innovative. Full stop.

I just don't hear him receive the credit for his production choices and how he went
about recording, layering, and arranging the guitars. It was nothing short of brilliant.

And please no one come in and Max Norman me. Max had the freedom to do it
because of who Randy was. Not like Max had an history with that kind of approach
with a wide range of players after Randy.

 

[la szum]

Ed was terrified of double-tracking his guitar parts (or even doing overdubs) in the early day while in the studio.

He insisted to Donn and Ted that they allow them to "just play live" like they do on stage and record them that way.

Randy was a master at it.

I didn't know that. Wow.

Did you ever come across anything about Eddie having Reed Light Fever in the early days.... or later on??

 

[PLX]

I can only imagine the effort he put into it. With Pro Tools triple-tracking is a lot
easier. Tell me other guitarists who were doing that back in the day like he was??
It was innovative. Full stop.

I just don't hear him receive the credit for his production choices and how he went
about recording, layering, and arranging the guitars. It was nothing short of brilliant.

And please no one come in and Max Norman me. Max had the freedom to do it
because of who Randy was. Not like Max had an history with that kind of approach
with a wide range of players after Randy.

It was all Sharon's fault.

 

[la szum]

A big thing for me is not measuring Randy with where things are now, but valuing
Randy and his approach based on what was happening at the time he did it. Think
about the time he did it.

He was like Jimmy Page, Brian May, Uli Jon Roth, Ritchie Blackmore, and Michael Schenker
rolled into one.... and then with his own personality weaving it all together.

 

[duzie]

probably taking a dump on a few peoples cornflakes here, but I listened to some RR era Ozzy the other week for the first time since I was a teenager.

Was really surprised at how much I couldn’t tolerate the sloppy timing - so much stuff is rushing ahead of the beat and coming in early, and it gives a kind of anxious/rushed feel. I know some people will say “oh that’s part of his sound, embrace it”, but after years of tidying up sloppy guitarists in the studio, I just couldn’t stomach this. Maybe in part to how the band was assembled at the time.

Not saying he can’t play by any stretch, he was obviously a monster guitarist with an amazing style. But I wish he had his ass kicked in the studio, or at the very least, just delaying the guitars a few ms.

Rhoads

 

[MirrorProfiles]

That's the thing though- it's Rock-n-Roll. It's not Classical where perfection is part of the genre. It's wild, with reckless abandon.

And I'm much more in the camp of playing accurately, personally, but with rock guitar, it's whatever goes for that player's style.

I really, really appreciate the effort and practice it takes for a player to play a certain # of notes exactly timed to a certain # of beats, especially if that player can also weave in and out of time at will, more than the ones who just go for it, can play fast, and come up with great licks. But I'd never take anything away from guys who just didn't bother getting their timing aligned to a grid either.

I wouldn’t equate playing behind the beat a bit to being gridded. There’s tons of rock n roll that’s played in the pocket and punches hard and tight as a result. And wild/chaotic music can still sound that way if it’s not rushing ahead.

The last time I saw Metallica (a good few years ago now), they sounded like a cover band of themselves. Alice in Chains were on the bill earlier in the day and sounded incredibly tight and massive, and Metallica was just a huge let down performance wise (especially when you consider how well they CAN play, how many gigs they play a year, how long they’ve played together, place on the bill etc). When everything locks in and punches together, it puts a smile on my face. When things are all over the place, I just can’t focus on the music enough.

I can only imagine the effort he put into it. With Pro Tools triple-tracking is a lot
easier. Tell me other guitarists who were doing that back in the day like he was??
It was innovative. Full stop.

I’m sure RR would have been perfectly capable of tighter takes, I just don’t think what they decided to run with sounded very good. History tells me I’m in the wrong, his legacy is more than cemented.

But I think at the time, it would have been a lot more of a new sound and expectations would have been different. Metal has evolved to become heavier, tighter, faster, more technical. Something may have been lost along the way, but I don’t really see anyone wanting to sound rushed like that in the future. I found it interesting to listen to now, because I definitely wouldn’t have noticed as a 15 year old kid being blown away by it.

But yeah, the production had an interesting sound, and as much as they aren’t tones I particularly like, it gives a distinctive, original and bold sound that people aren’t brave enough to shoot for any more. I wish people took more chances and tried to sound distinctive. Same could be said of Pantera - no one is really brave enough to go for such a distinctive guitar tone in that way.

 

[LeftyLoungeLizard]

Check out my YT vid on his tone on Blizzard. It's 6 years old but still very much relevant.

 

[PLX]

Randy was like what would happen if Leslie West and Yngwie Malmsteen had a baby.

 

[la szum]

The intro to Diary Of A Madman (song) is cool precisely because it is played loose
and not in some artificially imposed division of "time."

In Classical music I believe the Latin term for it is Rubato, or Ad Libitum. Speeding
up and slowing down could be used intentionally to give music a sense of urgency,
or contrarily, a sense of pause and hesitation.

As a lot of you probably know Classical Music Composers would also write moods or
feelings into their compositions. That would be changes in ways of playing, or alterations in
one's sense of urgency or repose.