Picking a new amp challenge: Engl Artist vs Marshall JVM410 (all ideas welcomed)

[krankenstein]

Hey people, hope everyone is having fun!

I'm kinda new in the forum, I was more like a reader than writer but for my last matter I wanted to ask you guys/girls your opinion.

I have an ENGL Fireball 100 and ENGL 2x12 pro cab (2x V30). I love the combination, I get awesome modern metal tones. I only play in my room so engl has amazing performance even at really really low volumes.

But I'm a big Iron Maiden fan, I enjoy a lot playing their songs; the trooper, afraid to shoot strangers, fear of the dark, prodigal son you name it, I love them all rhythm to solo.

Fireball is missing that vibe. Maybe I'm not too good with tweaking the knobs but I don't think I'll get classic iron maiden tones from modern voiced preamp powered with 6l6 tubes.

And there the problem starts, which amp? EL34 seems a must, and iron maiden uses different marshall amps. I can go with reissued jcm800 or reissued 20w version but both of them get a lot benefit from power tubes, I really cannot make them loud so they are not an option. I came up with 3 options Engl artist blackout (100w), Marshall Dsl100, Marshall Jvm410

Important notice: I'm planning to play them stereo as well. I will split my guitar signal in to 2 amps. And each amp will drive 4x12 cab. Fireball will drive the bottom cab because it will have more bass than the new amp. Some may say it will be overkill for apartment but YOLO.

Option 1:
ENGL Artist Blackout

Pure beauty. I trust ENGL quality a lot too. Fireball is very quiet and clear amp even tho it's a high gain beast, I believe artist edition is no different. It has EL34 tubes and most marshall-ish ENGL according to people on internet. 200 euros more expensive than JVM (I live in Europe).

Pros: it will look soo good when I stack with my fireball. And if I go with blackout I'll order paired 4x12 engl pro cabs (V30). Nothing beats power of a full stack.
Cons: not sure if i can get better iron maiden tones than other marshalls. V30 is not the best speaker for iron maiden tones either. Expensive than JVM.

Option 2:
Marshall JVM410

Heard good things about this amp. People claimed that it has also very good master volume and sounds good at lower volumes. I'm not sure if I'll use all the channels but you'll never know. Each channel has its own eq. Lots of tonal options, has built in reverb (I like reverb). One bad thing I noticed from YouTube videos is that it's too noisy. If I get this one I have to buy a noise gate.

Pros: foot switch included, built in reverb, separate eq, different modes at each channel, cool lead tones from what I heard. I'm sure it will handle iron maiden. If I order this amp I'll order Marshall 4x12 celestion g12h30 loaded 1960BHW cab. It will fit to iron maiden more than v30s. I will have something different than what I have atm, if I get bored I can mix V30 and g12h30 in the marshall cab with x pattern. Cheaper than artist edition.
Cons: Noisy. It won't look too good when I stack marshall 4x12 and jvm410 with engl 2x12 cab and engl head.

But besides all, if I can move to bigger house with bigger rooms instead of stacking marshall and engl and all cabs, I can make it full stack engl and full stack marshall next to it. It will take more time and more money but probably will worth it.

My guitars are: Jackson pro series fusion professional (1991, made in Japan)
Jackson pro series DK2 (2008, made in Japan)
I'm also planning to get one Mexican Charvel strat with either ebony or maple fretboard.

So what you guys think? Should I get engl artist for ultimate look, or should I get marshall. But again the main task is jamming with iron maiden songs.

Thank you for reading this long post! Can't wait to listen your opinions. Keep rocking!

(Credits: I got all the pictures except the first one from Thomann and they have all the rights or what so ever.)

 

[TheTrueZoltan!]

Hey Krankenstein, welcome to the forum! First, let me ask you the traditional TGF new member question: Dill pickles or sweet pickles?

I had an Engl Artist Edition 50. Great amp, can be a bit scooped and bright, but I loved it. It does sound very British if you push it slightly into power amp saturation (in my case 11 o’clock was the sweet spot) and raise the Mids to approximately 2 o‘clock, but if you dial back the Mids and Master it can even achieve a convincing Mesa Mark-like sound. I’d say it’s very versatile. It has an onboard noise gate but you probably won‘t even need it - the AE is one of the least noisy amps I‘ve ever tried. Compared to the Fireball it‘s a little bit less saturated, less low-mid heavy & dark, more percussive & dynamic. Sold it because I wanted to go completely in-the-box with plugins.

I had a JVM, too. OD2 Orange is very close to my personal dream tone, but the amp was so horribly noisy, I just couldn‘t stand it and sent it back.

I actually just sold my digital modeler (again) and am 99% sure to order another Artist Edition 50 within the next few days. I want it back.

 

[krankenstein]

I can't stand with noise either, but the tone is soo good that makes you have one, I don't know if noise gate helps without sacrificing the tone. And with the engl, if I set master around 11 I must set preamp volume very low in order to tame the loudness. Also; if I pick engl I'll pick engl V30 loaded cab. I'm not getting closer to an iron maiden tones. I can later change the speakers but I'm lazy for trading stuff online so I'd rather have the correct piece of gear at first.

Any other amp recommendations? Aux in, headphone out etc are good additions for headphone jamming. I enjoyed the most with my Blackstar ht1r combo to be honest. I just put there music and didn't use anything else. Maybe I can buy again one of those. Very cheap when buy second hand.

Or maybe smaller Marshalls like dsl1 for example? Id still want blackout tho.

 

[krankenstein]

Hey Krankenstein, welcome to the forum! First, let me ask you the traditional TGF new member question: Dill pickles or sweet pickles?

I had an Engl Artist Edition 50. Great amp, can be a bit scooped and bright, but I loved it. It does sound very British if you push it slightly into power amp saturation (in my case 11 o’clock was the sweet spot) and raise the Mids to approximately 2 o‘clock, but if you dial back the Mids and Master it can even achieve a convincing Mesa Mark-like sound. I’d say it’s very versatile. It has an onboard noise gate but you probably won‘t even need it - the AE is one of the least noisy amps I‘ve ever tried. Compared to the Fireball it‘s a little bit less saturated, less low-mid heavy & dark, more percussive & dynamic. Sold it because I wanted to go completely in-the-box with plugins.

I had a JVM, too. OD2 Orange is very close to my personal dream tone, but the amp was so horribly noisy, I just couldn‘t stand it and sent it back.

I actually just sold my digital modeler (again) and am 99% sure to order another Artist Edition 50 within the next few days. I want it back.

Thank you for the warm welcoming btw! I will choose salty, crispy and sour pickles! Better if pickled with garlic and hot chili.

 

[TheTrueZoltan!]

For your use case I would actually recommend the 20W Marshall JCM800 Studio (SC20H).

 

[krankenstein]

For your use case I would actually recommend the 20W Marshall JCM800 Studio (SC20H).

Many said it's still too loud. I will check it again but I remember that It doesn't have master volume. Maybe with attenuator? What do you think about the cabs and speakers?

Edit: it has a master volume.
I added in to the poll.

 

[RaceU4her]

I would get a Marshall or any cab with T75s, and for amps I’d rather have a few smaller amps like the dsl20 and 20w 6505 than one 100w for home use

 

[TheTrueZoltan!]

Many said it's still too loud. I will check it again but I remember that It doesn't have master volume. Maybe with attenuator? What do you think about the cabs and speakers?

Unlike the 20W Plexi (SV20H) the 20W JCM800 (SC20H) does have a Master Volume control. I honestly think that‘s your safest bet for a NWOBHM tone with a volume that‘s bedroom-manageable. ;-)

A 2x12 Cab with Greenbacks should be fine!

 

[krankenstein]

I would get a Marshall or any cab with T75s, and for amps I’d rather have a few smaller amps like the dsl20 and 20w 6505 than one 100w for home use

I was thinking the same until having 100watt tube amp sounding much much better than many smaller 1-5 watt amps at lower volumes. Plus better EQ response and huge headroom. Didn't like the DSL tones (Tried 1 20 and 40w) sounded muddy when i tried, I didn't boost with any od pedal tho. T75 are fine when paired with different speakers but gotta choose something wouldn't bother my ears. Greenbacks maybe? Or g12 65

 

[TheTrueZoltan!]

„Huge headroom“ is actually exactly what you do not want in a bedroom setting. For a NWOBHM tone you‘ll need a little bit of power amp saturation compared to just the pre-amp distortion of a more modern sound. If you want to achieve that at bedroom level, you‘ll want less headroom not more. That‘s why I‘d recommend you the less-headroom-version of the JCM800, the SC20H.

Boss SD-1 into Marshall JCM800 is the sound:

 

[RaceU4her]

Yeah, headroom is a band scenario problem. I’m sure the bigger versions sound better than the smaller ones but even still I’d take the variety for home use. Even before that though, I’d probably just buy a few pedals or preamps and use the loop of the engl, there’s so many great standalone units now

 

[krankenstein]

To me it depends, I had many amps that they were loud but sounding boxy, wasn't filling the room. Fireball is ok with that, quiet but still pushing enough air to fill the room, so huge headroom if you allow to. But ofc I'm talking about riffing with fireball, it's nothing to do with the British metal, that's why I'm looking for another gear for my collection.

 

[krankenstein]

Yeah, headroom is a band scenario problem. I’m sure the bigger versions sound better than the smaller ones but even still I’d take the variety for home use. Even before that though, I’d probably just buy a few pedals or preamps and use the loop of the engl, there’s so many great standalone units now

Different preamps on the loop is good idea, but I'd still miss el34 Poweramp, maybe that would be an option if I had blackouts

@TheTrueZoltan!

I like Euge a lot, I usually buy something after watching his videos. Somehow I missed this one. Maxon od 808 was on my list but I think I'll change it with boss, I have one ts9 clone pedal already I'd try with that one first.

I think sc20h sounds more of an option for my case. If it's too loud I'd get a good attenuator because it's much cheaper than blackout and jvm

 

[Whizzinby]

Personally I’d buy the JVM, but the SC20 makes sense and saves a few bucks.

Fellow Fireball owner.

 

[TheTrueZoltan!]

I‘m glad that we could help!

 

[hemmelight]

Another +1 for the 20-watt JCM800! I played one for the first time this weekend and it surprised me. Sounds like an 800, but at a usable volume.

It was the combo version (not the head). I was afraid the small speaker and cabinet would be really boxy and lame, but it was surprisingly good. Rather have the head and use my own cab, though. The 20 watt mode sounded best of course, but the 5 watt setting was totally usable and still fun. Either mode at low volume sounded thinner than if you really pushed the Master, but that's to be expected. I wouldn't be unhappy to use that as my main home amp.

This shop also had the SV20 combo (the Plexi) so I tried it afterwards out of curiosity. It was effectively unusable due to the sheer volume. Complete waste of time for a home player unless you want to use an attenuator or load box. ....ooor you live in the country and have no neighbours.

 

[krankenstein]

Personally I’d buy the JVM, but the SC20 makes sense and saves a few bucks.

Fellow Fireball owner.

If I had no fireball I'd go with JVM for sure, but I have my modern hi hain beast there. Now I just want iron maiden tones.

@TheTrueZoltan! Ikr! I was just staring at results and i was like... Well..?



I added mxr distortion plus and boss super overdrive sd1 to my wishlist, actually I will also add maxon od808 as booster, I can use it with my fireball too. So

Guitar signal > Maxon 808 (if I feel like pushing more) > mxr dist+ or sd1 > jcm800. For loop I will check some chorus, phaser and delay pedals (maybe one spring reverb), but they are not necessary *yet*.

What about cabs people? 4x12 or 2x12? T75 or greenbacks, g12h30, 65... OR reactive load boxes. Have not too much idea about IRs or load boxes, id love it if it lets me plug headphones. But I want full experience and full sound. I already have 2x12 cab and feel like I want 4x12. If I get 8 ohm 2x12 I can pair with my engl as well for fun

 

[krankenstein]

Another +1 for the 20-watt JCM800! I played one for the first time this weekend and it surprised me. Sounds like an 800, but at a usable volume.

It was the combo version (not the head). I was afraid the small speaker and cabinet would be really boxy and lame, but it was surprisingly good. Rather have the head and use my own cab, though. The 20 watt mode sounded best of course, but the 5 watt setting was totally usable and still fun. Either mode at low volume sounded thinner than if you really pushed the Master, but that's to be expected. I wouldn't be unhappy to use that as my main home amp.

This shop also had the SV20 combo (the Plexi) so I tried it afterwards out of curiosity. It was effectively unusable due to the sheer volume. Complete waste of time for a home player unless you want to use an attenuator or load box. ....ooor you live in the country and have no neighbours.

I don't like combos, they kill all the potential of the amp imo. But thank you for sharing your experience. I'll check few stores if they have jcm studio and go to try them. 5 watt somehow looks good on paper but last time when I tried peavey 6505mh it sounded crappy at 5 watts and shined at 20 watts, probably will be same with any other.

 

[HotRats]

I've recently bought the 20W jubilee and is really good and works great at home.
I owned and loved the 100W jubilee and I get the same tone/vibe at more manageable levels.

Therefore my vote goes to the SC20H because I'm sure will deliver what you're looking for.

 

[krankenstein]

I've recently bought the 20W jubilee and is really good and works great at home.
I owned and loved the 100W jubilee and I get the same tone/vibe at more manageable levels.

Therefore my vote goes to the SC20H because I'm sure will deliver what you're looking for.

Thank you for the vote. You guys are making the decision easier. What cabs/speakers you're using with your jubilee btw?

Enjoy your new gear!