Need some advice/recommendations. At home mixing

Ledvedder

Roadie
Messages
101
I'm looking for some advice or recommendations. I currently mix with a pair of Kali Audio LP-6, https://www.sweetwater.com/store/de...lp-6-v2-6.5-inch-powered-studio-monitor-black. I also use Beyer Dynamic DT 240 Pro headphones. https://north-america.beyerdynamic.com/p/dt-240-pro.

Last night, I realized that the bass frequencies tend to get lost when I'm using the monitors. Should I spend my money on a sub? I'm looking at the Kali Audio Ws-6.2, https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/WS62Sub--kali-audio-ws-6.2-dual-6.5-inch-powered-subwoofer . Would that help out? Or should I use that budget for a headphone upgrade?

For context, my monitors are mounted to the wall about 4-5 feet apart and pointed directly at my head. These are the mounts, https://a.co/d/0AYWXCH.
 
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Do you have photos of your room? what’s the intended goal?

If it’s for creating music in any kind of professional capacity, I’d recommend proper stands and some room treatment (particularly a deep cloud and dee panels at first reflection points). Good stands are surprisingly difficult to make, but you have to be careful with cheaper ones that they aren’t totally neutering your low end or making your speakers perform weirdly.

With proper placement and some treatment, your low end should be in a better place and I’d only really consider a sub from there. Setting up a sub correctly is a bit fiddly to do well and it may well just be adding more problems to the situation. If you’re just after a fun listening experience, I won’t talk you out of it.

I can also recommend consulting an acoustician - you can spend maybe $200-300 and get STRAIGHT to the most optimal results for your budget, cutting out all the experimenting, self doubt, adjusting etc. I wish I did that sooner - it would have saved me so much money, time and stress in the long run.
 
It's just in a corner of my finished basement. I'm just doing this as a hobby. I'm primarily a weekend warrior guitarist that plays in bar cover bands. I've always been interested in sound and mixing, so I've been spending a lot of time learning the craft. But just for my own amusement, nothing professionally. I figured, since I also practice my music in the same space (using a Fractal FM3), I could benefit from a but of an equipment upgrade.
 
It's just in a corner of my finished basement. I'm just doing this as a hobby. I'm primarily a weekend warrior guitarist that plays in bar cover bands. I've always been interested in sound and mixing, so I've been spending a lot of time learning the craft. But just for my own amusement, nothing professionally. I figured, since I also practice my music in the same space (using a Fractal FM3), I could benefit from a but of an equipment upgrade.
I’d still recommend some acoustic panels as a starting point. They’re unbelievably easy to make DIY, or you can buy premade ones.

A few of them in the most effective places will help you make better decisions and faster and allows you to make decisions with confidence.


The 50hz 22cm deep panels are pretty ideal, you can make your own like that. Roxul Safe N Sound is perfect insulation to use. Youtube has lots of videos showing how to build and apply the fabric.

For stands, the budget choice would be concrete cinderblocks. They can be a bit of a pain to move though, but you can’t argue with the price. Ultimate Support MS-90’s are reasonable enough. Spending more is probably a big ask for Kali’s, but good stands can last you for life.

Headphones are a bit of a can of worms. You really have to find what works for you personally. Some people are able to do pretty good work on just headphones but I wouldn’t recommend that route.
 
id dissuede you from buying a sub. its not easy to integrate and if you can't tell whats going on now, dont compound that with another crossover. believe me.

really, the process goes like this: mix, export, play on other known systems. repeat until you trust your ears/monitors. theres not really a shortcut. and if you buy new monitors? you start again.

headphones really help with reality checking, but have their own set of issues. listen on them to listen to ALL music for a while and learn THEM intimately.

the only way forward is through, tbh. it doesnt get less hard- your ears and discernment get better.

measurement definitely cuts out a lot of legwork- but most folks not doing it for a living haveta do without. read up on how to set your monitors up, keep volumes down, and sit close.
 
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Get a Sub. You aren't a Pro and are not opening a studio. Enjoy the experience. A Sub
can make it more enjoyable and fun. You can also turn them off and on to compare
and contrast. It's a useful tool.

It'll also open up your monitors a bit by utilizing that crossover so you are not eating up
headroom in them by forcing as much low-end through them as they can handle.

Oh, and the link you posted is not a Sub. :idk
 
if given the choice, i think if its six bills for a sub and five for your monitors, id rather invest 1100 bucks in a single pair of monitors- though i really think you could achieve the same thing with a well placed set of 8"ers like hs8s on stands, a good set of cans like hd600 series and a beefy headphone amp and net more translatable results.

the one thing i gotta say though is regardless- you still haveta learn whatever your speaks are, and to trust what theyre unleashing on the world is accurate to 'every' system, and you could spend $10k on monitors and still have that process.
 
The sub can be nice to have. I run one along with a pair of HS7 monitors. I also run an ARC Studio unit with them so when I am mixing I can turn that on and get a flatter sound. I like the extra bass for other things I do on that system. When it matters I turn on the ARC. It lets me simulate a few other listening scenarios as well.

Buying monitors can get involved. You need to consider your space and you can wrap a lot of money up into a good set. I don't think I would want mine mounted to the wall. That is adding a connection to something that can alter the sound.
 
Room treatment first.
If you have the space, get your speakers away from the walls.
If you get a sub, make sure you can turn it on/off easily to compare with and without it mixes.
Listen to your mixes on as many different speakers/rooms as possible.
Don't trust your headphones.
Often, whatever the problem is with your room/monitors, your mixes will have just the opposite problem. As a simplified example, say a mix environment generates a lot of extra low end. When mixing you might turn down that low end to make it sound 'right'. But then on other speakers it will not have enough low end. Does that make sense?
 
get your speakers away from the walls.
I agree with almost everything else but I disagree here, you want the speakers as close to the wall as possible. Ideal would be flush mounted so they behave as close to infinite baffle as possible. On stands close to the wall is the next best thing. It moves SBIR into a more directional frequency range, improves the efficiency of the drivers (therefore less distortion), the phase of the reflected energy of the low end will be more in time with the direct sound. Plus you have more space in the room, and can be sat further from the rear wall.

If you get a sub, make sure you can turn it on/off easily to compare with and without it mixes.
also disagree here. A well integrated sub shouldn’t be obvious that it’s on in the first place. It should just sound like a total cohesive system.
 
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also disagree here. A well integrated sub shouldn’t be obvious that it’s on in the first place. It should just sound like a total cohesive system.
In a pro system yes, but the original poster said he's a hobbyist doing this in his basement.
 
Room treatment will probably give you the best results but for us “bedroom warriors” it’s not always an option. I added a sub to my setup and I’m quite happy with how it turned out. I will say, this isn’t necessarily a plug and play endeavor though, I did a lot of research into this and the best takeaway I got was that when it is engaged, it shouldn’t necessarily be really noticeable.

You want it to help fill out the sound spectrum, not over power it. If you do go the sub route, I would recommend one that is footswitchable. This helped me dial it in a lot more precisely and the option to have it on or off for mixing or critical listening is invaluable.

One thing I would recommend for better mixes in a less than ideal environment is using reference tracks. Having a track that is your ideal mix target will help you learn and adapt to what is going on in your mixes and can help with giving you a better balance over all, with (hopefully) less trial and error.
 
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My Dad gave me a Klipsch 12" sub today. I hooked it up to my DAW with Kali LP-8's through the interface's output 3 and 4. I added a sub buss in the daw with sends from the Superior Drummer track and bass track and added low pass/EQ and compressors. I tightened the boominess even more by adjusting the envelope time on the kick and toms in Superior. A lot of fun to play bass through and the kicks and floor toms are slammin'.
 
Room treatment first (even for hobbyist if you want even a small amount of accuracy) good headphones and a crossover plugin second (Slate VsX is great), then more room treatment, then better monitors then and only then a sub 😎
 
Set up along the longest wall in the room. Have at least 40cm of air behind the speakers. Unless they are suitable for soffit mounting like my Tannoys.
I use a huge thick throw, tacked to the wall behind as dampening. With all walls covered similarly.
With a carpeted floor, you won’t need bass-traps so much if you have the walls covered.
It’s good enough, unless mastering for a living.
With speakers like yours, you should be aiming at mixing flat, so it translates to all other mediums. To do that, you have to train the ears to listen flat. An hour in nature every day is a good start. I don’t mean a naturist camp. Sit in the woods and just listen. If any strange men come up to you, rubbing their groins - just tell them you’re busy working!
So long as you can hear the bass notes, then that is enough - although I suspect you might be throwing the kitchen sink at that bottom-end.
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As you can see, I don’t sit directly in front of my speakers. I do however, sit in the perfect sweet-spot.
For mixing, I do that on my iPad, around the house, with remote software apps - whilst the main DAW is visually on my big monitor.
All pics are before I tacked up my throws etc.
I also have a huge golfing umbrella above me, with bits of foam on it - and I close the curtains for mixing.
Not squeaky professional, but my experience and ears take me a long way.
I seldom EQ anything before I get to the stage where I am concentrating on image depth and space.
Then EQ, compression, and reverb are my ‘proximity’ tools, more than correction devices. And all my sounds to this point are as untouched and natural as they can be.
My experience allows me to track well, and I aim purely for dynamic-range and detail.

Btw. Headphones are purely isolation devices for tracking to prevent overspill of monitor mixes to mics - nothing else.
Don’t be told otherwise.
A pair of 400ohm DT100’s gets the job done.
Any thoughts of mixing your masterpiece on Sennheiser HD600’s with correction software and psycho-acoustic apps emulating famous studios - all that is just spurious expense and good for nothing else except some retail gratification for 10 minutes. A distraction from the real quest - which is to train the expectations of your own ears.

Hence the woods. Birds, animals, leaves rustling in the wind, running water - none of it has EQ on it, or a personal PA system with their own custom response curve. It just is what it is - vibrant, alive, and REAL.
Then you get home, and if your arse is still intact, you can aspire to a soundscape of equal bristling excitement, where everything co-exists, and everything has relevance in that aural image you create.
 
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Get the sub.

It will be a much more enjoyable experience for a hobbyist like yourself.

Use the sub's crossover for the mains and utilize the bypass switch

If you enjoy the process and learn your setup, you can worry about room treatment down the road
 
Rubbish.
Treat the room, or at least the immediate area, and train your ears to work flat.
Always aim for getting all the info across, and getting all events to sit nicely in a seductive audio panorama.

Sooner, rather than later - you will realise that the £180 active shit-boxes are your weak link.
My advice then, is to find a cheap pair of Tannoy System 10 DMT mk2.
 
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The issue with this topic is you'll get a different answer from absolutely everyone. Even professionals will have their own favoured approach. The stuff here is very easy to tackle though:

Set up along the longest wall in the room
No, set up along the shortest wall. You want the rear wall further away from you as the reflections from there will cause more problems if it's closer.

Have at least 40cm of air behind the speakers
No, speakers as close as possible to the wall. Use the proximity of the wall to your advantage and deal with the worst influence of SBIR. Moving them away makes SBIR more of an issue, and makes the phase of the reflections more out of time with the direct signal.
I use a huge thick throw, tacked to the wall behind as dampening. With all walls covered similarly.
This will do absolutely nothing for the low end which is always going to be the biggest issue in a room. You'll dampen some top end but it's wasting the space that could be used to deal with the low end.

With a carpeted floor, you won’t need bass-traps so much if you have the walls covered.
Absolutely incorrect. Carpet will do nothing to low end, it's way too thin. Even to absorb below 100hz you need impractical depths of absorption (like several feet). And thats assuming you're using the right materials, which carpet is not. Carpet will only affect the high frequencies, and honestly, not by a ton. It'll mostly affect how the room feels to be in.
 
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