Line 6 Helix Stadium Talk

[Sascha Franck]

Dan; it's time to break that cycle!

I would agree on that - but I can perfectly understand people accustomed to other ideas. It's never been for me, though - I'm a "get the most out of a little amount of core tones" guy at heart (started because I was kinda forced into it, now I absolutely enjoy it).

And ftr, the vast majority of things I'm playing is "functional" stuff (but I'm not even using dedicated patches for that weird ABBA tribute band I'm in), hence anything from jazzy cleans to kinda classic rock tones.

I can cover most of that with just 4 tones: clean, dirt and lead variations of it (plus one dedicated acoustic patch in case I bring one). I do add: Some dirt boxes for a different flavour and to beef things up (doesn't matter much whether they're analog pedals or virtual ones), some kinda lush echo-y stuff for swells and what not and the ocassional modulation (I usually have a phaser and slow flanger for cleans and a uvibe-y thing and a tremolo for dirts).

All of this (minus the acoustic patch) was easily possibly within one kitchen sink kinda preset within the OG Floor.

And well, apart from such a thing being easy to maintain, IMO it also offers further advances:
- No drastic change in playing feel. I learned to hate that when I went for other approaches (which I did a lot when I was in my "formative" years).
- IMO better consistency for stage and FOH sound. I know quite some FOH dudes, and they usually have enough to do keeping the 626784 sounds the keyboarder will deliver under control, so they all seem to love straight and consistent guitar sounds, not adding any further sound trainwreckage.

Also: Listen to the stuff Paul Gilbert gets out of one main sound. He can basically play the entire western pop music encycopledia and you wouldn't miss a single thing.

Now, as said, I can perfectly understand people going a different route (it obviously also depends on the musical material, there's possibly not much of a way to get through with my approach in a, say, Pink Floyd setting - but then, who knows...), but for me it's a kinda "liberating" thing.

 

[JiveTurkey]

I would agree on that - but I can perfectly understand people accustomed to other ideas. It's never been for me, though - I'm a "get the most out of a little amount of core tones" guy at heart (started because I was kinda forced into it, now I absolutely enjoy it).

And ftr, the vast majority of things I'm playing is "functional" stuff (but I'm not even using dedicated patches for that weird ABBA tribute band I'm in), hence anything from jazzy cleans to kinda classic rock tones.

I can cover most of that with just 4 tones: clean, dirt and lead variations of it (plus one dedicated acoustic patch in case I bring one). I do add: Some dirt boxes for a different flavour and to beef things up (doesn't matter much whether they're analog pedals or virtual ones), some kinda lush echo-y stuff for swells and what not and the ocassional modulation (I usually have a phaser and slow flanger for cleans and a uvibe-y thing and a tremolo for dirts).

All of this (minus the acoustic patch) was easily possibly within one kitchen sink kinda preset within the OG Floor.

And well, apart from such a thing being easy to maintain, IMO it also offers further advances:
- No drastic change in playing feel. I learned to hate that when I went for other approaches (which I did a lot when I was in my "formative" years).
- IMO better consistency for stage and FOH sound. I know quite some FOH dudes, and they usually have enough to do keeping the 626784 sounds the keyboarder will deliver under control, so they all seem to love straight and consistent guitar sounds, not adding any further sound trainwreckage.

Also: Listen to the stuff Paul Gilbert gets out of one main sound. He can basically play the entire western pop music encycopledia and you wouldn't miss a single thing.

Now, as said, I can perfectly understand people going a different route (it obviously also depends on the musical material, there's possibly not much of a way to get through with my approach in a, say, Pink Floyd setting - but then, who knows...), but for me it's a kinda "liberating" thing.

I am good with not trying to mimic the tones for every song 1:1. Specific FX I try to keep to a crucial minimum but have enough on hand in a single preset to make that work. I just don't have the focus for the herculean task of building out and maintaining 40-50 presets. I really should work on getting something "cleaner" in the queue but I generally provide more of the "oomph" in our band anyway (when I am not blasting trumpets)

 

[Sascha Franck]

I just don't have the focus for the herculean task of building out and maintaining 40-50 presets.

Yuck, me neither.
Also, most often on my gigs there's no premade setlists. We sit down with our tablets (or actual paper sheets) before each set and decide. No way I'd enter the stage and program a new setlist on my modeler of choice.

 

[JiveTurkey]

Yuck, me neither.
Also, most often on my gigs there's no premade setlists. We sit down with our tablets (or actual paper sheets) before each set and decide. No way I'd enter the stage and program a new setlist on my modeler of choice.

Plus it would open doors to doing a bunch of navigational footswitch config to get across all the presets as needed. Another chore I don't want to spend time on.

 

[Sascha Franck]

Plus it would open doors to doing a bunch of navigational footswitch config to get across all the presets as needed. Another chore I don't want to spend time on.

Absolutely. In fact, my main footswitch layout exists since I don't know for how long already. Of course, sometimes it varies a little based on the system's options and amount of footswitches, but the general layout idea is always the same. And I never ever switch banks on any gig. Been there, done that - wild modulation sound instead of a bone dry rhythm sound, no thanks.

 

[Foxmeister]

First off, it might be comparably difficult to implement global blocks.

From a programming perspective, I don't think it is.

If I were to do it, here's how I would implement it in the Helix architecture.

1. Set up a block how you want it and save it as a favourite - on saving it as a favourite, it should give you the option to say whether or not the favourite is "global", making it a "global favourite".

2. When you add a "global favourite" to a preset, instead of directly adding the block and the parameters to the preset, you have a pointer to the global favourite.

3. If you change the global favourite in a preset and then save the preset, it updates the global favourite block too, thus affecting all other presets that contain the global favourite. A suitable warning message should probably be displayed.

4. You would need the option to "unlink" a block from the global favourite, at which point it would become an entirely separate set of parameters stored directly in the preset.

5. If you were to save a preset individually as a file, it should give you the option to save the global favourite block as a regular block or include it in the preset file as a unique global favourite.

 

[JiveTurkey]

From a programming perspective, I don't think it is.

If I were to do it, here's how I would implement it in the Helix architecture.

1. Set up a block how you want it and save it as a favourite - on saving it as a favourite, it should give you the option to say whether or not the favourite is "global", making it a "global favourite".

2. When you add a "global favourite" to a preset, instead of directly adding the block and the parameters to the preset, you have a pointer to the global favourite.

3. If you change the global favourite in a preset and then save the preset, it updates the global favourite block too, thus affecting all other presets that contain the global favourite. A suitable warning message should probably be displayed.

4. You would need the option to "unlink" a block from the global favourite, at which point it would become an entirely separate set of parameters stored directly in the preset.

5. If you were to save a preset individually as a file, it should give you the option to save the global favourite block as a regular block or include it in the preset file as a unique global favourite.

This is a great take. Something like this needs to be dead simple to understand how it works on a single try; not convoluted and something requiring re-reading the implementation of seven times and still having to go back the next time you go to use to re-understand it.

 

[DanRad]

I get it, part 2. How much acoustic stuff are you doing? We just added Crazy Little Thing back and I have toyed with trying to recreate an acoustic-y vibe but I have been lazy and just used my "clean tone" (aka my bandmates saying "Is that an Anthrax song?" )

I play roughly half acoustic, half electric. Probably a little more acoustic in this band.

 

[DanRad]

Plus it would open doors to doing a bunch of navigational footswitch config to get across all the presets as needed. Another chore I don't want to spend time on.

This was easier on OG Helix. I set it to eight-stomp mode and had the far-left switches set to preset up/down. I'd just cycle through the setlist. We always map ours out ahead of time, but throw in a few audibles each set.

Bonus: The Helix display is easier to read in many conditions than the printed setlist on the floor!

Seriously, I get the appeal of a kitchen-sink preset. That has just never been my mindset.

 

[Chocol8]

Way back in the last century, I had one amp, one dirt pedal, and one wah, and I didn't always bring the wah! Matching tones on a song by song basis was never an option, and I can't imagine ever wanting to or having to deal with that. If its a cover, I actually think its far better to play it in your own style than to just play it as close to the album as possible. For an original, you get to play it your way anyway.

Just because you can doesn't mean you should.

 

[ian_dissonance]

Way back in the last century, I had one amp, one dirt pedal, and one wah, and I didn't always bring the wah! Matching tones on a song by song basis was never an option, and I can't imagine ever wanting to or having to deal with that. If its a cover, I actually think its far better to play it in your own style than to just play it as close to the album as possible. For an original, you get to play it your way anyway.

Just because you can doesn't mean you should.

People also used to go see a cover band because they wanted to dance to live music. Now unless it’s a nostalgia trip tribute act most people would be just as happy with AI holograms pretending to play songs streaming off Spotify as long as they recognize a hook once in awhile.

 

[Chocol8]

most people would be just as happy with AI holograms pretending to play songs streaming off Spotify as long as they recognize a hook once in awhile.

Or just the digital "juke box" or some other cheap solution. Kinda sad.

 

[Digital Igloo]

Howdy!

The past 18-24 months have been, let's say... arduous... and when my ever-patient wife repeatedly asked when we'd finally go on vacation, I responded with "we just gotta get through NAMM, babe." Our friends in Spotlights are finishing up their European tour with Helix Stadium and Showcase running guitar amps (through quilter power amp and Marshall 4x12) and effects, vocal effects, tracks/intros/seques, automation, and a click for the drummer. (Sarah's using an LT for bass duties too.) We flew out to see their London, Paris, and Barcelona shows. They kicked ass.

Got back a week ago and all the post-NAMM emails, meetings, and Proxy madness made me avoid social media for a bit longer. So I'm not back back just yet, but at least I got through page 214 of this thread.

Thought I'd share this here too: https://www.reddit.com/r/Line6Helix/s/pZSRrAfRwt

Shouldn't the arrows in preset up/down switches labels be the opposite direction?

No, and this is something that plagues every UI with a list and increment/decrement engagements—If a list isn't visible, up means next. If a list is visible, down means next. Left/right, up/down, there's no free lunch here. If if bugs someone, Global Settings > Switches/Pedals > Swap Up/Down lets you change it.

If I add a block, it's immediately turned on for every snapshot.

How can I add a block so that it's turned off for every snapshot, except the snapshot I'm on?

No free lunch here either, as by definition, "active" snapshots autopopulate the state of the block when it's added. Still, you can do one of three things:

• Bypass the block, copy it, and then paste it in place
• Save the block as a favorite while bypassed
• From a new preset, before selecting any other snapshots, bypass the block

Really , I think I had read DI comments about the 5153 and that they were looking into it , he also mentioned they were talking to people in DMs so that why not a lot of comments in these threads
I can’t imagine if they found a couple of bugs that they would say let’s just leave it for now especially not in their brand new Agoura platform

I suspect if anything was found or reworked that it will show up in 1.3
Remember 1.3 was supposed to be released around NAMM and they are saying Mid March I think I heard so I am sure they are using that extra time to good use

There was indeed an elusive (now fixed, will be in 1.3) speaker impedance curve bug that affects approximately 13% of amp and cab combinations (but no default amp+cab combinations). From what I've been told, it shouldn't bias the high end more than 1 (maybe 1.5?) dB or so up or down. Is this what people are experiencing? Not sure, but the team sure isn't sitting on their hands, shrugging.

And as others have mentioned, amp models currently load the SIC of their default cab if an unlinked cab or IR is used.

Everything that I’ve played in Agoura is better than Hx. I’m baffled by anyone preferring Hx amps but I’ve just chalked that up to preference or whatever.

While I do think there might be a couple weird little things with a couple of the models, overall Agoura is just such a massive step forward when it comes to plugging in and playing the device. It feels and responds so much better.

I have songs with POD Farm that I cannot replace with any other plugin because of how accustomed I am to that particular sound. Totally get it.

Well to be honest, I went off and explored a couple of amps on both Helix and Fractal.

So imagine you've got your ear right up against the cap of the speaker.... you crank the living fuck out of mids, treble, and presence. A real amp will make your ears bleed. Many of the amp models I tried, they are smoother sounding, not as aggressive, not as murder death kill. It is kind of interesting once you start comparing.

It's something you notice at the extremes, or if you're chasing a particular sound. But if you just want a good serviceable sound, then obviously it is more than good enough.

Interestingly enough, one company purposely restricts the range of tonestack knobs to avoid "wrong" settings that might hurt a newbie's sensibilities. Line 6 certainly doesn't, at least on purpose. Maybe it's the SIC thing? I kindly request you check beta in a week or so.

The differences between OG helix and Stadium are only going to be the converters and circuitry though right?

I don’t doubt that the new ones are improved but the overall DSP/modelling is going to be the same once it’s got itself into the modeller. If you reamped both through USB/SPDIF, wouldn’t they be identical?

I’d imagine comparing A/D converters to be much much smaller than the difference between legacy models and agoura

A/D/As, circuitry before and after A/D/As, oversampling, clocking, power supply, overall headroom, circuit layout... You'd think they should be minuscule differences, but collectively, it all adds up.

Same reason a $300 audio interface and a $6000 audio interface may have a similar I/O count.

No new Delays, Reverbs, Mods, Cabs at all in the new Flagship Stadium??

That`s not a big selling point

Wait, didn't I address this very thing with you in the past? Again, all the new effects developed for Helix Stadium have already been released for Helix/HX. Anyone insisting Stadium gets effects that Helix/HX doesn't is gatekeeping.

 

[Orvillain]

Interestingly enough, one company purposely restricts the range of tonestack knobs to avoid "wrong" settings that might hurt a newbie's sensibilities. Line 6 certainly doesn't, at least on purpose. Maybe it's the SIC thing? I kindly request you check beta in a week or so.

I thought we weren't allowed to talk about beta club!! ;-)

Hope you had a nice holibobs !!

 

[BenIfin]

Great Agoura AC30 -vs real AC30 by Jon Kaneshiro demo

The AC30 can sometimes be a bit of a litmus test for modeling and the Agoura Model has it - dare I say - basically %100 spot on

Great work L6 !

 

[Digital Igloo]

Whew! The only way out is through...

The picture actually doesn't show the real controls. I think the pictures aren't meant to be taken too seriously, but the controls in the amp blocks seem to be pretty accurate. I like how they included all the switches on certain amps, like the XTC. One thing that is confusing is that on the unit, the master vol should really be on the second tab for the plexi with the "extra" controls and the presence should be on the main tab, since it really does have a presence but not a master (unless it was modded and really does have one).

I begged our graphic designer to not label the knobs at all specifically because users with a magnifying glass will ADHD the hell out of everything. True to form, our Soldano image isn't reflective of the actual Soldano we modeled, and "b-b-but the image shows this!" came to bite us in the ass. We're changing the graphic in 1.3.

If it's just a graphic then you should be able to upload pics of your butthole.

Should I consider this a feature request?

That’s so much nice than the LT just because the display is centered.

Helix LT's display is centered; Helix Floor's is not. 86% of Line 6ers voted that Floor's should've been centered as well, but my boss at the time pulled rank and screamed "I don't care! I want it left-justified!" As soon as he bailed, the first thing we did was center LT's display.

anyone know how to assign an external switch to a block?

First you have to ensure that Control A, B, C, and/or D is set to momentary footswitch (none are by default): Set Global Settings > Switches/Pedals > Control X to "Footswitch In."

At this point, assignment is super simple:

1. Press-hold the knob you want to assign. The Learn/Assign Control panel appears.
2. Press the external switch.

Eric did say in a teaser interview that Proxy would be able to capture probably modulation and time based efx, if my memory is correct.
That would not be the usual suspects of capturing

I don't remember saying that. I alluded to the fact that it might be able to accomplish things beyond the traditional bog standard captures, but that's it.

Doubt that’s the case, or else it would have been done.

Here's the rub. Helix Stadium has SOOOO MANY sounds, features, workflows, QOL things, and UI/UX elements that are fully defined/designed and in a few cases, pretty comprehensively developed. At a certain point, we have to pull them back because something isn't quite right, it's dependent on another set of features, or sometimes simply because there aren't enough QA resources to ensure they're working as intended, especially when it involves slogging through near-unlimited combinations of blocks, messages, flags, files, use cases, etc.

As with Helix/HX, some may never see the light of day because priorities are shifting all the time.

"It would've been done" could be said for literally a million things, and a million things take a million development cycles of X length (involving Y engineers getting paid Z salary) to complete. Which is why we pick our battles very carefully.

 

[EOengineer]

I thought we weren't allowed to talk about beta club!! ;-)

 

[Chocol8]

Great. Next thing you know these Beta Club cunts are going to steal fat from the liposuction clinics and then blow this whole shit house to the sky.

Oh well, it was bound to happen eventually.

 

[[Nathan]]

Great. Next thing you know these Beta Club cunts are going to steal fat from the liposuction clinics and then blow this whole shit house to the sky.

Oh well, it was bound to happen eventually.

If you’re not Australian I’ll be incredibly impressed and proud at some of those words

 

[Chocol8]

If you’re not Australian I’ll be incredibly impressed and proud at some of those words

LOL, not an Aussie, but I grew up across the street from an Aussie family and was close friends with both kids.