Bosons Tear
Groupie
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I wish Proxy would sleeve the cradle
Line 6 Helix Stadium Talk
- Thread starter laxu
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SillyOctpuss
Rock Star
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I don't understand what that means?
GTR37
Rock Star
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I got an email from my guy at LM up here in Canada and they are expecting their order this month from the distributor and honestly I am still on the fence
I know 1.3 should be out this month and I am hoping for more bug fixes and proxy and also hoping proxy does not introduce another bunch of bugs
The part that makes it more complicated is I just absolutely love my AM4 at the moment took it over to singers place again just to do some rough demos and it’s compact size and amp models and effects are just so impressive
EOengineer
Rock Star
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Yeah I totally get it. I’ve justified having both the Stadium XL and the AM4 by telling myself that they serve slightly different contexts.
The AM4 features a much broader amp selection, great effects, and more mature amp modeling, but lacks things like space echo, complex chains, and the expansive switching options of the Stadium. After a couple months with it, I don’t love all the tap dancing I’m doing to switch between scenes, channels, etc. I love the sounds though.
Stadium gives me everything I liked about Helix in terms of tons of switching and control options, complex chains, scribble strips and brings along with it the promise of improved amp modeling that I do think will eventually get to the point where it turns more heads. Proxy is a bit of a wildcard as well, as I have had Tonex as my mistress on the side for a couple years now and love the idea of being able to incorporate my own amps with all the Stadium flexibility without having to deal with IK’s stench. Showcase is neat too but I’m mostly whatever about it right now.
TLDR: folks buying the AM4 for what it does now will likely be happy. If I were buying the stadium for what it does now I’d be mega disappointed, but I sort of broke my own rule and bought it gambling on the future. Nobody knows how that’s going to pan out. You have to be ok with the gamble. If you aren’t, stay with Fractal.
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Perrymusica
Roadie
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- 107
Why not go one step further? An automatic Focus View, play/stop.
As much as I love my Stadium, I don't think it's currently the device for people who are super picky about having a particular representation of an iconic amp. Line 6 has a wide selection of amps modeled, but not a particularly deep one. You'll usually get 1-2 iterations of any given style or amp family (Fender is a notable exception).
If what you want isn't covered by those 1-2, you may be waiting months or years for them to add a third. It's always been that way, so I'm not sure why people act brand new about it in the Stadium era with the Agoura versions of X amp or Y amp. And of course, the same lack of selection is present on Quad Cortex, Tonemaster Pro....pretty much anybody not Fractal that has amp modeling.
That being said, they have original amp models that help fill in some of those gaps, and now Proxy should REALLY help patch the rest.
In general, I prefer a model over a capture if all other things are equal, but I loved what captures brought to the table when I had a Kemper and Quad Cortex. I ended up reverting to some incredible Matt Fig captures when I dabbled with a Hotone Ampero II, even though it came at a massive DSP hit.
molul
Shredder
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I'm not an amp expert at all, but it looks like the problem is that there's a certain very iconic amp sound that's not being covered, not that a certain variation is lacking. Is that correct?
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I'd say that right now, there are styles or genres that aren't covered - either very well, or just at all.
I'm really trying to be patient with the Stadium, because it is a fantastic device. But there are a lot of issues at the moment that are kinda spoiling my enjoyment of it. The software editor is missing a lot of obvious workflow enhancements (like being able to just drag in a folder full of IR's and import the full thing into the unit) and plenty of firmware bugs that are just not fun.
Interesting. I'd love to hear more on this specific point.
I play in a pretty eclectic collective, and I've been using it for everything from washed-out surf/spy vintage rock (US Super Black set to one of the focus zones with default cab and Hot Springs reverb in front of the amp) to Doom/desert rock/metal (Soldano with EM12 cab and Dynamic Plate reverb behind) to hair metal/hot-rodded Marshall hard rock (my custom Silver Jubilee 80s patch) to modern metal (anything with the REVV Purple or Mesa Mark IIC+ with the Mesa 4x12/Cartographer C90/Governor cab) to vintage funk (Same as the surf/spy tone, but with the spring reverb dialed down and a Retro Reel in front) to ambient soundscaping (The Clarity amp with a Dynamic Plate behind with the decay cranked and a Heliosphere running in parallel witht the mix high).
I can do Voxy crunch for pop/rock jangle or 80s sounds, modern worship music ("Sunday Tones" factory patch), and most everything else inbetween.
What's missing for you, sir?
dean701
Shredder
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- 1,005
All in all, I'm not sure what everyone is expecting. Line 6 was never the leader of accuracy. Cabs were redone, models were redone over the years. Existing models stayed, inaccurate or not, to help alleviate preset re-manipulation. It always had a great UI and that will still be the case.
Perhaps Proxy will help out those people trying to replicate your actual amps but I would never expect 100% accuracy from the modeling portion.
Perhaps Proxy will help out those people trying to replicate your actual amps but I would never expect 100% accuracy from the modeling portion.
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I'm kinda struggling to get the Tool/Chevelle thing, which I guess isn't quite metal, but more hard rock. I'm struggling to get something close to ISIS's In The Absence of Truth and Wavering Radiant albums. Like ... it's kind of there.... but there's an aggression to those albums that escapes me.
Maybe when/if we have a proper Agoura Rectifier and Peavey 5150 as opposed to the 5150III, it might be as bit easier.
I know we've got the legacy models, but I'm trying to not use them if I can help it.
I'm struggling with understanding people self-imposing the "I can't use HX models. If I do, then I've wasted my money on this shiny new unit! I must satisfy all my needs with Agoura only!" mental block. It's not just you. I think it's what ultimately led @JiveTurkey to returning his and I've seen the sentiment elsewhere.
Like....those are very good amp models. Why NOT use them as the Agoura modeling stable continues to ramp up? Ostensibly, them getting the HX modeling right is what led you to trust them to eventually deliver the same for Agoura modeling, no?
People used "legacy" Axe-FX II content all over the place when they bought an Axe-FX III. If it's good, it's good.
AlbertA
Shredder
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Well that's what Agoura promised no?
Line 6 | Helix Stadium Family | Multi-Effects Processor
Helix Stadium Family amp and effects processors leverage powerful DSP and the entirely new Agoura modeling methodology.
line6.com
dean701
Shredder
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- 1,005
Yes, but there will always be variation from the actual amplifier that Line 6 has in their possession versus what people have. Tube life, which version, pot tapers, bright caps, biasing and maintenance.....
If you are looking to replicate your exact amp then profiling/capturing is the way.
Unfortunately, Proxy will take some time.
Once that releases and people want to challenge its accuracy, then that is open game.
MirrorProfiles
Rock Star
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Line 6 have managed to get very close to my amps to me, and so do Fractal, NDSP etc. Variation is a thing but so long as nothing is WAY out of spec things will overlap more than they don’t.
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Well because Agoura was meant to be a new leap in accuracy, and so even if the older models are decent, they still weren't as good as some of the competition, and if my usage of the Stadium is going to be 90% older models, with old effects blocks, utilising the old DSP.... why buy the Stadium in the first place?
I do agree that if it is good, then it is good. But the legacy models don't give me what I want in many cases either.
To answer your question, it's because it is a continuation of the Helix legacy the same as the Axe-FX III was a continuation of the II.
Both of the "legacy" units for Line 6 and Fractal basically ran out of developmental runway, so that clock was reset with more robust DSP as well as a metric poop-ton of usability improvements and new features. That's worth the money to me.
But I'm not sure why you or anyone else would eschew the older models during and after launch. If you want, say, a Diezel VH4 sound (and with you trying to evoke Took and ISIS...I think ya do), you know there is no Agoura equivalent announced, nor promise that it will arrive soon if at all. So use the HX model, which is still good - to my ears and fingers at least. Same for if you have to have a Recto...or a Friedman BE100....or Dumble/Grammatico GSG.
For your last sentence, tho......if the legacy models didn't give you what you wanted in many cases and you knew Line 6 was re-modeling those same real life amps you were underwhelmed by and also adding no new effects for the foreseeable future, why buy it? If that were my impression of the OG Helix, I wouldn't trust that things were magically different beased on the expectations they set during the June announcement.
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I don't think it is that good tbh.
lol yes, that was my rhetorical question.
So what actually drew you to plunk down the serious cash for the Stadium?
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