Line 6 Helix Stadium Pre-Launch Discussion

[EOengineer]

Enunciate

Did someone already post this and I missed it?

These clips are part of an earlier demo, the one with Pete Thorn and Fluff.

 

[[Nathan]]

Why force me to watch a 20 minute video about Rocket League or the Line 6 Helix instead of giving me an 800-word article with screenshots?

I hit D3 in 2v2 and felt chuffed…. Sorry…. what a save what a save

 

[Lysander]

Did someone already post this and I missed it?

These are clips from the Stadium hi-gain samples video Line 6 uploaded ~1 month ago.

 

[Fireproof]

Got it. Thanks!!

 

[banned]

Just WOW that 2203 Pete Thorn tone at the start!

And that throaty, midrangy XTC tone (German XTRA Red) again by Pete - that is so right on the money for an XTC. I can feel the amp's natural compression from here.

 

[Lysander]

Just WOW that 2203 Pete Thorn tone at the start!

That guy has a PhD in amazing Marshall tones, it's almost annoying.

 

[Dom Mcsweeney]

I’m surprised every post doesn’t have the footnote

- Sent from Ipad

And one dollop of "Edge Browser"

 

[GTR37]

These are clips from the Stadium hi-gain samples video Line 6 uploaded ~1 month ago.

As much as I don’t really love the REVV amps as a tone somehow
Javier managed to make them sound 100 times worse here

 

[ian_dissonance]

As much as I don’t really love the REVV amps as a tone somehow
Javier managed to make them sound 100 times worse here

I’m totally jealous of both his and Tosin’s abilities and music in general, but I have never really enjoyed their choice in tones.

 

[jmcecil]

I feel that way about most metal tones. The wall of sludge chug stuff is fingernails on a chalkboard to me. Awesome players though. But, I grew up in the 70's. I have that bias. digital reverb, gates, and compression destroyed guitar tone starting in the 80s to my ears. Not much has improved since then. Just more ways to brick wall 60 guitars.

 

[banned]

Quick question - let's say you're going into real cabs and not using the Stadium's built in Cabs/IRs, how does speaker impedance come into play?

I mean, my cab obviously has some real speaker impedance effect depending on frequency....but it's driven by a solid-state power amp. The Stadium would be putting out an entire amp modeled signal - including power amp modeling. But how does the amp model 'see' the cab and its speaker impedance?

Sorry if this is a silly question that has been answered before. I'm curious how all of this works - the interactions

 

[AlbertA]

if going accuracy ideally you would have a SIC for your cab and ideally the amp model should use it.

In a fractal you can choose SIC curves in the amp block - I wonder if Stadium will have a way of doing that.

But I wouldn’t sweat it.

 

[Dom Mcsweeney]

lol

NAM Confirmed

 

[Sascha Franck]

You're too much black or white on everything. There's a huge gray in between with so many good things to be had.

There "might" be. But people aren't using things responsibly. It just doesn't happen. And the downsides of AI, especially in anything related to arts, by *far* outweigh the possible benfits.
IOW, while I perfectly understand how you could use Suno (or your hypothetical AI-jam-band) in a productive fashion, this isn't happening.

What's happening is that we're giving away centuries of cultural heritage to an uncontrollable monster (and yes, that's in fact an appropriate word). We can already see the outcome of this. And it's not going to get any better, more to the opposite.
The entire professional music production scene will be completely destroyed in not even a handful of years to come (sure, live playing will survive for quite a while to come, but younger folks - at least over here - aren't that much interested in it already anymore).

And it doesn't stop there but will as well have an impact on our mere amateur-ish circles.
I'm kinda active in a german forum dedicated to (mainly hobbyist) recording and related things. You won't believe how many people have already been "busted", using Suno tracks while pretending they were their own. Or rather: Most often these folks just don't even say anything about how things were created (which is what that forum is a lot about) and go completely silent when you ask them.

For a whole number of years, you could do your thing in your home studio, then post it for some 50-ish listeners and at least get some criticism or some positive feedback. Which is just terrific to keep you going. These days, it's all completely obsolete because you're just buried in the massive output of at least partially (often fully) AI-created "productions", which by now are even coming along in incredible quality (both musically and sonically).
So, why exactly would you keep going with your home productions when a few clicks could generate dozens of better sounding things in seconds and when your small potential audience is by now reduced to zero because of the inflationary amount of AI music?
Sure, there's the value of the creative process, but it's still getting increasingly frustrating.

---

Then, as it has been brought up: "Technology has always destroyed jobs!"
Very true. But what's happening right now is new for a number of reasons.

When blacksmiths were about to become obsolete because cars were the new hot thing, it didn't happen overnight. It took about a generation, so if you were a blacksmith you were able to prepare your son to not become a blacksmith as well.
But when you were an aspiring, say, graphic designer just 5 years ago, chances are that you're out of jobs today already.
Things right now are happening at a pace that us mere humans aren't able to follow or adjust to anymore.

And as said above: We're just giving away our cultural heritage for nothing (but a little bit of quick success for a handful of folks).
In a very small amount of years, we'll be flooded with movies starring Charlie Chaplin as the new 007 and Marilyn Monroe as the new Bond girl, with Fritz Lang being the director and the score being created by a mixture of Hans Zimmer and the Sex Pistols. And it will all look and sound absolutely real.

Writing will be affected just as much. If you are into, say, realistic historic novels, who do you think would be the best to do the required research? Certainly not a human being. And you could have it written in any style between John Grisham and Douglas Adams.

And none of that is in the far future, because all of these things are happening right now. You may still be able to distinguish between real human and AI works, but it's a matter of a handful of years (at best) for that to become completely impossible.

---

So, in a nutshell: When it comes to AI (at least in all areas somewhat related to creativity), no, I'm not black and white. It's full stop black.

Sorry for such a long OT post, we should possibly have a dedicated AI thread indeed. But to get more on topic, how about requesting Line 6 to come up with a direct link between Showcase and Suno? You might not even need to play through your AI created presets yourself anymore. Heck, you could just have someone setting up a Stadium and a holographic avatar of yourself for your next gigs. The advance being that you could even play multiple gigs parallely. Come to think of it: The Stadium could as well just be a holographic avatar.

 

[molul]

There "might" be. But people aren't using things responsibly. It just doesn't happen. And the downsides of AI, especially in anything related to arts, by *far* outweigh the possible benfits.
IOW, while I perfectly understand how you could use Suno (or your hypothetical AI-jam-band) in a productive fashion, this isn't happening.

What's happening is that we're giving away centuries of cultural heritage to an uncontrollable monster (and yes, that's in fact an appropriate word). We can already see the outcome of this. And it's not going to get any better, more to the opposite.
The entire professional music production scene will be completely destroyed in not even a handful of years to come (sure, live playing will survive for quite a while to come, but younger folks - at least over here - aren't that much interested in it already anymore).

And it doesn't stop there but will as well have an impact on our mere amateur-ish circles.
I'm kinda active in a german forum dedicated to (mainly hobbyist) recording and related things. You won't believe how many people have already been "busted", using Suno tracks while pretending they were their own. Or rather: Most often these folks just don't even say anything about how things were created (which is what that forum is a lot about) and go completely silent when you ask them.
For a whole number of years, you could do your thing in your home studio, then post it for some 50-ish listeners and at least get some criticism or some positive feedback. Which is just terrific to keep you going. These days, it's all completely obsolete because you're just buried in the massive output of at least partially (often fully) AI-created "productions", which by now are even coming along in incredible quality (both musically and sonically).
So, why exactly would you keep going with your home productions when a few clicks could generate dozens of better sounding things in seconds and when your small potential audience is by now reduced to zero because of the inflationary amount of AI music?
Sure, there's the value of the creative process, but it's still getting increasingly frustrating.

---

Then, as it has been brought up: "Technology has always destroyed jobs!"
Very true. But what's happening is new for a number of reasons.

When blacksmiths were about to become obsolete because cars were the new hot thing, it didn't happen overnight. It took about generation, so if you were a blacksmith you were able to prepare your son to not become a horsesmith as well.
But when you were an aspiring, say, graphic designer just 5 years ago, chances are that you're out of jobs today already.
Things right now are happening at a pace that us mere humans aren't able to follow/adjust anymore.

And as said above: We're just giving away our cultural heritage for nothing (but a little bit of quick success for a handful of folks).
In a very small amount of years, we'll be flooded with movies starring Charlie Chaplin as the new 007 and Marilyn Monroe as the new Bond girl, with Fritz Lang being the director and the score being created by a mixture of Hans Zimmer and the Sex Pistols. And it will all look and sound absolutely real.

Writing will be affected just as much. If you are into, say, realistic historic novels, who do you think would be the best to do the required research? Certainly not a human being. And you could have it written in any style between John Grisham and Douglas Adams.

And none of that is in the far future, because all of these things are happening right now. You may still be able to distinguish between real human and AI works, but it's a matter of a handful of years (at best) for that to become completely impossible.

---

So, in a nutshell: When it comes to AI (at least in all areas somewhat related to creativity), no, I'm not black and white. It's full stop black.

Sorry for such a long OT post, we should possibly have a dedicated AI thread indeed. But to get more on topic, how about requesting Line 6 to come up with a direct link between Showcase and Suno? You might not even need to play through your AI created presets yourself anymore. Heck, you could just have someone setting up a Stadium and a holographic avatar of yourself for your next gigs. The advance being that you could even play multiple gigs parallely. Come to think of it: The Stadium could as well just be a holographic avatar.

This makes Thom Yorke sad.

I would have never thought a feature request of preset creation with AI would lead to the end of humanity

 

[Sascha Franck]

I would have never thought a feature request of preset creation with AI would lead to the end of humanity

Well, as exaggerating as it might come across, it's a part of the bigger scheme of things.
Seriously, IMO we should try to avoid AI as much as it gets in all areas that are kinda genuine to human beings. Hence anything involving "taste", "art", "creativity" and what not.

And just so you know: That AI patch creator wouldn't even be too much of a bad thing. But as it'd likely have to rely upon any existing LLM AI (even if it was just for the databases it needed to have access to), I'd rather just not have it.

 

[Foxmeister]

EDIT: Where's that guy who promised to pony up $500 for the Agoura Animal Shelter if a new Helix didn't drop by the end of 2023?

Not on TGP anymore, but he does crop up here from time to time.

 

[molul]

Well, as exaggerating as it might come across, it's a part of the bigger scheme of things.
Seriously, IMO we should try to avoid AI as much as it gets in all areas that are kinda genuine to human beings. Hence anything involving "taste", "art", "creativity" and what not.

And just so you know: That AI patch creator wouldn't even be too much of a bad thing. But as it'd likely have to rely upon any existing LLM AI (even if it was just for the databases it needed to have access to), I'd rather just not have it.

I mean, ignoring AI won't prevent it from being everywhere in the following years. It's just gonna happen, no matter what we do. I think it's better to accept it than believing it's a war we can win at all

And you would always have the option of not using it, like that guy who wanted a Helix Stadium OS without the Showcase feature. It's just so easy not to use it

 

[Sascha Franck]

I think it's better to accept it than believing it's a war we can win at all

I completely disagree. In fact, I think it's our moral obligation to fight AI in some areas (I don't even deny it could be very useful in other areas). Anything creative qualifies for that.

 

[ian_dissonance]

And you would always have the option of not using it

For music.
A good portion of the world is going to have it foisted upon them if their job is much more than moving things from one place to another (and then still, probably some “AI” reporting tool). Of course it has uses, “finishing” songs for lazy songwriters and iterating melodies for people who never learned enough about the thing they supposedly want to do is goofy.