Kemper Profiler MK 2

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Thought it was more or less confirmed that the DSP is the same in MkI and mkII?
I wasn't sure, hence why I said, "I reckon it's safe to assume that the new DSP / CPU power will take care of that "deficiency".

I assumed there'd be a decent step up in grunt 'cause I well remember that Kemper said on many occasions that they'd stocked up big-time on the old chips, but that was probably more than 10 years ago, meaning that for the new iteration it seemed a reasonable assumption that newer, more-powerful options would have been procured.

Thanks Ian. I haven't been to the Kemper forum in a year and a half due to not being able to log in, so I appreciate the info mate.
 
I wasn't sure, hence why I said, "I reckon it's safe to assume that the new DSP / CPU power will take care of that "deficiency".

I assumed there'd be a decent step up in grunt 'cause I well remember that Kemper said on many occasions that they'd stocked up big-time on the old chips, but that was probably more than 10 years ago, meaning that for the new iteration it seemed a reasonable assumption that newer, more-powerful options would have been procured.

Thanks Ian. I haven't been to the Kemper forum in a year and a half due to not being able to log in, so I appreciate the info mate.

On the Kemper forum / webpage / anything officially Kemper there is zero info AFAIK for what’s changed inside. I asked them directly on their forum and, whilst that post was seen by a mod and got a somewhat tangential comment, it didn’t get an answer. They just will not bite on this - their forum, their rules, fair enough. If you’re being a thoroughbred fan, you’ll tell yourself to not ask questions of the wizard who creates these things. If you’re on the fence, you’d reasonably say ‘tell me what’s different as otherwise you appear to be selling me exactly the same box for actual money and I’m not really into that when I have reasonable alternatives’. I 100% appreciate that they’ve given years of free upgrades on the mk1 and at some point that becomes unsustainable - this isn’t me moaning that they won’t give me more free stuff. I get it. But I personally needed more from them to confidently give them money when they wouldn’t happily tell me that, hardware wise, I wasn’t buying the same box!!

There’s reports in the wild of one chip change (a user report based on taking it apart) but that’s it I believe - on their official website, it’s worded in a way that you don’t know for sure if their are new things in there or if they are using old things more effectively…..

One other possible change *vs an older mk1*…. I also noticed that mk2 manual has better dynamic range on the input *compared to an old Kemper manual down at firmware 6*. The more modern mk1 had this change too (I think it changed a couple of years back) but this *might* explain reports from some users that mk2 sounds brighter than mk1 even though there’s no difference with the current profiles / effects. This is just a theory from me because, of course, there’s nothing written down about this.

It’s such a stark contrast to the Stadium launch where in the initial video they’re telling you that there’s a new gpu, more DSP, better converters, new touchscreen, extra knobs etc. Whatever else is going on, you are confident you are buying entirely new hardware. With the Kemper mk2, you have to have faith that there are changes because whatever they’ve changed (or not) they don’t want to tell you. I constantly have people telling me that’s how they roll. I know, based on years of experience. Just because someone has always been a certain way doesn’t mean they should continue when change would be a positive thing for users and for them.
 
It doesn’t matter if there are new chips or old chips if there’s no new functionality to use them. It doesn’t matter if I buy a 100 MHz Pentium vs a high end modern PC if I’m just running DOS.

They already announced what Mk 2 has, we don’t need to reverse engineer the hardware to figure it out. There’s improvements in the speed and stability of using the device, a handful of fixed effects available, and TBD on higher resolution profiles. You’re not going to find a touch screen in there.
 
With the Kemper mk2, you have to have faith that there are changes because whatever they’ve changed (or not) they don’t want to tell you. I constantly have people telling me that’s how they roll. I know, based on years of experience. Just because someone has always been a certain way doesn’t mean they should continue when change would be a positive thing for users and for them.
The reason I would say "that's how they roll" is only because I don't believe change is going to come. So when I see people put time and energy into seemingly hoping they can influence such change, it feels like a waste on their part.

I've seen this first hand, big time. And since it became obvious years ago, when I owned a Kemper and would do many audio tests, I eventually stopped caring.
 
I wasn't sure, hence why I said, "I reckon it's safe to assume that the new DSP / CPU power will take care of that "deficiency".

I assumed there'd be a decent step up in grunt 'cause I well remember that Kemper said on many occasions that they'd stocked up big-time on the old chips, but that was probably more than 10 years ago, meaning that for the new iteration it seemed a reasonable assumption that newer, more-powerful options would have been procured.

There is no newer, more powerful, version of the DSP processor chip available for the architecture they use. It's an old architecture and development of it ceased long ago. I'm sure they have a stockpile, but that stockpile consists of the same chip they've always used.
 


- 36 seconds profiling time.
- no refining
- PC required for new 2.0 profiling
- 2.0 profiles can be liquid profiles
- on-the-unit profiling can still be done
- supposedly doing back-to-back 2.0 and legacy profiles shows a noticeable quality / accuracy difference between the 2
 
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The idea about keeping the input stage properly set and hence using the hardware Kemper is pretty clever imo.
Well it's what having the same hardware does. That's why stuff like ToneX and NAM desperately rely on proper signal calibration for a good user-experience across different chains. Kemper (and Quad Cortex as well) have the benefit of the hardware underlay which is consistent.
 
Really intriguing developments! Sounds like it’s going to be an improvement in all kinds of ways in terms of the profiles themselves.
 
Really intriguing developments! Sounds like it’s going to be an improvement in all kinds of ways in terms of the profiles themselves.
No refining, and quicker profiling than before. Compare that to how long it takes for tonex to capture even with the update (especially with some processors).
 
If those claims are true + liquid profiles, Kemper's gonna get a new lease on life.
What is a bummer though is all new profiles will need to be created right?

I imagine that will be a good amount of work for creators but then again, a good sales opportunity
 
No refining, and quicker profiling than before. Compare that to how long it takes for tonex to capture even with the update (especially with some processors).
Can the Kemper do batch processing, since it relies on a computer now anyway? Otherwise capture time is pretty irrelevant now, with Tonex's batch processing.
 
Can the Kemper do batch processing, since it relies on a computer now anyway? Otherwise capture time is pretty irrelevant now, with Tonex's batch processing.
No word on batch processing but with the 36s reamping / training time, churning a pack of profiles is gonna be pretty darn fast compared to anything else I know of.
 
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No word on batch processing but with the 36s reamping / training time, churning a pack of profiles is gonna be pretty darn fast compared to anything else I know of.
Sure, I'm just saying time comparisons aren't as crucial as before, IMO, due to the batch processing of Tonex. I guess for "content creators" it would be. But for the average Joe, they'll do a bunch, let it cook, and be done.
 
Sure, I'm just saying time comparisons aren't as crucial as before, IMO, due to the batch processing of Tonex. I guess for "content creators" it would be. But for the average Joe, they'll do a bunch, let it cook, and be done.
There's also situations where people in are the studio and want results quickly. But sure, I agree that the tonex batch processing also has its strengths.
 
I guess for "content creators" it would be. But for the average Joe, they'll do a bunch, let it cook, and be done.

Content creators will do the same thing. They may grumble a bit about Tonex, but the customer base is so much bigger than Kemper these days, the small differences are not going to change which platforms they favor. They are going to make the stuff that sells. Right now that is Tonex QC and NAM.

In the future Proxy might make a big dent, and Kemper 2 certainly has a shot, but if it doesn't run on version 1 hardware, I don't think capture vendors are going to trip over themselves to recapture their amps for a small potential customer base limited to only the MKii hardware.
 
Content creators will do the same thing. They may grumble a bit about Tonex, but the customer base is so much bigger than Kemper these days, the small differences are not going to change which platforms they favor. They are going to make the stuff that sells. Right now that is Tonex QC and NAM.

In the future Proxy might make a big dent, and Kemper 2 certainly has a shot, but if it doesn't run on version 1 hardware, I don't think capture vendors are going to trip over themselves to recapture their amps for a small potential customer base limited to only the MKii hardware.
Kemper may still have a chance though if their new profiling delivers. 36s is crazy for a good quality profile when you compare it to anything else out there. Put "liquid profiling" on top of that & I could see the ecosystem still being attractive especially if the Kemper Player can do profiling now (albeit connected to a PC).
 
Kemper may still have a chance though if their new profiling delivers. 36s is crazy for a good quality profile when you compare it to anything else out there. Put "liquid profiling" on top of that & I could see the ecosystem still being attractive especially if the Kemper Player can do profiling now (albeit connected to a PC).
It's speculation, but I believe the regular Kemper profiling fills out a bunch of parameters in a very flexible amp sim and then EQ matches. Something of that sort.

That can be very fast. But the kind of machine learning tonex does requires a lot more horse power.

Then again, I wonder how the new profiling works, if it's really that different from before, assuming the above is correct. Considering how quick it is, I would imagine it's based on some similar underlying tech, but maybe a more developed version of it?

But again. Speculation to the max.
 
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