Is a bit of struggle a good thing?

[spawnofthesith]

I have to agree, abuse shouldn't be conflated with "tough love"

 

[Aelred]

When I was young I had some cheap pos that I hated but kept on plugging away, and eventually bought an Ibanez Roadstar II that I thought was almost too good to be true,

I had a Tube Screamer and a Marshall amp and that was it – and I played gigs and subbed in for local bands before real life set in and sold it all.

Taking it up again many years later, I doubt I would have bothered re- learning scales and chords without a decent guitar or two and loads of FX, especially a Looper with beats. And who knew I loved ambient noodling? Not me! At least until I bought an EQD Afterneath.

I picked up a MIM HSS Strat, a Fender Mustang modeler and an ME-80 multi-effects unit and thought I would never have to buy anything ever again except strings. No intention of gigging, just for my own pleasure. My eyes and hands are much older now, and the baseball bat neck on my Squier Thinline Tele means I need it setup for high action, Open D and Slide. That thing hurts me after half an hour.

Pain is indicative that something is wrong. Stop now! It is not athletic training and I don’t need the neck muscle aches that go down my left side for days if I ignore the signs and “power through”.

Many $$$ of amps, guitars and pedals later, I have had a tonne of fun – but have no intention of wrestling with a “bad” guitar. I cannot justify the expense of a Custom Shop or signature, so I stick to about the price-point of Reverend, ESP, Schecter, Solar etc.

The gear is all meant to be for my pleasure, not my pain. I am not in school to pass assignments, nor a band that needs to play a show. If anyone yelled at me or something for flubbing a note - immediate dismissive mockery from me would result. But I don't play for anyone else, so the chances of that are 0%. (If I hired a teacher, I would respect the teacher)

YMMV

 

[metropolis_4]

I have to agree, abuse shouldn't be conflated with "tough love"

Totally. This all started off about a guitar that’s a little tough to play and somehow it’s turned into pain, abuse, and suffering

 

[FuzzyAce]

 

[Aelred]

Cheap acoustic guitar with rusty strings 1/4" off the fretboard... That would be something I would not touch, let alone learn to play on. YMMV.

I tend to use the string gauge the guitar comes with. 9's or 10's so far. I should buy an accoustic - but as an Aussie there is some kind of "obligation" to buy a Maton.

 

[likitlikeyoulikeit]

Totally. This all started off about a guitar that’s a little tough to play and somehow it’s turned into pain, abuse, and suffering

One person's painful abuse is another's gleeful pleasure......

I think some of this convo took itself a bit too seriously, and maybe there is a slight generation gap causing a bit of a curfuffle, other than that ...every one learns in different ways....some don't learn at all and they get cymbals upside the head for wasting people's valuable time.

I think anything that requires the discipline and concentration that using the guitar does, is going to require a bit of heavy handedness, so to speak.

Never met a perfect teacher. They all break eventually, and time and experience knows this.

To be better at something we must all overcome hurdles, physically and mentally....and each person's hurdles are a different height and duration, but the race is the same.

I really do love the banter.

 

[norminal]

Skinny Top Heavy Bottom man here!!

I recently threw a set of 9-46 on my PRS and I’m digging them.

 

[likitlikeyoulikeit]

I recently threw a set of 9-46 on my PRS and I’m digging them.

Its nice to do easier bends....and still have that drop tuned tension!

 

[Aelred]

I recently threw a set of 9-46 on my PRS and I’m digging them.

Must try that on mine.

The internet is the realm of exaggeration - and no thread going past a few comments stays on course for the OP.

 

[Will Onyx]

I think there’s some truth to getting a payout from making yourself have to work harder on guitar, I just don’t think it necessarily means having to play a crap instrument. During the metal days, I used to practice all of my rhythms and solos playing totally clean and dry to make sure my picking was on point. Really helped out when I transitioned to country. Then when I was playing country, we would sometimes play our sets all acoustic, which meant fighting out the lead licks on acoustic guitar.

Later on, I felt I played best when I was regularly playing other instruments. After gigging on bass and playing mandolin on the side, electric guitar felt almost effortless. Stopped gigging and dropped completely out of the loop during you know what and now everything feels like a struggle. Sigh.

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

Well, there's a difference between tough love 'you need to put in the time or it isn't going to happen' and tough love 'tossing a cymbal at someone's head'.

The former is often a productive reality check. I'd had several students over the years benefit from that talk, one way or the other; ie. they got to work or they decided to be honest with themselves about how they spent their time.

No one needs the latter.

As I said different folks require different approaches.
And if the result is some one shedding to the point of greatness the end justied the means.

On the flip side I had kids where the parents insisted they take lessons and no matter how much they get cuddled they fall apart

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

I recently threw a set of 9-46 on my PRS and I’m digging them.

That was my go to on Strat scale length for decades. Now I switched to 9.5-44

 

[spawnofthesith]

As I said different folks require different approaches.
And if the result is some one shedding to the point of greatness the end justied the means.

On the flip side I had kids where the parents insisted they take lessons and no matter how much they get cuddled they fall apart

Is literal assault really ever a correct approach for teaching though? I think there’s a pretty firm line in the sand there. Equating “not committing acts of violence” = coddling seems be a pretty deranged hill to die on

 

[Aelred]

I recall Elizabeth Schwarzkopf (Opera Singer) saying that of course she doesn't train her students as she was trained or she would be arrested for assault.

My mother learned piano with nuns hitting her fingers with rulers/canes. No wonder she didn't insist on music lessons for me.

 

[spawnofthesith]

As a personal real world example I absolutely wish my guitar teacher when I was a teenager pushed his desired agenda rather than letting me self direct lessons having him waste time transcribing dumb songs to tab for me, but the way to do that would in no uncertain terms not be to bash me over the head with his strat and tell me I’m an idiot. Let’s use some tact, common sense and intelligence in this discussion jfc

 

[Ed DeGenaro]

Is literal assault really ever a correct approach for teaching though? I think there’s a pretty firm line in the sand there. Equating “not committing acts of violence” = coddling seems be a pretty deranged hill to die on

I think when Charlie Parker got gonged it was him on the bandstand, nit in lesson.

If you're referring to the Whiplash scene it's a movie that was trying to makes point.

But I tell you this when I was 6 and learning cello my knuckles were rapped with a cookingspoon for hitting sour notes

Just the same as we were abused in school.

Different times.

 

[duzie]

I don't think when Charlie Parker got gonged it was him on the bandstand.

If you're referring to the Whiplash scene it's a movie that was trying to makes point.

But I tell you this when I was 6 and learning cello my knuckles were rapped with a cookingspoon for hitting sour notes

Just the same as we were abused in school.

Different times.

Different times for sure.
I went to Catholic School as a child.
“Dicipline” was administered much differently in the 1960’s

 

[fetishfrog]

On the flip side I had kids where the parents insisted they take lessons and no matter how much they get cuddled they fall apart

On man I could write a book.

My favorite, young student brings in the book for Rent. She was a stone beginner and that's not exactly beginner material.

So, I re arranged the tunes to very basic chords, and had her at least attempt to play the form with the changes along with the recording.

Her dad was this quite large offshore oil rig guy, no one to trifle with.

A month into it, he shows up and is pissed at me his daughter can't play Rent. I explain the material is a bit advanced for a new student, but we've worked out a way for her to learn the basics, none of which will matter because it's clear she doesn't practice. Argument ensues. He pulls her.

Yeesh.

 

[fetishfrog]

Different times for sure.
I went to Catholic School as a child.
“Dicipline” was administered much differently in the 1960’s

It was still like that in the 80s.

 

[metropolis_4]

On man I could write a book.

My favorite, young student brings in the book for Rent. She was a stone beginner and that's not exactly beginner material.

So, I re arranged the tunes to very basic chords, and had her at least attempt to play the form with the changes along with the recording.

Her dad was this quite large offshore oil rig guy, no one to trifle with.

A month into it, he shows up and is pissed at me his daughter can't play Rent. I explain the material is a bit advanced for a new student, but we've worked out a way for her to learn the basics, none of which will matter because it's clear she doesn't practice. Argument ensues. He pulls her.

Yeesh.

Things like this are why I quit teaching