IK Multimedia TONEX

I know its early days .... and this very much seems to be a big step forward for Tonex .... given (a) IK have known for ages how good NAM is and (b) they have probably been working on the V2 Capturing Engine for some time .... surely (?) their goal would have been / is for Tonex V2 to at least equal if not better NAM [on paper at least] ?
 
MirrorProfiles said:
Had 2 occasions so far where the training signal just stops and I have to restart the reamp. Not sure what causes it so far.

Also it can be prone to clicks when going back from step 4 to step 3 (which is a common move when making a model with the last settings). Could be related to the Live Input state on stage 3.
Click to expand...
Mac or PC?

I've had similar with my PC but I thought it was a driver not liking a process. It eventually resumes.
 
BenIfin said:
I know its early days, but given (a) IK have known for ages how good NAM is and (b) they have probably been working on the V2 Capturing for some time .... surely (?) their goal would have been / is for Tonex V2 to at least equal if not better NAM [on paper at least] ?
Click to expand...
IK seems like a pretty chunky org that might not be particularly agile. I’m making a lot of assumptions here but the improvements they made to their engine probably have been around for a while. I think they are less crumbling edge and a bit more middle of the road choose a safe path kind of thing.
 
Chocol8 said:
I am not convinced they care. BUT...Tonex closing the accuracy/SQ gap with NAM definitely sets the bar a little higher for Proxy and others, and I wonder if this will spur an update to the QC capture quality. I have had very little time with a QC (not mine) and I thought its captures were overall very similar quality to earlier Tonex which was very good and better than Kemper at the time, but NAM has gotten better and Tonex has the huge advantage of cheap hardware. Hmmmm.
Click to expand...
I think it really makes the ToneX more appealing than Dimehead and the current NAM players out there, the trade offs are much smaller now between each and the price of entry and availability means there’s only one winner.

The changes to training will lead to WAY more models being created and that’ll boost the platform massively.

I think it also gives Kemper and QC something to think about, and likely makes things way more difficult for STL tracer (possibly only doing artist packs anyway?) and Tonocracy (is it already dead?).
 
BenIfin said:
I know its early days .... and this very much seems to be a big step forward for Tonex .... given (a) IK have known for ages how good NAM is and (b) they have probably been working on the V2 Capturing Engine for some time .... surely (?) their goal would have been / is for Tonex V2 to at least equal if not better NAM [on paper at least] ?
Click to expand...

Define better though. Accuracy isn't everything and Tonex has been able to run on much cheaper hardware and this update still will run on their hardware. Even if NAM is more accurate, it can't touch that yet.

Edit to clarify, IK's goals may have been make it as close as possible in SQ yet still run on a One. Leapfrogging NAM in SQ would be nice, but not necessarily a good thing if it required upgraded hardware.
 
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EOengineer said:
Like…I appreciate NAM and actively support/contribute to open source projects all the time professionally. Doesn’t change the reality that all of the hardware boxes running NAM are basically playschool toys or a pile of parts some asshole threw together in a closet.

IK is making a solid play here, and very quietly.
Click to expand...

I still think the market for NAM is home playing with a PC and studio environments (with a PC). That could change, but right now I feel like Tonex and NAM are addressing different markets with IK focusing on the people who need or want hardware.
 
Chocol8 said:
I still think the market for NAM is home playing with a PC and studio environments (with a PC). That could change, but right now I feel like Tonex and NAM are addressing different markets with IK focusing on the people who need or want hardware.
Click to expand...
Thats fair. I do feel like IK is further along in their software game than NAM is in the hardware game, but that’s not a surprise given IK has existing pipelines for hardware manufacturing and NAM is a relatively new open source (decentralized) software project.

It will be interesting to see how that open source dynamic stands up against IK’s more traditional business approach long term.

We all win, really.
 
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Chocol8 said:
I still think the market for NAM is home playing with a PC and studio environments (with a PC). That could change, but right now I feel like Tonex and NAM are addressing different markets with IK focusing on the people who need or want hardware.
Click to expand...

Yeah, honestly, the simplicity of NAM's plugin resonates with me way more. For most things outside of samplers, I sort of hate librarian software and all that, and I'd rather just have the ease and speed of file management right on my computer (and not being tied to an account to keep things running). I miss when basically all VSTs worked that way lol.

If I wasn't wanting hardware / didn't mind my guitar playing being tied to a computer, I'd just go that route: grab the NAM player plugin and some captures from Amalgam and be happy.
 
Chocol8 said:
I still think the market for NAM is home playing with a PC and studio environments (with a PC). That could change, but right now I feel like Tonex and NAM are addressing different markets with IK focusing on the people who need or want hardware.
Click to expand...
NAM is a hobbyist development prototype. It is not an integrated platform suitable for everyone's needs. Most guitarists into digital modelling don't know and haven't even tried NAM.
 
Got me down to 6:35 time using Extended. That's almost a 10 minute decrease in capture time. Wow! Nice work IK! (now where is the AMD GPU support!)

The entire process will be a godsend for creators, new users, etc. but I'm really just to lazy to "re-shoot" all my amps. :bag

These still sound way better than the Kemper. Sorry but it's true. I back to back compared to a Profile I made of the same amp and settings and it's night and day. I've added the Tonex and Kemper files below if anyone has both devices and wants to A/B, have at it.

Tonex (new)

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com www.dropbox.com

Kemper

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com www.dropbox.com


Some interesting things I noticed:

The Tonex Modeler App shows that I'm clipping but the AXE I/O, where I'm sending the input in from the AXE III and what I'm using to create the Capture, does not show I'm clipping. Also the Input and Gain in the Tonex app still need some tweaking to get things sounding closer to the amp.

Tonex Modeler App, clipping:

LO9A5nd.png




AXE I/O Control Panel, not clipping:

GA39YNi.png




Once I made the Capture I needed to adjust the Gain in the Capture up to have it more closely match the real amp:

0Et7s7w.png



While the "AI" is doing it's thing it's running the CPU a bit and it's also hitting the GPU, just not showing any utilization in Process Monitor but you can tell by the GPU temps.

CPU:
eNECYJu.png



GPU:
c9cPiZv.png



The whole new Capture process is waaaaayy nicer than the old process and the time reduction is substantial. Fun little experiment but there is no way I'm re-shooting all my damn amps again.

Damnit! I need to save up again for some Stadium goodness. The new Badlander broke my Stadium bank, but it was worth it.:ROFLMAO:

Very nice, free upgrade. Thanks IK! And thanks for not charging for the upgrade i.e. TONEX Max Plus Enhanced V2, etc. Please don't do that....

m3FwVJC.jpeg
 
texhex said:
Got me down to 6:35 time using Extended. That's almost a 10 minute decrease in capture time. Wow! Nice work IK! (now where is the AMD GPU support!)

The entire process will be a godsend for creators, new users, etc. but I'm really just to lazy to "re-shoot" all my amps. :bag

These still sound way better than the Kemper. Sorry but it's true. I back to back compared to a Profile I made of the same amp and settings and it's night and day. I've added the Tonex and Kemper files below if anyone has both devices and wants to A/B, have at it.

Tonex (new)

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com www.dropbox.com

Kemper

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com www.dropbox.com


Some interesting things I noticed:

The Tonex Modeler App shows that I'm clipping but the AXE I/O, where I'm sending the input in from the AXE III and what I'm using to create the Capture, does not show I'm clipping. Also the Input and Gain in the Tonex app still need some tweaking to get things sounding closer to the amp.

Tonex Modeler App, clipping:

LO9A5nd.png




AXE I/O Control Panel, not clipping:

GA39YNi.png




Once I made the Capture I needed to adjust the Gain in the Capture up to have it more closely match the real amp:

0Et7s7w.png



While the "AI" is doing it's thing it's running the CPU a bit and it's also hitting the GPU, just not showing any utilization in Process Monitor but you can tell by the GPU temps.

CPU:
eNECYJu.png



GPU:
c9cPiZv.png



The whole new Capture process is waaaaayy nicer than the old process and the time reduction is substantial. Fun little experiment but there is no way I'm re-shooting all my damn amps again.

Damnit! I need to save up again for some Stadium goodness. The new Badlander broke my Stadium bank, but it was worth it.:ROFLMAO:

Very nice, free upgrade. Thanks IK! And thanks for not charging for the upgrade i.e. TONEX Max Plus Enhanced V2, etc. Please don't do that....

m3FwVJC.jpeg
Click to expand...
Click on 3d, right under GPU, select cuda and you will see the use of the graphics card.
 
Orvillain said:
NAM is a hobbyist development prototype. It is not an integrated platform suitable for everyone's needs. Most guitarists into digital modelling don't know and haven't even tried NAM.
Click to expand...

I mean, it’s very open source. And by that I mean it’s rough around the edges, grassroots, challenging in some ways to use, etc.

When someone significant comes around, a Red Hat of music gear, and commercializes it well, it’ll blow your sack back.

But that said, I too am digging this new ToneX version. Competition is good.
 
I saw Amalgam has matching samples of the v1 and v2 Benson amp + cab captures, so I went to compare as I've been a big fan of their Benson captures.

I was surprised that the v2 had a different cab (Matchless 2X12 G12H G12M vs Marshall 1960A 1968 G12H) and very different tone settings (Treble 8 and Bass 2 on v2 vs Treble 5 and Bass 3.5) for the same capture name ("BEN CHI Crunch BAL CAB"), and I didn't love how the new one sounded because of that (way too bright and thin, which imo is weird for a "balanced" eq capture of such a dark amp). Not a huge deal as you can tame it with the treble and presence controls, but I wonder if this will be a thing with their newer captures? In the v1 pack, only the "Bright" and "Thin" captures of this amp have the Treble anywhere near this high (e.g. the BRI captures have the Treble at 7 and Bass at 3).

Anyway, it was hard to compare with these differences, but both sounded great with the EQ adjustments, and otherwise the v2 was waaaay gainier (with both captures of the amp set at volume 7), which I guess is more accurate! I'm really really curious to hear more, and it'll be interesting to see if some of these capture companies offering updates take this route of adjusting sounds vs attempting new captures of the same sounds (or somewhere in between).
 
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