Friedman IR-J (Jake E Lee?)

[KingsXJJ]

Mine arrives tomorrow. I’m hoping it’s closer in the ballpark to what sounds I want. The IR-X wasn’t but I do so love hot-rodded JCM’s and Plexi’s. I’m hoping for a slightly more vintage tone with a lot of feel and harmonics.

 

[KingsXJJ]

The IR-J suits me much better that the IR-X. Having said that, to me, something is still missing. I compared it to Fractal and the Ampi-Firebox MkII. AFAICT, it’s related to the power amp simulation. The Friedman pedals in this range don’t have the same “feel” “squish” or feeling alive under your fingers. This may be entirely me.

Recommendations for Mr. Friedman and Synergy to consider:

Variable knobs in the software instead of three way switches for thump, presence and low pass. This isn’t a simulation of what Dave offers on the front control panel of many of his amps…. Sky’s the limit in this digital realm. Act like it!

Put amp like controls for resonance, presence and additionally, low/high pass filters in the software.
Let us tweak more. Also, add amp bias and power tube selections along with tube hardness.

But still, a very nice unit overall. I believe that after all the feedback on these units, the MKII might be incredible! Unless it can be achieved via software on the current hardware. The only thing I would add is that the “TS-style” boost doesn’t sound like any tube screamer I have used. It’s much better and more musical to me than the boost on the IR-X but still…

I don’t know if the boost parameters can be exposed in software and then tweaked or not. If so, show us. If not, give us a three way somewhere on the front control panel allowing for variation. I would like to see TS, SD-1 and maybe Klon or clean boosts available.

Keep it up Dave… Love you Man!

 

[GuitarBilly74]

All these suggestions are cool, but honestly I bought the IR pedals precisely because I did NOT want to tweak it with a computer or have a bunch of different options to play with.

It actually took me 6 months of owning it to even plug it into a computer to check out the software. And I ended up keeping the stock settings anyway.
I think these pedals are more for people like me, who just want to plug and play.

I've had a few modelers/profiles over the years and did not enjoy them as much as I enjoy the tone and simplicity of this pedal. But then again, I'm not a fan of modeling at all.

But if you do like modeling, then yes, I'm sure the latest Fractal etc gives you a lot more options and flexibility.

I don't think that's what these pedals are for though. They're for people who DON'T like modeling but want a simple, good sounding DI option.

 

[KingsXJJ]

All these suggestions are cool, but honestly I bought the IR pedals precisely because I did NOT want to tweak it with a computer or have a bunch of different options to play with.

It actually took me 6 months of owning it to even plug it into a computer to check out the software. And I ended up keeping the stock settings anyway.
I think these pedals are more for people like me, who just want to plug and play.

I've had a few modelers/profiles over the years and did not enjoy them as much as I enjoy the tone and simplicity of this pedal. But then again, I'm not a fan of modeling at all.

But if you do like modeling, then yes, I'm sure the latest Fractal etc gives you a lot more options and flexibility.

I don't think that's what these pedals are for though. They're for people who DON'T like modeling but want a simple, good sounding DI option.

You don’t have to tweak them. However, I want to.

Why not both?

End of story really. Unless you can think of some reason that they both aren’t possible. If you like them as is, leave them alone. If you don’t, then tweak away. They could even add modes. Strict pedal or tweakable. I get it that you may not share my desires but I accept yours.

I think Mr. Friedman is selling to different cats. Likely why he designed the range and offered the software in the first place. I just think that latter part could be better. Glad you like your IR-D.

 

[GuitarBilly74]

You don’t have to tweak them. However, I want to.

Why not both?

End of story really. Unless you can think of some reason that they aren’t both possible. If you like them as is, leave them alone. If you don’t, the tweak away. They could even add modes. Strict pedal or tweakable. I get it that you may not share my desires but I accept yours.

People who want simple stuff want simple stuff. It's that simple.

Say someone is looking for a single channel amp. You say, "well you could buy this JVM and only use one channel." Which is actually true.
He's still going to reply: "I want a single channel amp".

 

[KingsXJJ]

People who want simple stuff want simple stuff. It's that simple.

Say someone is looking for a single channel amp. You say, "well you could buy this JVM and only use one channel." Which is actually true.
He's still going to reply: "I want a single channel amp".

All it takes for you is to just play. Why would you deny anyone from wanting to do more? Your analogy isn’t quite right.

I’ll try to offer a better one, although by this point I think you want to stipulate that your needs are most important.

Take the Engl Fireball as an example using your analogy. Want the tone?

Buy a Fireball and be happy.

ENGL Amplifiers Fireball 25 25-wattTube Head

25W, 2-channel Tube Guitar Amplifier Head with 3-band EQ, Mid Boost, Built-in Powersoak, and Buffered FX Loop

www.sweetwater.com

Want a bit more flexiblity? Buy the Ironball SE.

ENGL Amplifiers Ironball Special Edition 20-watt Tube Head

20/5/1W, 2-ch Tube Guitar Amp Head with Effects Loop, Noise Gate, Reverb, Delay, and USB for IR Loading

www.sweetwater.com

They are not so different yet each cater to different audiences. By virtue of their design the IR units from Friedman can offer both.

Are you against that for some reason? Or do you think that not only we should choose a product based on the tone we seek but how willing we are to get that last 15%? If you’re happy, rock on! Why on earth would you take the same exact product and deny those that want more from a software rev. that makes others happy too?

I honestly don’t get this. You have your needs. I have mine. Both are achievable but yet you seem to be determined that I can’t have mine even if it costs you…

NOTHING.

Seriously?

 

[GuitarBilly74]

All it takes for you is to just play. Why would you deny anyone from wanting to do more? Your analogy isn’t quite right.

I’ll try to offer a better one, although by this point I think you want to stipulate that your needs are most important.

Take the Engl Fireball as an example using your analogy. Want the tone?

Buy a Fireball and be happy.

ENGL Amplifiers Fireball 25 25-wattTube Head

25W, 2-channel Tube Guitar Amplifier Head with 3-band EQ, Mid Boost, Built-in Powersoak, and Buffered FX Loop

www.sweetwater.com

Want a bit more flexiblity? Buy the Ironball SE.

ENGL Amplifiers Ironball Special Edition 20-watt Tube Head

20/5/1W, 2-ch Tube Guitar Amp Head with Effects Loop, Noise Gate, Reverb, Delay, and USB for IR Loading

www.sweetwater.com

They are not so different yet each cater to different audiences. By virtue of their design the IR units from Friedman can offer both.

Are you against that for some reason? Or do you think that not only we should choose a product based on the tone we seek but how willing we are to get that last 15%? If you’re happy, rock on! Why on earth would you take the same exact product and deny those that want more from a software rev. that makes others happy too?

I honestly don’t get this. You have your needs. I have mine. Both are achievable but yet you seem to be determined that I can’t have mine even if it costs you…

NOTHING.

Seriously?

Oh man, I'm not denying anyone anything. I don't make decisions for friedman lol

All I'm saying is I like it because it's simple.
If they come up with the IRX-1000 with the kitchen sink in it that's fine.
But keep this one simple.

The ENGL analogy is exactly right. They put all the bells and whistles on a different unit.

 

[KingsXJJ]

It is simple, for you. Doesn’t have to be for me.

Why is that a problem for you? You want to eat your cake and deny me mine?

Even though we are eating different cake?

Are you incapable of seeing that your needs may not be others? If you are why TF would you argue against something that will have zero impact upon you?

This is like trying to explain something to someone who has made their mind made up and then shut their ears to others.

Logic and conversation will never open a closed mind. Enjoy your gear. I will too and provide feedback on how it might be better for me. You have absolutely no dog in this hunt. I’ve illustrated that consistently with zero impact.

What you missed in my analogy about Engl is that there is no need for different products if the difference is strictly software and editing for those that desire it. You clearly don’t. I clearly do. Cool!

This could be a win/win for everyone. I don’t think that’s your goal at all.

You want what you want… and you have it. But something’s definitely off if others get what they want and it’s different. Even if it has no impact upon you.

Right? Please, tell me where I’m wrong. Why can’t more users be happy and explain how that hurts. If more users are happy why that is a bad business model for Friedman? This is getting ridiculous. I think I understand why you cling to simplicity. It’s your comfort zone. Stay in it. I honestly no longer care.

 

[GuitarBilly74]

This is getting ridiculous.

Indeed.

 

[KingsXJJ]

Indeed.

I’m glad you have what you like. I apologize for having different, easily achievable preferences that are different from yours and don’t affect you.

How thoughtless of me. What was I even thinking?

 

[KingsXJJ]

Indeed.

 

[GuitarBilly74]

I’m glad you have what you like. I apologize for having different, easily achievable preferences that are different from yours and don’t affect you.

How thoughtless of me. What was I even thinking?

Yeah I'm not sure what are you even thinking. Good question.

Friedman is not a software company, Dave doesn't write code at all. He contracts out/pays for this part of the product and an "update" as massive as you're asking wouldn't "cost nothing" and certainly would have to be passed on to the customer to even make sense, either by creating a new, more expensive version or by increasing the cost of the existing units.

It's different than Fractal, UA Neural, Line 6, etc which are actual software companies and do this stuff in house.

Friedman is a tube amp, pedal and guitar company. And a small one at that. This product is a 2 channel preamp that has a little IR loader for DI, that's all. If you need full modeling flexibility there are tons of products out there for that.

You have to be a real entitled person to think he's going to hire someone to do all these pipe dream updates you want, then give them to you for free. FFS.

 

[Jarick]

I think this pedal is still doing what it should for the target audience. The only change I'd make is being able to switch off the high cut to get back to where it was before. It sounds great and is really easy to use.

 

[Jarick]

Is it confirmed the first version of the firmware didn't have that? When plugged direct to my amp, it didn't sound too dark, but it was still always smooth. Direct needed major treble boosts.

Yes, confirmed to me by Dave. I may have an older capture in my Cortex Cloud...that would be interesting. I might also have published a Kemper one too, can't remember.

I did send a follow up email to see if they could send an old firmware version, and put the suggestion to turn off the high cut in the settings in a future update. Lord knows Dave Friedman doesn't need me bugging him but doesn't hurt to ask.

 

[Jarick]

I remember the frequency response charts you posted. The DI sound was way too dark, but run direct to my amp, the presence control had plenty of range to brighten it up, althought it was always smooth, hard to get aggression.

IOW it didn't sound "wrong" when used as a preamp, I just didn't like the tone.

It did sound bright previously, so you'd turn the treble down. Now you have to crank the treble up. Depends on the amp I think. Last I tried it through the amp it does sound really good. Remember the real cabinet will start to cut the highs around 5k so you may not hear as much difference.

Here's a comparison video I made right after it was released with the Axe FX 3:

 

[JasonE]

I don't know which is which, but A sounds better to me on the cleans.

This is the problem with the whole concept. If the preamp is being tailored with digital EQ, that tells me the preamp doesn't have it's own sound. Its probably a simple tube preamp circuit without any filters, that they use digital EQ to give it a sound. Which is subject to whatever firmware they force onto it. Moving target.

I will keep an eye on what they do with the firmware, but I wouldn't be surprised if every version is the same circuit with different digital eq.

I am not sure there is anything digital in the Friedman IR pedals other than the IR. I haven't opened mine up to see what is in there but my understanding from what Dave has said, this is the actual preamp of the amp. It has the tubes and other components that are in the amp. The only question I have is in my pedal it has a bright and low, I think it is called thump, setting in the software. I am not sure if that is something digital before it hits the IR, or if it is a switch inside the unit that is actuated by the software.

 

[GuitarBilly74]

I don't know which is which, but A sounds better to me on the cleans.

This is the problem with the whole concept. If the preamp is being tailored with digital EQ, that tells me the preamp doesn't have it's own sound. Its probably a simple tube preamp circuit without any filters, that they use digital EQ to give it a sound. Which is subject to whatever firmware they force onto it. Moving target.

I will keep an eye on what they do with the firmware, but I wouldn't be surprised if every version is the same circuit with different digital eq.

The preamp is the same circuit found on the respective amps. This is very easy to verify if you know how to follow a circuit board, open it up and check it. I did it before I sold the DS mini.
It's the same gain structure and tone stack values on my IR-D and Dirty Shirley mini. The only difference I found is the IR-D had an additional 3 way bright switch, but that's present on the Twin Sister. I was going to add the bright switch to the DS, but I ended up selling the amp.
Obviously the layout is also different being a pedal vs the chassis, but the components are identical.
So no, it's not a generic preamp with digital EQ, the actual circuit is there. The digital part is the "power amp" and IR section.

 

[JasonE]

The preamp is the same circuit found on the respective amps. This is very easy to verify if you know how to follow a circuit board, open it up and check it. I did it before I sold the DS mini.
It's the same gain structure and tone stack values on my IR-D and Dirty Shirley mini. The only difference I found is the IR-D had an additional 3 way bright switch, but that's present on the Twin Sister. I was going to add the bright switch to the DS, but I ended up selling the amp.
Obviously the layout is also different being a pedal vs the chassis, but the components are identical.
So no, it's not a generic preamp with digital EQ, the actual circuit is there. The digital part is the "power amp" and IR section.

Is the 3 way switch actually in the IR-D, like a physical switch that is actuated by software? That is one thing I have been wondering about my IR-D. I wish it was on an external switch like my Twin Sister has.

 

[GuitarBilly74]

Is the 3 way switch actually in the IR-D, like a physical switch that is actuated by software? That is one thing I have been wondering about my IR-D. I wish it was on an external switch like my Twin Sister has.

The 3 way switches for gain structure and brightness are hardwired to actual components. The bright switch selects 3 different bright caps (100pf, 1kpf and 4.7kpf if I recall correctly). These are actual caps on the board. The structure switch turn tube gain stages on/off. They're not connected to the software at all.
The IR switch is connected to the software.

 

[Tanax]

Sky’s the limit in this digital realm. Act like it!

The IR units are analog though? So there are some very hard and real limits on what can be controlled with the software.