Fractal Talk

[SillyOctpuss]

I wanna do a cover of this song:


Ideas on things to try to get a guitary version of:

- The synthy pad sound at the start, with the filter sweep
- The glitchy voices (DD3 glitch mode?)
- The pulsing not-quite-303 baseline that open up the filter continually throughout the song; sounds like they've got chorus on them too.
- Synthy stabs that come in around 3minutes in - learn the notes, slap a flanger on it??

I figure the VP4 would be the first place to start. The song is obviously 9 minutes of droney stuff in B-major, and I play in drop-B. Lucky coincidence!

PS: They just don't make dance music like they used to!

Haven't heard this in ages.

 

[Orvillain]

Haven't heard this in ages.

Sort it out you soppy taaaaaaart!

 

[SillyOctpuss]

Sort it out you soppy taaaaaaart!

I've had the Second Toughest on while cleaning my house today.

 

[synthpenguin]

I'll give some of those ideas a go!

Messed around with the first idea with pretty neat results! I wasn't trying to copy that exact sound, but just going for a synth pad / brass sound. It won't directly work in the VP4 since it uses 7 blocks, but you could definitely adapt it depending on needs.

Quick audio demo just playing guitar into it. Sorry, some clipping when I start to play harder, but mainly just because it's the first time I actually recorded from the FM9 and I wasn't paying attention to levels lol (and should have cut more bass) ~


First part of the demo has the Drive block at 50% mix, and then turned up to max for a second, and then the last part has it disabled (explained further below)

Signal chain is like so ~

Drive > Pitch > Filter > Chorus > PEQ > Multitap > Comp

DRIVE
Mix: 50% (adjust to taste; see below)
Level: 4.0
Type: Master-Fuzz
Drive: 10.00
Tone: 5.00
Bass: 7.85
High Cut: 20kHz
Clip Type: Hard
Bias: 1.0

PITCH
Mix: 50%
Type: Dual Detune
Detune 1: +10.2ct
Detune 2: -9.1ct

FILTER:
Level: -6 dB (turn down further if getting clipping)
Type: Low-Pass
Order: 4th
Frequency: 20Hz
Q: 0.335

FILTER FREQUENCY MODIFIER
Source 1: Envelope Follower
Attack: 93ms
Release: 500ms
Start: 0%
Mid: 70%
Slope: 50%
Scale: 1.0

CHORUS
Type: Dimension 2
Mix: 50%

PEQ
Frequency 1: 260Hz
Gain 1: -10 dB (this may need to be much lower!)

MULTITAP
Mix; 50%
Type: Shadows Taps
All feedbacks set 70 to 85%
Filters all the way open

COMP
Type: Optical Compressor
Threshold: -46 dB
Level: -6 dB (again, might need to be lower depending on your setup)

Some notes ~

On the modifier for the Filter Frequency, change the Mid control depending on your guitar's output. Change the Min control to open the filter. Change the Attack and Release like you would a synth's filter envelope.

On the Filter itself, the Q plays a big part. Lower it for softer sounds and raise it for more air. Also, a higher Q combined with a faster attack and release on the filter frequency modifier will get you closer to those stab-y sounds.

On the Drive block, change the Mix level to get a softer or harsher sound (more harmonics). At 100%, it is pretty square-wave-y, but doesn't sound great with a lot of chords, especially tighter voicings. 0% sounds a little less synth-y, but still works and is very smooth.

For the Chorus, I just did a Dimension style chorus at default settings. I tried the "map rate to the pitch follower" thing, and it works well for single notes, but does not work for chords, so I left it off.

I just left the Compressor mostly at defaults for that type for some basic control of the sound, but you can definitely go for more extreme, limiter-like settings for increased sustain. You'll probably want to cut more low-end with the PEQ first though. The high feedback multitap delay before the compressor helps with sustain too.

And in general, I'd say to keep your playing dynamics really even to get the effect across. You may also have to mess with your guitar volume.

So yeah, idk nothing amazing but I think it sounds cool, and is a good start! Good luck!

 

[Orvillain]

Messed around with the first idea with pretty neat results! I wasn't trying to copy that exact sound, but just going for a synth pad / brass sound. It won't directly work in the VP4 since it uses 7 blocks, but you could definitely adapt it depending on needs.

Quick audio demo just playing guitar into it. Sorry, some clipping when I start to play harder, but mainly just because it's the first time I actually recorded from the FM9 and I wasn't paying attention to levels lol (and should have cut more bass) ~


First part of the demo has the Drive block at 50% mix, and then turned up to max for a second, and then the last part has it disabled (explained further below)

Signal chain is like so ~

Drive > Pitch > Filter > Chorus > PEQ > Multitap > Comp

DRIVE
Mix: 50% (adjust to taste; see below)
Level: 4.0
Type: Master-Fuzz
Drive: 10.00
Tone: 5.00
Bass: 7.85
High Cut: 20kHz
Clip Type: Hard
Bias: 1.0

PITCH
Mix: 50%
Type: Dual Detune
Detune 1: +10.2ct
Detune 2: -9.1ct

FILTER:
Level: -6 dB (turn down further if getting clipping)
Type: Low-Pass
Order: 4th
Frequency: 20Hz
Q: 0.335

FILTER FREQUENCY MODIFIER
Source 1: Envelope Follower
Attack: 93ms
Release: 500ms
Start: 0%
Mid: 70%
Slope: 50%
Scale: 1.0

CHORUS
Type: Dimension 2
Mix: 50%

PEQ
Frequency 1: 260Hz
Gain 1: -10 dB (this may need to be much lower!)

MULTITAP
Mix; 50%
Type: Shadows Taps
All feedbacks set 70 to 85%
Filters all the way open

COMP
Type: Optical Compressor
Threshold: -46 dB
Level: -6 dB (again, might need to be lower depending on your setup)

Some notes ~

On the modifier for the Filter Frequency, change the Mid control depending on your guitar's output. Change the Min control to open the filter. Change the Attack and Release like you would a synth's filter envelope.

On the Filter itself, the Q plays a big part. Lower it for softer sounds and raise it for more air. Also, a higher Q combined with a faster attack and release on the filter frequency modifier will get you closer to those stab-y sounds.

On the Drive block, change the Mix level to get a softer or harsher sound (more harmonics). At 100%, it is pretty square-wave-y, but doesn't sound great with a lot of chords, especially tighter voicings. 0% sounds a little less synth-y, but still works and is very smooth.

For the Chorus, I just did a Dimension style chorus at default settings. I tried the "map rate to the pitch follower" thing, and it works well for single notes, but does not work for chords, so I left it off.

I just left the Compressor mostly at defaults for that type for some basic control of the sound, but you can definitely go for more extreme, limiter-like settings for increased sustain. You'll probably want to cut more low-end with the PEQ first though. The high feedback multitap delay before the compressor helps with sustain too.

And in general, I'd say to keep your playing dynamics really even to get the effect across. You may also have to mess with your guitar volume.

So yeah, idk nothing amazing but I think it sounds cool, and is a good start! Good luck!

That's fucking proper ace is that!!

I have the Axe III as well, so can experiment with similar stuff.

 

[BROCKSTAR]

I need a FC-6 again or FC-12. I need to start saving if i can! I need some controls on the floor to do some things sometimes.

 

[synthpenguin]

That's fucking proper ace is that!!

I have the Axe III as well, so can experiment with similar stuff.

I hope it works for you!

 

[DrewJD82]

At some point I need to sit down and school myself on synth-related stuff. I have a basic grasp on LFO’s, ADSR’s and whatnot, but to be able to open that synth block and get what I want out of it rather than randomly turning knobs to see what happens will take some edumacation.

 

[BROCKSTAR]

At some point I need to sit down and school myself on synth-related stuff. I have a basic grasp on LFO’s, ADSR’s and whatnot, but to be able to open that synth block and get what I want out of it rather than randomly turning knobs to see what happens will take some edumacation.

Randomly turning knobs is half the fun

 

[JiveTurkey]

They synth block in the FAS stuff is killer. Especially when coupled with the effects quality you have. Ooof.

 

[DrewJD82]

Randomly turning knobs is half the fun

For sure, I’ve definitely made a lot of song intros with VST’s as a result of that, but I’d love to be able to think “Man, I wonder if I can recreate the synths in “Shine On You Crazy Diamond” and then actually pull it off.

 

[yek]

Messed around with the first idea with pretty neat results! I wasn't trying to copy that exact sound, but just going for a synth pad / brass sound. It won't directly work in the VP4 since it uses 7 blocks, but you could definitely adapt it depending on needs.

Very cool

 

[synthpenguin]

At some point I need to sit down and school myself on synth-related stuff. I have a basic grasp on LFO’s, ADSR’s and whatnot, but to be able to open that synth block and get what I want out of it rather than randomly turning knobs to see what happens will take some edumacation.

Check out this guy's videos:


[EDIT: this preview shows the first video in the playlist, which is currently one where he's recreating a patch he actually programmed. That's interesting, but I think the ones where he tries to recreate sounds by ear are more useful, so I'd skim through the playlist looking for that :) ]

He's got the credentials ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Marinelli ), but past that he has a cool approach that's built around teaching you how to hear a synth sound and pull it apart into its elements to recreate it.

He also has a "think like a synth" course that goes into this in detail, and includes a VST to follow along with, though I don't have any experience with this. It's probably good though if you're interested in that sort of structured approach ~

 

[JiveTurkey]

Check out this guy's videos:


[EDIT: this preview shows the first video in the playlist, which is currently one where he's recreating a patch he actually programmed. That's interesting, but I think the ones where he tries to recreate sounds by ear are more useful, so I'd skim through the playlist looking for that :) ]

He's got the credentials ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Marinelli ), but past that he has a cool approach that's built around teaching you how to hear a synth sound and pull it apart into its elements to recreate it.

He also has a "think like a synth" course that goes into this in detail, and includes a VST to follow along with, though I don't have any experience with this. It's probably good though if you're interested in that sort of structured approach ~

This guy has some in depth videos. IIRC; he did a really neat one with Tim Pierce and guitar synths.

 

[synthpenguin]

This guy has some in depth videos. IIRC; he did a really neat one with Tim Pierce and guitar synths.

He did!

 

[Orvillain]

@synthpenguin I listened to your clip again on monitors - phenominal! Man I love Fractal for this kind of shit - and actually that distorted bit was epic!

 

[synthpenguin]

@synthpenguin I listened to your clip again on monitors - phenominal! Man I love Fractal for this kind of shit - and actually that distorted bit was epic!

Yeah, and the modifiers thing, and all the scaling and curve options they have, really takes this sort of patch to the next level too, or at least makes it easier. Much better to deal with than most guitar-centric envelope filters.

This also makes me want to get an envelope follower module for my little eurorack setup... actually, wait, I think I can use Maths to do that! Might be time for some guitar > Moog and SEM filter magic later haha

 

[synthpenguin]

Anyone experimented with getting a Belton Brick reverb type sound in Fractal? I feel like it SHOULD be pretty easy to do with one of the delays and some comb filtering (maybe the Quad-Series Delay type in the Multitap block), but I haven't given it a shot yet.

 

[yek]

Belton Brick are (emulated) spring reverbs. And FAS has modeled various kinds.

 

[synthpenguin]

Belton Brick are (emulated) spring reverbs. And FAS has modeled various kinds.

The Fractal spring reverbs are great, but sometimes I want "bad" spring reverbs too haha. But yeah, Belton Brick reverbs really have their own sound, especially when pushed (ETA: and especially ones that self-oscillate). You can only kind of get there with the spring reverbs by lowering the drip etc, though maybe there's a way to get even closer with that approach!